From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #222 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Sat, 7 April 2001 Vol 08 : Num 222 In this issue: the_dojang: kkw's and the USTU the_dojang: Re: Vegas Schools the_dojang: the_dojang: Testing and lesson fees: The Universal Language the_dojang: BB Testing Fees and teachers the_dojang: Arkansas Legislature Introduces Bill to Regulate the_dojang: Major Gen. Choi the_dojang: Korea's Native Sword Form the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1111 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tkdtiger@aol.com Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 00:02:00 EDT Subject: the_dojang: kkw's and the USTU In a message dated 4/6/2001 10:13:37 PM Central Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: > You need a KKW 1st Dan to compete in national and international USTU > tournaments." > > David N. Beck Internet:dbeck@usa.alcatel.com > > Could you forward that requirement to me or post in on the net? > > John Murphy > A-3-756 ITF/USTF TKD You do not need a kukkiwon to do anything in the USTU except get a license - and that is changing next year I am told. Competitors, coaches, referees need only a school cert or a kkw to prove rank - but it does not have to be a kkw - if u have one that is considered to be documentation of rank To compete in WTF international events - u do need a kkw. ------------------------------ From: MissIllona@aol.com Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 00:43:06 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Vegas Schools In a message dated 4/6/2001 8:13:53 PM Pacific Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << ... 4 years ago it was booming out there as far as karate schools ... went back there last year and 3/4 of them are gone !" So it sounds like the bariers to entry worked then. The owners of the big schools will be the ones that make out on this deal. In the end the small guy who cares will not be able to set up a school and the parent will be paying much higher prices, and spending more time travling to the few schools that are left, to put thier kids into larger classes so they can get less attention. What a concept. >> Well, I looked around and a lot of the big schools that had anywhere from 4 to 7 locations are not there anymore. A couple organizations had 2 ... so I went around to look at them. They are located in big shopping centers ... very small, narrow schools ... and I mean small ! I've been in bigger closests ! LOL ... but seriously ... I sat and listened to the instructor try to sell a $10 mouthpiece to some parents ... new uniforms for sparring in a tournament ... then watched him teach 2 students in the back area (with a big window so we could watch) but the instructor spent much of his time looking out at us and coming out and trying to sell other merchandise and leaving the 2 kids in there by themselves to work on their sparring skills. Wasn't impressed. Very commercial. The other schools were small, too ... spaced far from each other. I guess the rent up there is big ... and with all the checks and licensing you have to do constantly ... that could be very expensive in the end ... so the small schools up there were really big schools scaled down, I bet. Illona ------------------------------ From: "Rudy Timmerman" Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2001 05:55:01 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Bruce writes: > So for more than 35 years we have been practicing Hapkido and we still > don't have a consistent, unified curriculum. Wouldn't that be growth---if > we were all singing off the same page? Hi Bruce. Since Ray nicely explained some of the same feelings I have on the subject of evolution, I may just add a tiny bit more. I too am not sure that all of us singing off the same page would help us grow. In fact, I'd hate to see a world where everything is as one. I love the varied cultures and scenery that is out there. I imagine I feel the same way about martial arts. I love meeting and discussing the various techniques and methods each has to offer, and it would be a pretty one sided discussion if we were all on the same page. In any case, it has only been thirty-five years -- what's the hurry? As far as Masters getting together. I heard that a number of Masters did just that at JR's last seminar. Are you just hoping to get the Korean Masters together? If so, I would not hold my breath. Sincerely, Rudy National Korean Martial Arts Association. BTW, I can't wait to attend Master West's seminar in WI. I'm really going to enjoy swapping stories and learning more about the arts, and I'm glad it is not going to be the same old same old I've been doing for fifty years. ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 05:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Testing and lesson fees: The Universal Language I was waiting for the thread on belt and testing fess to die down but it has expanded into a huge topic. While ruminating on my recent trip to Asia, I also discussed fees, lesson costs and so forth with various instructors. I learned that it is a universal language. Part of my conversations follow and you will quickly assimilate the point I am trying to make: While in Hong Kong, I recall this brief conversation: <"Wo xu yao ni de bang zhu", I asked ? He responded, "Shi de wo neng wei ni zuo she me" I went on to ask how much would he charge me for lessons and I heard he was a great Master. Unfortunately, he responded "Dui bu qi da cuo le." But I was certain I had the right guy. Did I insult him by discussing fees so quickly ? Part II. When in Cebu,Philippines, I used a toned down approach. My dialogue with Diego went along the following lines: "Pare, Pila may pangayo nimo sa Klase ?", I asked. Diego responded, "Nganong maguol man ka. Sa bayad, ang importante ang imong ma kat-uonan ?" My response "Bitaw sir, kay na lug-da na ako." Conclusion: As you can see above, discussing fees is universal. However, the response you receive may be somewhat different. I am brushing up on Korean. A visit to Korea may emerge in the near future. Similar fee questions may be asked. McD... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: "jere-hilland" Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 10:15:28 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: BB Testing Fees and teachers First let me say that my hapkido 5th dan fee through the USKMAF (signed by Master West) was less than my 1st dan fee (through another major organization). This is one of the many reasons why I am a member of the USKMAF. I will not pay yearly organizational dues individually or for the dojang and it is nice to have an organization that does not require you as an instructor to add hidden costs to students. I have never seen an instructor tell their new black belt that they have to pay additional membership fees to an organization without an apology. I have two types of black belts. Those who teach and those that do not. Those that do, I give them the embroidered belt as a personal gift. I have in the past, asked them to only pay the fee of the organization. When I teach an advanced technique, I enjoy giving credit to the proper person. I will tell the students that I learned this technique from my teacher Master West, or from a friend such as Master Booth or Master Whalen. I have even been known to say that I learned this or that technique from Master Booth in a hotel parking lot at 10 pm in Korea. Jere R. Hilland www.geocities.com/hapkiyukwonsul ------------------------------ From: "Miguel" Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 10:23:58 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Arkansas Legislature Introduces Bill to Regulate In addition to Georgia and California, there is also Arkansas. http://www.martialinfo.com/napma/newsletters/main.asp?id=23#Arkansas Legislature Introduces Bill to Regulate Martial Arts Instructors Other link for bill HB2606 http://www.arkleg.state.ar.us/2001/scripts/ablr/bills/bills.asp? Miguel Garcia's Tae Kwon Do www.garciatkd.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2001 9:15:30 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Major Gen. Choi Just a pointer to an online copy of Major Gen. HH Choi's interview in Jan 2000. http://www.geocities.com/tkd_unknown/index.html Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2001 9:23:26 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Korea's Native Sword Form Well done... http://www.warrior-scholar.com/web_pages/sage-education/ponkuk/ponkuk.htm Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2001 9:36:47 PDT Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #222 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.