From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #176 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Sat, 17 March 2001 Vol 08 : Num 176 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: usnta site the_dojang: Re: KHF the_dojang: Re:Open up... let us in the_dojang: KHF Requirements Re: the_dojang: KHF Requirements the_dojang: Dr. Kimm's website the_dojang: (no subject) the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1111 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Frank Clay" Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 12:17:25 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: usnta site As per Lee, Yong Woo's, member of the Kukkiwon high dan promotions committee, instructions we issue both USNTA certification and Kukkiwon certification. Hope this helps, Sally. However, if it does not, please feel free to contact me privately, and I'll be more than happy to assist you further. Frank Clay USNTA Membership Chairman Welcome to visit Shaolin Disciple's Site at http://shaolintemple.yeah.net ____________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE Web and POP E-mail Service in 14 languages at http://www.zzn.com. ------------------------------ From: "Frank Clay" Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 12:22:43 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: KHF Steve Seo wrote: <> What kwans would they be? I have never ever heard any KHF Representative discuss anything other than Hapkido. For example Dae ung Yoon is more than happy to talk about Jinjungkwan, Yong Ki Song is more than happy to talk about Hanmukwan, etc... these are hapkido kwans, not some other style. I think confusion may come in when different arts have similar names, for example jung do kwan, and chung do kwan. Both are related, both are Taekwondo, but both are different training systems headed by different individuals. If you know of any other art the Korea Hapkido Federation, issues rank in, i'd sure love to know what is is. My dan certificate only indicates Hapkido. Frank Clay Welcome to visit Shaolin Disciple's Site at http://shaolintemple.yeah.net ____________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE Web and POP E-mail Service in 14 languages at http://www.zzn.com. ------------------------------ From: "Bruce Sims" Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 11:36:26 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re:Open up... let us in Dear Jack: "...Can anybody out in Listland explain the differences between the different Hapkido organizations and also the heads of those Organizations , also when they were established?...." I'm with you, buddy! You know I have been praticing Hapkido for 16 years and in 16 years I have yet for anybody get this stuff explained to me in clear and concise English. I am honestly beginning to wonder if the Koreans themselves have any idea about what the straight dope is on all these organizations, and leaders and relationships are! I suppose one part of me would side with a recent post by Patrick in which he reports that he aschews any involvement with any organization at all. Thats fine except that then communication breaks down and questions don't get asked or answered. Who knows maybe thats the way these organizations like it. I would like to know when the powers=that=be will cut the crap and come up front.( I dont' care how you do it.) How about make it a matrix and just fill in the blanks. Name the organization, name the head poobah, name the board members, give a location (address) that will actually answer questions and provide information, identify affiliated schools and or members. I was member of the WHF from 1990 to 1998 and other than identifying GM Myung and a couple of local member schools I never knew who the other members were. Why does this all have to be such a big secret!?! Would you like to hear how it sounds to a practitioner with 16 years experience? Try this. "What organization do you belong to?" " The Blah Blah Bloh Federation" " Oh yes, the Blah Blah Blah Association; the one run by Master O H Lee." " No its the Blah Blah Bloh Federation headed by GM L H Oh." "Didn't that used to be the Blah Blah Bloh Association?" "No, your thinking of the Dae Han Blah Bloh Blah Association." You get the point. Now will you please get a clue? How do the leaders of these organizations ever expect a member to make inteeligent decisions about affiliations, support and membership without clear and concise information? I will tell you something that I suspect is coming. Somebody is going to offer membership in an organization that is run in the same manner every other organization in the US is run, with by-laws, a board, an identified network of support and a defined membership. I'm going to bet that when that happens 2 things are going to result. 1.)Pratitioners will join in droves because they are actually getting a bang for their membership buck, and 2.) it won't matter a diddley what a person with a Korean surname from any other oganization rattles off the top of his head. Before I get off my soapbox let me say one thing to the listkas reading this. I don't know from beans about a lot of the personalities who contribute to this Net. I don't know what they have done good or bad. I don't know what they have to offer or what their stories are. The operative words here are " I Don't Know...". And I want to know. I DO know that attitudes, challenges, and name-calling just shuts down communication so while someone feels pretty good getting a dig in somewhere,the guy who gets dug-at decides he doesnt need this s*** and shuts up. Then the rest of us suffer because we don't get the information we are looking for. Please check yourself, 'kay? Best Wishes, Bruce W Sims www.midwesthapkido.com ------------------------------ From: "hackworth" Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 14:04:46 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: KHF Requirements I can appreciate the attempt to post a set of KHF rank requirements. I won't discuss the one posted on DD but there were a few things missing. The KHF produced a manual that covers white belt to 2nd dan requirements. Every KHF master should have one handy. They were given out free at the KHF headquarters in Seoul. Yes, you can see mine the next time you are in Orlando. Richard Hackworth www.nationalhapkido.net Which is it? Hapkido or 31 martial arts? Make up your mind. Steve wrote: "it was just my own curiosity regarding the perception of Hapkido organizations people have on this list. Regarding the question of comparing apples to apples in terms of Hapkido organizations, its a very difficult question that points at the heart of what the term Hapkido means..... In terms of the Kidohae, the majority of our members (meaning more than 50%) train in some sort of Hapkido Kwan....." So only 1/2 of your membership from the 31 styles is Hapkido? The Baskin Robbins of martial arts has 31 styles but 1/2 of them are Hapkido. Thanks for clearing that up. "If I'm not mistaken, the KHF has a large percetage of Hapkido members as well, but I know that they do certify members of different kwans of Korean martial arts." If you are not mistaken? ...but You know that they do certify members of different kwans of Korean martial arts? What KHF certificate has been issued for something other than Hapkido? What would the value of a Taekwondo certificate or any other art be from a Hapkido organization? "Most of what I know about the KHF comes from Chairman Seo and Master Scott Seo who now runs a school in Seoul...... Chairman Seo meets with KHF chairman Oh Se Lim regularly and has a cordial and repectfful relationship with him so I'm pretty confident in my information. Am I mistaken?.... " I am glad that you have second hand information but I personally speak with various KHF officials and have never heard or seen anyone get anything from the KHF that was not for Hapkido. It is pleasant to know that Chairman Seo pays cordial and respectful visits to KHF President Oh Se Lim or has regular meetings or whatever. What is the purpose? To re-unite Hapkido under GM Ji? I have heard it mentioned. As I said in an earlier post, many dojangs in Korea have started hanging GM Ji's photo at the head of the room. Steve, please wait until you have info before you make postings. Your responses always raise more questions than they answer. Congratulations to Master Scott for having opened a school in Seoul. It takes a very special commitment to your art to become a full time professional instructor. Kudos. Richard Hackworth http://ma_success.tripod.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 12:03:18 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: KHF Requirements > I can appreciate the attempt to post a set of KHF rank requirements. I won't > discuss the one posted on DD but there were a few things missing. The KHF > produced a manual that covers white belt to 2nd dan requirements. Every KHF > master should have one handy. They were given out free at the KHF > headquarters in Seoul. Yes, you can see mine the next time you are in > Orlando. Supposedly that is where that translation came from. My recollection is that the KHF published new(?) reqs back in 1997 (early 98?) and that post was an attempt to translate the KHF manual into English back then. It came from when Master Holcombe Thomas was still living, working for the US Consulate, and teaching HKD in the Pusan area. As he mentioned, any errors in the translation were his. Comments? Ray "Sin Moo, not KHF" Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: "hackworth" Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 14:45:18 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Dr. Kimm's website Jere Hilland wrote: "I found this at http://www.hanmudo.com, it states: "Welcome to the future home on the Web of Dr. He-Young Kimm and The World Han Mu Do Association." Thanks for the info. I think that has been under construction for more than a year now. I did like your website at www.geocities.com/hapkiyukwonsul . Great picture of BulGokSa Temple. My wife and I had wedding photos done there. Richard Hackworth www.nationalhapkido.net ------------------------------ From: Beungood@aol.com Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 15:46:42 EST Subject: the_dojang: (no subject) Hackworth the betrayer? I received several e-mails from DD members and I will answer them here. Yes, I studied KukSoolWon in Korea. NO, I did not betray the organization and jump on the KHF band wagon. I was reasigned to an area where there was not a KukSoolWon school. I did not return to KukSoolWon after that because I was able to stay in KHF schools during my other duty assignments. Did I like the KukSoolWon training? Yes, the training was great. I did not care much for the behavior of the Instructor outside of class>> Dr Hackworth , What type of duty assignment did you perform in Korea? Jacko ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 18:29:28 PST Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #176 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. 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