From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #169 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Thur, 15 March 2001 Vol 08 : Num 169 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: WTF/ITF rules the_dojang: USA Tekno Contest the_dojang: Dean of the KukKiWon Academy the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #168 the_dojang: what Dan? Re: the_dojang: Dean of the KukKiWon Academy the_dojang: RE: Koreans in Chicago the_dojang: RE: Master Lee the_dojang: Re: Home Rules the_dojang: RE:Sword Seminar the_dojang: RE: 800 GM-s ?? Re: the_dojang: Re: Home Rules Re: the_dojang: RE: 800 GM-s ?? the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #167 the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #168 the_dojang: KATU reason the_dojang: lack of control the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1111 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Piotr Bernat Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 08:17:56 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: WTF/ITF rules > I see were you might think that but if you have been to ITF matches you > have seen that there are more kicks than punches thrown, and a greater > varity of kicks in ITF matches. Well... not always. Actually, the Polish ITF national team is rated number one in Europe. I saw many of their matches and there were some impressive ones, as well as some "hands + dollyo only" ;) But again, it`s the same situation with WTF matches. Some extremely boring and some very impressive. To be honest, I enjoy both systems of sparring. My students fight in both of them, plus some more, I did ITF for a couple of years. But I feel both systems have their merits and I for one wouldn`t like head punches introduced into the WTF sparring. > Personaly I don't buy the "full contact" stuff I have been been hit just > as hard and harder in ITF matches than in WTF matches, and I have knocked > people out just fine with kicks to the head. Does it mean that ITF tournaments became full contact? From what I remember, there were always penalty points for excessive contact, plus you got disqualified if you KOed your opponent. Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: Gregg London Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 08:37:09 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: USA Tekno Contest Good Morning Group, Well - March Madness is here! No, not the NCAA, but the USTU. That's right - very soon the USTU will host the "fight-offs" for the World Cup Team - and you have a chance to WIN! Hey you're already entered in numerous Office "pools" right? So how about a little Taekwondo handicapping. Surf on over to: http://www.ladytkd.com/tekno/contest.html and predict who our U.S. Team will be. First two correct entries win $50 Gift Certificates from Tekno (if it's not Tekno it's not Taekwondo) and runners-up get T-Shirts. Such a deal! Good Luck, Gregg - -- Gregg London Digital Engineer http://www.glondon.com ------------------------------ From: "hackworth" Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:18:42 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Dean of the KukKiWon Academy I received a phone call last night from GM Ho Jae Kim, Dean of the KukKiWon Academy. He is now working for Taekwon Network in Korea and hopes that everyone will check it out. There is a link to it at www.usnta.net He will be conducting a Taekwondo Instructors Course in the US sometime in June. For more details keep reading DD. ------------------------------ From: "hackworth" Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:28:19 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #168 Ray Terry wrote: "There are only(?) about 800 Korean 8th and 9th Dans worldwide." If you look through the martial arts ads in the Florida Yellow Pages you will find that all 800 of them live right here in Sunny Floriday. Recently a few Taekwondo and Hapkido 10th Dans moved here as well. Pil Seung Richard Hackworth http://ma_success.tripod.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 8:13:06 PST Subject: the_dojang: what Dan? > Ray Terry wrote: "There are only(?) about 800 Korean 8th and 9th Dans > worldwide." > > If you look through the martial arts ads in the Florida Yellow Pages you > will find that all 800 of them live right here in Sunny Floriday. Recently a > few Taekwondo and Hapkido 10th Dans moved here as well. Pil Seung What I notice many are doing these days are claiming e.g. "9th Dan. Kukkiwon certified." Which usually means they are, oh say, 4th Dan Kukkiwon, but 9th Dan eBay. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 8:19:38 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Dean of the KukKiWon Academy > I received a phone call last night from GM Ho Jae Kim, Dean of the KukKiWon > Academy. Can you explain what this Kukkiwon Academy is? I visited the International Academy, office of the VP, in the Kukkiwon a couple of years ago, but never heard of a Kukkiwon Academy. Is it perhaps the same as the Kukkiwon's International Academy? Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:21:38 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Koreans in Chicago Dear McD: "...if you go down Lawrence Ave around the 2000 block, stop by Ms. Kims restaurant. Makes a great Kimchee soup.." I would be very surprised if you could walk down Lawrence and not run into any place that DOESN'T sell Korean fare. During the summer the authorities close off the street and there is a great festival for the entire Korean community. Last summer our Kumdo students put on quite a demo. Fool that I was, of course, I was in my bare feet. Summer sun, bare feet, asphalt paving-- What's wrong with this picture? A great time was had by all. BTW: Does anyone know if there is truth to the rumor that Chicago is the 3rd largest Korean community in the US? Best Wishes, Bruce W Sims www.midwesthapkido.com ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:27:04 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Master Lee "...Ill keep in touch.." Thanks, Mark, Please do. Master Lee is a true asset not only to Chicago MA but to all Hapkido practitioners. I think everyone can appreciate his attitude towards a lot of the political in-fighting. I think it would be a real shame to lose the benefit of his experience and expertise, though. Does he ever do anything outside of his school by way of seminar or demo-s? BTW: Welcome back to Chi-town. Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: SallyBaughn@aol.com Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:36:10 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: Home Rules I've only seen these rules a few times -- in all cases, they were in dojangs run by "old" masters; i.e., more traditional-style training (although two DID do Olympic-style sparring), more emphasis on the discipline/art, and the masters' (all of whom were born in Korea) ranks were from pre-Kukkiwon days. Sally SallyBaughn@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:39:42 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE:Sword Seminar Dear Rudy: ".... Hope that does not change your mind about visiting..." Not at all. What I don't know about KSW sword would sink a small ship so this would be a great time to compare a lot of things. I hope you will keep me posted. I am continually surprised at the number of folks who contact me with questions about Korean sword. Most of the sentiments are not necessarily to know about what I practice as such but rather wanting to get some general info by which to make intelligent choices about when and where to train. With the introduction of the World Kumdo Assn in the US, and the many seminars for Shinkendo, Hai Dong Kumdo as well as Tai Chi sword I think people are getting a bit turned-around. We could use a few more venues where folks could just come and talk biomechanics without feeling like they are being recruited to a particular art or style (or maybe being dis-loyal to their own art). In a funny sort of way, it's a bit like what I would hope for we Hapkido people. I would have said TKD people as well, but judging from the recent exchanges things maybe things are becoming almost pleasant between the ITF and WTF. Hope springs eternal. Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:54:09 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE: 800 GM-s ?? Dear Ray: "...There are only(?) about 800 Korean 8th and 9th Dans worldwide...". Is that a legit number? By that I mean is the number "800" an accurate census of all existing 8th and 9th degrees of all Korean arts, or an approximation based on approximations of various Korean arts? I don't suppose there is any actual clearinghouse for checking the ranks of various folks.(For instance: Richard, does the KHA have someone who can be contacted officially if a person wants to check the credentials of a KHA member?) Still its pretty easy to see how people get confused about the various ranks people present. I would be very curious to know which if any of those 8th and 9th dans are supported by technical prowess and which are the organizational recognition that Richard mentioned in his post. Does anyone know if the Kidohae, Korea Hapkido, Korean Hapkido, etc., make their rosters available to inquiry. It doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to seek out certification from an organization unless one can then maintain a standing with that organization that others could verify, right? Even as I close this off I feel like I need to tip-toe a bit. This whole rank thing has so much energy associated with it. Best Wishes, Bruce W Sims www.midwesthapkido.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:02:29 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Re: Home Rules > I've only seen these rules a few times -- in all cases, they were in dojangs > run by "old" masters; i.e., more traditional-style training (although two DID > do Olympic-style sparring), more emphasis on the discipline/art, and the > masters' (all of whom were born in Korea) ranks were from pre-Kukkiwon days. My experience is just the opposite. :) As someone agreed, they must come from EFC et al. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:05:38 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: RE: 800 GM-s ?? > "...There are only(?) about 800 Korean 8th and 9th Dans worldwide...". > Is that a legit number? By that I mean is the number "800" an accurate > census of all existing 8th and 9th degrees of all Korean arts, or an All Korean arts?!?! Heavens no. Just Korean Kukkiwons. All 8th/9th Dan Kukkiwons number around 1000, worldwide. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: ConcordTKD@aol.com Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 13:42:04 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #167 Personaly I don't buy the "full contact" stuff I have been been hit just > as hard and harder in ITF matches than in WTF matches At elite level matches? Then the ITF must be full contact. Else, you ITF guys have exceptionally poor control... Not at all. We just play hard. John Murphy A-3-756 ITF/USTF TKD ------------------------------ From: ConcordTKD@aol.com Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 13:46:22 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #168 When the Major General asked KS Hwang to form the KATU as competition for the USTF there was a split (this from higher ranked ITFers that were also unhappy with Chuck Sereff). Glad to hear things have improved since then. That was not the reason for KATU being formed. John Murphy A-3-756 ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:38:19 PST Subject: the_dojang: KATU reason >> When the Major General asked KS Hwang to form the KATU as competition for >> the USTF there was a split (this from higher ranked ITFers that were also >> unhappy with Chuck Sereff). Glad to hear things have improved since then. > > That was not the reason for KATU being formed. You might want to check further on the that one... Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:38:58 PST Subject: the_dojang: lack of control >> At elite level matches? Then the ITF must be full contact. Else, you ITF >> guys have exceptionally poor control... > > Not at all. We just play hard. Ok, sure. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:40:02 PST Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #169 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. 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