From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #379 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 4 July 2001 Vol 08 : Num 379 In this issue: the_dojang: In L.A. for a couple days the_dojang: 10 ways Forms practising the_dojang: musical forms. the_dojang: Re: Open Tournaments the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #372 the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #372 the_dojang: Re: Musical forms the_dojang: Re: Musical forms again the_dojang: Forms/McDojangs the_dojang: Reason for taking MA the_dojang: Hapkido Seminars Re: the_dojang: 10 ways Forms practising the_dojang: Jackson? ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1111 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ABurrese@aol.com Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 11:22:19 EDT Subject: the_dojang: In L.A. for a couple days Hey all, I will be in the L.A. area from July 29th to August 6th for some business and some personal. I may have a couple of these days free if someone is interested in hosting a short seminar or class on joint locks or related topics. Cost will be low, since my trip down there has already been taken care of. Or if someone just wants to meet, I would be up for that too if it fits the schedule. Contact me privately. Alain Burrese http://members.aol.com/aburrese/ ------------------------------ From: "GARCIA ROS, David" Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 17:44:19 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: 10 ways Forms practising This is my first message. Sorry for writing mistakes. I live in Spain, I am 25 years old, I practice TKD (WTF) since I was ten, I am 3? DAN and I have been teaching Taekwondo for 4 years. I have read many messages about directional Forms, blind Forms, and so on, and I would like to resume all the ways I can remember to improve your forms avoiding boredom. 1.- Ejecute. 2.- Change direction. 3.- In your head (almost without moving) 4.- Dancing-like (without strenght) 5.- With music (coordinate movements at the same time) 6.- Blind (?Be careful! with your equilibrium) 7.- Practical way (Fighting pretense with some of your partners). This is a very powerful tool to understand completely a Poomse, Tul, or any kind. 8.- Concentration. It is difficult to explain, I only can say do ALL the movements like "Are Gechyo Maki" (double defence down) in 6th Pumse, or "Tong Milgui Chumbi" in Koryo, or "Bochumok chumbi" in 7th Pumse, and so on.... Breath slowly during each movement, and have strenght from the begining to the end of each technique. 9.- Breaking way. (It is very common in some exhibitions) 10.- Interpret the meaning of the Form. For example: Kumgang means "hardness, diamond". Practice your Form with that sense in your mind. ------------------------------ From: Neal Konecky Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 08:48:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: musical forms. My feelings about musical forms range from entertained to extremely negative. It all depends upon the purpose. If it is viewed as demonstration to show the practitioners physical ability, a well performed musical form is extremely entertaining to watch. In fact, I watch Jean Frenette with great envy. However, this demonstration should not be confused with actual forms. Actual forms started life as way to transfer information fram a more experienced warrior to a less experienced. Contained within the forms is vital information about different techniques used to incapacitate or kill an opponent. This includes a roadmap of the human anatomy including vital points. A musical form does not improve the understanding of the martial aspects of the form. Neal Konecky ===== "Our government, conceived in freedom and purchased with blood, can be preserved only by constant vigilance" William Jennings Bryan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: MissIllona@aol.com Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 12:25:46 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Open Tournaments In a message dated 7/4/2001 7:50:21 AM Pacific Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << You should hear them scream when you give em a score that reflects their ability rather than their screaming Kihaps (or glitter covered neon doboks), usually their parents join in on the fun for good measure. >> LOL ! Which is why I don't judge at those "events" ... so called tournaments anymore. The parents run the show more than the judges/officials and the one who put on the tournament doesn't want to step on the parent's toes because they are the ones with the wallets. If you get my drift. Illona ------------------------------ From: FGS & KVF Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 10:51:06 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #372 > Well, MK, since I am usually standing next to you sweating like a "pet" > turkey on Thanksgiving morning, I must concur. If you are not sweating in a > "traditional MA" class then you are not working hard enough. By stating the > very word "traditional," you are implying that the style includes intense > training. Maybe your style is NOT traditional and the instructor is not > concerned with perfection. If I have learned one thing from "traditional > MA's," it's that road to perfection is full of hurts and SWEATS. > > - -Cheree > > It is not that my traditional MA can not cause sweating, but that the class level > of intensity is usually kept at a challenging level for most of the students. > Unfortunately, most of the students in my dojang only get in 3 classes per week as > exercise and do nothing else. So the intensity is kept at a level that will tire > them but not kill them. Now, I am not the only one with this problem, as there > are other students who either come more often or exercise outside of class. When > we are all there, then yes, I sweat and pant, but that is not very often. :-( > Our instructor does tell students they need to do more exercise outside class, but > they don't, so he isn't able to raise the bar too high. We tend to kick and punch > after each number is called out loud. In the seminar that I went to, there was > only the yell of "start" and then knees, kicks and hand strikes to multiple > targets on the bag or partner with bag. A kind of go-go class. In my private > lessons I sweat. :-) Spunky ------------------------------ From: FGS & KVF Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 10:51:42 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #372 > Spunky, > Can only speak for myself, but your initial post (and follow-ups) seem much > more like an advertisement for krav maga than an invitation to > discuss/contrast korean martial arts with another art. It's too bad that was your impression as the enthusiasm of my post is linked to my natural ebullience, not a paid for ad. Considering that there have been posts on other combative styles like Peyton Quinn's, Tony Blaur's etc., I figured I could add my .02 cents to the options for such styles. I don't work for KM, and I enjoy my MA school but I am open to hearing other's re: things they have learned that have added to their MA skill tool box. That was my purpose, to open up another avenue for people to investigate. > This is, after all, > a korean martial arts discussion group; I subscribed to this list for that > reason. The dojang digest may be a korean MA discussion group, but as you may have noticed, we tend to go off on tangents that may have originally been linked to MA, but end up somewhere else. Note the recent cop post that went from MA relation to media portrayal of cops. People seem to enjoy the tangents as long as there is no vituperation involved. We seem to be open are open to new things. > If I wanted to discuss krav maga, I'd do so in > an appropriate forum. I didn't start a discussion on KM, just gave my experience to people who might be interested in adding other things to their training or have tried other things already. I have received positive FB on my post, so I'll guess that my purpose was understood by most. > > No, I'm not ticked off or anything, just my 2 cents. Normally wouldn't even > reply on something like this, but you seem to me to be a bit disingenuous > about the posting. Just my impression. Ouch! Disingenunous? Nope, just a personal frank experience. I am just a really spunky person. :-) Spunky > > > // mark > ------------------------------ From: Piotr Bernat Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 17:23:33 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Musical forms > Let's not forget my first instructor Charlie Lee > (Circa 1985-87) and his "Twighlight Zone" musical form > :-) Surely an impressive performer... but I can`t tell you more since back then it was terribly hard to get any video of musical forms so I simply didn`t have the chance to see him in action. I first saw a musical form on video ca. 1990 and it was the famous "Staying Alive" pattern done by Jean Frenette, and later John Chung`s form to Beethoven 5th Symphony. Just loved it... Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: Piotr Bernat Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 17:23:42 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Musical forms again > Ernie Reyes, Sr., a demo team that does a magnificent job as far as > choreographing their movements by the music. Have you ever seen them in > action ? They did a great demonstration at Paris Martial Arts Festival two or three years ago. BTW, one year later on the same festival, the Korean Tigers Group performed a musical pattern to the French national anthem, carrying small French and Korean flags in their hands. The idea is not new (remember Jhoon Rhee in the Soviet Union?) but it really impressed the spectators. Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: "Dizzy S." Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 13:57:20 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Forms/McDojangs Hiya all. I just wanna say thanks to all of you who helped me or talked about ways to do forms. It helped alot. Last night, I was a guest at another TSD school, and they do forms in place! They don't move from one spot. Instead, they hop up and land or end up in the next move or stance. It was tough with the turns, but after trying it a few times, it was easy (except for the aching legs lol). Then they would do the form the way they are supposed to be done. And after doin it in place, it was a lot easier to do them normally! They also threw me off by doin them facing the mirrors. The way their mirrors are set up, is one set is one side of the room and the other is on the other side (so when you look in the mirror, you see "several rooms" lol). Man that was hard lol. Plus being in a new place threw me off, too, but I managed not to "destroy" the forms I knew lol. As far as musical forms go: I love forms, but I also watched them on ESPN the other night, and it bothered me. For one, I am a former musician (my hobby before martial arts lol), and they didn't stay with the music (with the beat like dance), except for one guy. Don't get me wrong, most of the moves and techs, I thought, were awsome, but being a former musician, I also look at the "musical" side of musical forms. And the screaming! OMG! That had to go. There's a difference between a good solid ki hap, and screaming. And the talk about McDojangs have been really funny at times lol. I enjoyed those. Master Mac was so funny with the Mac thing lol. If ya wanna see one, come to NJ and look at the one in the mall here hee hee. Well, enough of my rambling. I gotta go to a 4th of July picnic then see fireworks (if they happen .... it's raining here). Have a happy and safe holiday. Talk to you all soon. Tang Soo! Dizz 6th gup TSD _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Dizzy S." Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 14:49:44 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Reason for taking MA Hiya all, (again today hee hee) Ok so I wasn't finished hee hee. Anyways, the talk about why adults take an MA. Well, mine WAS insecurity (no self-esteem, confidence, ect). Plus I had a bad temper (no self control). And the word "can't" was a regular word for me. But, in the long run, it taught me leadership, goal setting, determination, honor along with self control, confidence, and self esteem. And I'm only a green belt! I live by the 7 tenents and the student creed of Tang Soo Do. For those who don't know what they are: Seven tenets 1) Integrity 2) Concentration 3) Perseverance 4) Respect and Obedience 5) Self control 6) Humility 7) Indomitable spirit Student creed: 1) I intend to develop myself in a positive manner and avoid anything to reduce my mental growth and physical heath. 2) I intend to develop self discipline in order to bring out the best in myself and others. 3) I intend to use what I learn in class constructively and defensively, to help myself and my fellow man, and never be abusive or offensive. Why do I see Cheree reading them with me lol. You go girl :o) Anyways, I think just the tenets and the student creed speak for themselves. Plus you got instructors who won't allow the word "can't" in the dojang (well I do anyways). Instructors who point at the seven tenets when you wanna give up, when you are sooooo tired and your dobahk is soaked in sweat and you wanna drop, but the say "perserverance", and instructors who remind you that you CAN. I didn't even get to the Five code spirit! 1) Be loyal to your country. 2) Obedience to parents. 3) Honor friendship. 4) Always finish what you start. 5) In fighting, choose with sence and honor. AMEN! Tell me this stuff doesn't character! I think this is what to look for at a non-McDojang! lol I had to throw that in there lol. Ok, now I'm starving (thinking about the food), and there is no class tonight (bummer), so I have to go find something to do. Talk to you all soon. Tang Soo! Dizz 6th gup TSD _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "hackworth" Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 15:49:05 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Hapkido Seminars G. Booth wrote: "Hi all I am finalising details for my up and coming trip to the US and have ended up with a couple of days free, if you are interested in having a crazy Hapkidoist from downunda at your school (regardless of numbers) drop me a line. At this stage I have the following dates free: July 30th - August 1st August 6th - 9th Or if you just have questions about what I might be able to bring to your school, skill wise let me know." You did not post when and where you are already scheduled for list members in that area to attend. Could you let the list know what are the dates, times, locations and costs for the seminars that are already scheduled? Richard Hackworth http://ma_success.tripod.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 15:15:29 PDT Subject: Re: the_dojang: 10 ways Forms practising > This is my first message. Welcome! Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 15:19:14 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Jackson? Master Booth, Will you make it again this year to the big Hapkido gathering down in Master West's neck of the woods? Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #379 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.