From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #477 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Mon, 13 Aug 2001 Vol 08 : Num 477 In this issue: the_dojang: I see I need to clarify myself... the_dojang: just fyi... the_dojang: Tourneys the_dojang: Belts the_dojang: Rank - The whole idea smells!! the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1000 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Craig Stovall" Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 23:48:31 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: I see I need to clarify myself... Not surprisingly, it seems that my football analogy has ruffled a few feathers. That's all well and good...there's too much damned conformity in the arts to begin with, and a little lively discussion always helps to shine the light of truth where it's most needed. First of all, it was not my intention to equate martial arts to "sports". I'm sure that many realize this, but it appears that some were confused, or (the more likely explanation) just decided to take the opportunity to accuse me of reductionism. That's fine too. The purpose of the analogy was very simple. Imagine how ridiculous the game of professional football could possibly become if institutions similar to the martial arts use of rank, heirarchy, and privelege were allowed to creep into the culture of the game. I fully expected that some people would take exception to my criticism of those institutions. Some people like pecking orders and systems of entitlement, and I will march to my death for the right of someone to turn their thinking and decision-making over to someone else. After all...how can I ever be sure that what I'm doing is "right" unless it gets the goodhousekeeping seal of approval from an "established" and "legitimate" martial arts organization, tradition, or lineage? (I'll leave it to you to figure out where the sarcasm begins in that paragraph). At any rate, my little "essay" was about performance, and how belt systems can be a symptom of organizations that are built on anything BUT performance. I know this will be hard for some to understand...especially those that have been hiding out in their dojangs playing "tori beats the hell out of uke for the millionth time", so I'll put it in caps and urge you to read it slowly...PERFORMANCE IS NOT NECESSARILY RELATED TO SPORTING ACTIVITES. I realize now that my sports analogy may have served to throw a little curve (pardon the pun), but somehow injecting the belt system into a knitting circle or a Monday night contract bridge club just didn't carry the same zing. So it's football we were stuck with... But...since we were drug kicking and screaming into the realm of sport (by someone's allegation of reductionism on my part), let's explore how the concepts of sport can help take martial arts to the next level (and revisit one instance in which it has already happened). However, before I do that I'd like to comment on how interesting it is that some people just insist on making "sport" into a dirty word (especially when it's uttered in the same breath as the sacred and holy "MARTIAL ARTS"). In my experience, (and please remember the old Hebrew proverb..."An Example is Not Proof") these types fall into one or all of the following categories and/or hold the following beliefs/misconceptions. 1. They've never competed in their lives, and are scared to death of actually having the bright lights of competition shine upon their abilities. 2. They are convinced that competition automatically brings out the worst in human nature...there is nothing POSITIVE that can come from healthy and regulated competition. 3. They can't fathom a healthy and well-adjusted competitor walking the face of the earth because they can't get the mythical image of the coked out, roided up, inyaface, professional athlete out of their minds. In their world (inside an antiseptic laboratory where performance and aliveness don't exist), all sports are played on Sunday, are available via pay-per-view, have millions of dollars at stake, and somehow reinforce the male dominated culture that we inherited from our Cro-magnon forefathers (see there it is again...why can't I say "forepersons"). 4. The practice of sports and moral development are mutually exclusive. Actually, that's not true...they believe that there is a negative correlation between the two. Bring sportive training concepts (or...GASP...compete at sporting events) into your program and you're just ASKING for trouble. Hell, the pee-wee class will be raping and pillaging in under a week. So, to some people...sports be bad. To others...sports be good. For even others...shaddup, you make my head hurt. Whatever. So lemme tell you a little story about a man named Jigoro. Kano that is. Our man Kano was a young jujutsu adept that couldn't shake the funny feeling that something just wasn't right with the jujutsu training that he was getting. Oh...the stuff was GOOD. Heck, these jujutsu guys had a terrible rep for beating the ever-living hell out of anybody that stepped in their way (and even those that tried to get out of the way). But, Kano just knew in his heart of hearts that there was a superior method of training waiting out there. Well, Kano the young school teacher, got sick of waiting for tengus and dead samurai warriors to magically drop the secrets of superior fighting into his lap...so the guy goes out and does something that will eventually put his name on the martial arts map for all eternity. He takes the traditional techniques and concepts of jujutsu, combines them with new techniques and concepts that he devised, and created a new way to train all of this stuff in order to create both superior fighters AND moral character. In essence...he created Kodokan Judo. So, what was so different about Kano's system? In the grand scheme of things, he really didn't change that much. Before Kano, the jujutsu sects were almost totally reliant upon kata for their training needs (that, and beating the hell out of untrained people in the streets). What Kano did was preserve the tradition of kata (and here we're referring to two-man katas...not beating up the air), and added additional training methods to enhance the PERFORMANCE of his students. The most important was the concept of randori (sparring). Now to be fair, people were sparring long before Kano came along, but it was his marriage of randori to the modified techniques of jujutsu (as well as with his new techniques) that made all of the difference in the world. Before Kano, jujutsu folks trained like this...uke throws a prescribed technique at tori, and tori beats the jeebus out of uke with no further resistance from uke (sound familiar?). Kano knew that this type of training had value, but he was also smart enough to figure out that there was a better way. Randori allowed for continous, spontaneous action between the students until a decisive win was registered by either party. There was none of this, "Oh, I had you dead to rights...you couldn't have resisted that funky fresh wristlock even if you had tried". Theory, doubt, and chicanery went straight out the window with Kano's introduction of randori. So, how did he introduce "real" fighting into his dojo without having to stack the bodies out back? Popular myth will tell you that he took out all of the "deadly" and "crippling" techniques, and left in the safe stuff that people could practice on each other in an alive manner. There is a grain of truth in this, as Kano took out much of the small joint manipulation, and relegated atemi-waza (striking methods...particularly to vital points) to the realm of theoretical study. However, a straight-arm-lock is a straight-arm-lock, and it will snap the capsule in your arm just the same. What Kano did was make practice more "sporting"...make the object of the game to hold your opponent immobile for 30 seconds using weight and leverage (instead of trying to bend his arm 90 degrees in the wrong direction) , apply a joint lock or choke until the opponent concedes victory by slapping the mat (not screaming in pain), throwing your opponent squarely on their back (as opposed to squarely on their head and shoulder), etc, etc, etc. Gee, sounds like Kano really took a true fighting art, and watered it down to a silly game that you and the girls can play together in the teahouse. Not really. Ever hear of the inter-style matches that took place at the Tokyo police headquarters right before the turn of the century (the exact date escapes me)? The Tokyo police decided to use matches to find the best hand-to-hand instructor for the police force...in other words, let PERFORMANCE decide which style was "best" as opposed to, "We can trace our style back 250 years, and nobody knows the super secret killing techniques besides us...and we have these pretty scrolls to prove it, so THERE" (DANG those Japanese are a craft bunch). Well, everybody expected Kano's "watered down sportsmen" to get swept by the jujutsu boys. Not hardly. Ten matches occured with Kano's boys taking all ten in impressive fashion. As a matter of fact, most of the jujutsu boys were carried out on boards. Funny how rough those sport boys can get when it's for keeps. Kano's change was very simple...create a system in which performance became the focus instead of how well one could perform a kata. Create a system in which one could test their skill against a resisting opponent using non-prescribed attacks, instead of beating up a living punching bag that's been endoctrinated into the fine art of making you look good. Kano breathed the concept of aliveness into an art form that had become nothing more than a collection of dead patterns. Kano's boys trained like they fought, and fought like they trained. It doesn't get any simpler than that... And in case anyone accuses Kano of being hung-up on fighting...I'll leave it to you to research his ideals on moral development, and physical education. In case you haven't guessed...I think Kano was a pretty neat guy. So, there's our example (but please remember that old Jewish proverb) of how sporting concepts were brought into an art form, and ENABLED practicioner's to guage, monitor, and improve their PERFORMANCE. So, to directly address one of my critics (he didn't bring up my name, so I won't bring up his) I'm not equating martial arts with sports, spiritual development, moral education, or ANYTHING ELSE. Martial arts can be ALL of these things, or none at all. It can be nothing more than a method of kicking butts, or something so great as an opportunity to teach moral character. Whichever it becomes...IS UP TO YOU!!! Like any other field of human knowledge...it has no INHERENT value outside the endeavors to which it is applied. Value is a function of perception and utility...and both of these reside solidly within the realm of man. I leave the rest to the spirits in the sky... It is late, my friends. And I am signing off. I really hope this post stirs up some debate...I think it's healthy. By the way, I'm through posting the subtle stuff...it's Katie bar the door from here on in...;) Craig "I'm not aware of too many things...I know what I know if you know what I mean" Stovall With apologies to Edie Brickell. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001 11:25:48 PDT Subject: the_dojang: just fyi... Forwarding... To Anyone considering Attending the 6th & 7th Dan Instructor Licensing Seminar from John Holloway, former USTU VP July 21, 2001 Dear President Lee, I am in receipt of your letter of July 20th faxed to me urging me to register and that it would be most appropriate for me to participate in the 6th & 7th Dan Instructor's Licensing Seminar scheduled next week. I cannot in good conscience, as the Education and Certification Divisional Coordinator, register for the 6th & 7th Dan Instructor's Licensing Seminar. We have discussed the Licensing Seminar both prior to its inception and since its implementation. My view has not changed. Every time I view the USTU website, I am personally insulted and commercially injured as a result of the list showing all web site visitors that the ONLY "licensed" USTU schools to date, are of Korean descent, it makes me stand even more firmly in my conviction. The same impact and injury is felt by every other school owner with a 7th Dan or lower ranking. The pattern of preferential, discriminatory use of USTU funds and endorsements cannot be justified. In the past, you claimed that access to such opportunities would have these 8th & 9th Dan Instructors who are on the web site, rally to insure mass participation of 6th & 7th Dans as one of the selling points of 8th & 9th Dans "going first". This has not occurred. Instead, these senior ranked individuals have continued to benefit from these exclusive and misleading listings. You have also sought to justify this practice by the "martial art way" of seniority. This tradition, which I greatly respect, cannot appropriately be used to limit access or justify preferential treatment in this type of commercial setting. This is to be a "LICENSING" seminar. This type of program addresses the business of Taekwondo schools. If this is business, there must be EQUAL OPPORTUNITY. There is no justification for this type of rank preference in such matters of business -- especially with the perception that is prevalent in our NGB. There is no rational basis for your continued statements that my instructor should go first and my student after me. I feel my instructor, myself, and my student should have had the opportunity to go together because it is a "LICENSING SEMINAR." Access to such opportunities should have nothing to do with rank. If rank continues to be used to justify preferential treatment, the USTU is perpetuating a practice of disparate impact. Having been denied equal opportunity to participate in the USTU licensing activities to date, and seeing no change in these practices, I respectfully decline your "urging" of me to participate. As you may recall, in a 1998 meeting with the USOC Membership & Credentials Committee, I stood up and defended the USTU against accusations of prejudice and racism. At that time I felt the allegations being made against the USTU were false and unfounded. I was proud to stand up and speak on behalf of the USTU. It gives me no pleasure at this time to witness this explicit example of prejudice. In closing, I want to assure you that I remain dedicated to working together to implement the USTU mission statement: "To foster excellence in Taekwondo in the United States, provide for all Taekwondo athletes to achieve their goals and to win gold medals in the Olympic Games." The ability of the USTU to achieve this mission requires equal access and opportunity for all USTU instructors, athletes and members. Neither race nor rank should be a factor in how the USTU pursues this goal. Sincerely, John L. Holloway Division of Education, Certification and Standards Affairs cc USTU Executive Committee ------------------------------ From: Emactkd@aol.com Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001 18:49:02 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Tourneys Thanks All: A thread that blossomed nicely. To use tournaments and competition properly they must be seen as different than just any other sporting event. Holding trophies until the end was once the common standard, but our drive to efficiency, trying to cut down the long days, may have left us without some things we wanted all along. So how many run tournaments so that every competitor goes home with a trophy? Rick Foley ------------------------------ From: "Kenneth W. Legendre" Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001 23:19:42 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Belts Hello All I have a different way of looking at the whole belt thing. A person can either have a black belt or they can be a black belt. There is a store around here that sells martial arts supplies. One of those supplies that you can buy is a black belt. Having a black belt is as easy as going over to that store and purchasing yourself a black belt. Actually being a black belt requires much more than that. Its also much more than coming to class and learning all the kicks, punches, forms, falls, all the joint locks, and whatever else your school decides to require for black belt. The most important part I feel are what in our school are called the tenants of tae kwon do. Courtesy, integrity, perserverence, self control, and indomitable spirit. If your student believes in those 5 tenants they will, I believe, be a good student and represent your school with honor. thanks Ken Legendre 3rd Dan TKD innae@netexpress.net ------------------------------ From: Brian Myers Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2001 07:59:04 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Rank - The whole idea smells!! To all those "Stovall"(s) out there... I too wish for a simpler time, one without the needless headache of fancy colored belts and uniforms that remind me of a cheap storefront! As most of you faithful DD readers know I am a student of Songahm Taekwondo, and therefore a participant in the increasingly insane ATA system. I personally wear a very "unadorned" uniform. The only patches an lettering on my uniform have meaning. A chevron to identify me as a certified judge, the ATA logo (which I personally don't think is necessary), a "Tiny Tigers V Patch" (To allow the younger students identify me as an instructor/BB that they can talk to with "no fear" of rank.) and the name of my first instructor's school on the back (in honor of a man who continues to influence my MA - even after losing contact!). The last item is a source of some debate between myself and my current instructor. My belt carries a minimum of "adornment" , a roman numeral 1 on one tip and my name (phonetically) in Hangul on the other, and I have been lobbying to get the rman numeral removed. (Another source of debate!) I fully agree with Mr. Stovall - Colored Rank Belts should not be necessary. The true measure of any martial artist is in their techniques, attitude, and most important - their willingness to learn all they can with humility. Today's "modern" martial artist has forgotten the idea of humility. The need for multiple layers of rank, outward rank designators, and uniforms that look like the side of a Winston cup car show just how far most martial artists have fallen away from the "traditional" veiwpoints. I also believe fully in asking a student to leave if he/she is not living up to the standards of the school. It seems only natural (from a "traditional" point of view) that when a student is asked to leave, "thier" belt be removed. Yes, they still retain the knowledge, and yes they could go out and buy a new belt. But by removing the belt they "earned" an instructor is saying "I no longer endorse this student, they do not uphold the correct values." By doing this in front of the rest of the school, the other students know the situation, understand that you are serious about them maintaining the "proper attitude and discipline", and word spreads throughout the local MA community that this student needs to be watched closely. Also, any new belt they may purchase will become a source of personal shame - they may not admit it openly, but most will feel that the new belt has no real meaning! I often wonder if going back to a system that only has two or three "ranks" would not instill more discipline and honor in most students. Afterall, a great deal of the "misbehavior" common in MA revolves around rank. Some students don't understand what it means to be a MA (IE you never stop learning, never stop being a student!) and begin to feel superior to those that have a lower rank belt. If we got rid of the outward symbols of the "power", I think many of the problems of a lack of respect, honor, discipline, and humility would lessen if not disappear altogether. Yours in the Martial Spirit ! Brian Myers ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2001 8:05:32 PDT Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #477 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.