From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #508 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 29 Aug 2001 Vol 08 : Num 508 In this issue: the_dojang: Martial Arts, Martial Sport the_dojang: Re: the meridian for the left pinky toe the_dojang: RE: Young Teachers the_dojang: Young teachers the_dojang: Energy/Meridians the_dojang: Teaching/Helping Re: the_dojang: Martial Art or Martial Sport the_dojang: list slow the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1000 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Dennis McHenry" Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:25:36 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Martial Arts, Martial Sport Hi Nick, <> I too practice the Classical/Traditional MA of TSD. I have met Master Johnson (he gave me several copies of a magazine where he was on the cover). Funny thing is, I met him at an International TSD tournament (he and his son) in the USA. So saying yall "never attend tournaments other than a small internal..." might be stretching it a wee bit. :-) As much as I don't do tournaments either, it was strange how Master Johnson and I just happen to meet at one... Mac (another "classical" Tang Soo Do guy) ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the EV1 webmail system at mail.ev1.net ------------------------------ From: "Dana Vaillancourt" Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 19:33:26 Subject: the_dojang: Re: the meridian for the left pinky toe Craig. Try pressing between the closest "v" of those two toe bones. Press until it hurts more than the toe, release and walla - - relief from that nasty pressure point and only the toe pain again! Actually, that spot can help for temporary relief, IF that is not where the toe is broken! Dana [who responsibly did not recommend the Jack Daniels via digestion meridian method] _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ From: Brian Myers Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:47:45 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Young Teachers Louise Wrote : "I was wondering, how old would you (any martial arts teachers) want a student to be before they started teaching? Would you say grade mattered if they were teaching below their own grade, eg a yellow belt teaching a white belt? I'm curious because I want to start teaching but I'm only a yellow belt and I don't want to do something wrong...obviously, I only want to be an assistant instructor, but what are your views?" A tough question to answer. I would start by saying that grade does not matter to me personally. I have seen really great instructors wearing all manner of belts. I have also seen really terrible instructors wearing all different ranks. Chronological age matters a little more, but is not a good gage of "instructor ability" either. I worry about age only as it applies to the age of students to be taught. While a 14 yr old may be able to teach a 12 yr old, I would not think of putting in front of an adult, especially an adult student who is new to the school and possibly to the art in general. A younger instructor with an older student can often lead to problems in Respect and sometimes leads to loss of the student. (they feel they are not getting taught well enough - no matter how good the instructor!) The "defining attribute" I look for is time in the art. Many times I have found that I didn't really fully understand a technique and its uses until well after I first learned it. Not that anything was being "hidden" from me, only that until I had practiced the movement 1000's of times and under different conditions I hadn't really understood why it was taught to me as it was. Before anybody teaches a technique they must understand the technique and the method to use to teach it. Also, many times I have found that once I began "instructing" I would be asked questions by students that I had not personally worked with and was not prepaired adequately to answer their questions. As it becomes known that you are an assistant instructor the other student s will begin to look to you for answers to questions they may not want to ask the head instructor. I always encourage students to "get involved" with teaching. I feel the best lessons are often learned while teaching others. I suggest starting your involvement by approaching your instructor and volunteering to be the "demonstrator" for techniques. Once you are confortable with that and your instructor has had time to evaluate your potential as an assistant instructor you will then have a better understanding of the basic material and will be better prepaired. (and fully supported by your instructor) Just a few ideas... Yours in the Martial Spirit, Brian Myers ------------------------------ From: "Jere Hilland" Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:46:40 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Young teachers Louise, my teacher has a saying "you are only one technique from closing the doors". What this implies is that the owner of the school is one injury and lawsuit from going out of business. As a full time hapkido instructor I acknowledge that if I send anyone out to teach a class other than my wife (the co-owner of the dojang), I am assuming responsibility for that teachers action. I have never let anyone lower than black belt or under the age of 21 teach as an assistant instructor. I retired from the business of insurance claims to teach full time and during those years I handled lawsuits due to negligence and gross negligence on the part of a small business owner, I witnessed dreams of proprietorship go away at the courthouse. Please enjoy your time as a student and do not be in a hurry to teach. Only my opinion. Jere R. Hilland www.geocities.com/hapkiyukwonsul ------------------------------ From: "alejo mac" Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:06:51 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Energy/Meridians regarding the energy/ meridians subject, my only knowledge on it, it's that the who approves the use of accupuncture as a valid treatemment of some disseases. Mac Get 250 color business cards for FREE! http://businesscards.lycos.com/vp/fastpath/ ------------------------------ From: "Alagna, Steven M" Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:51:14 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Teaching/Helping >>I was wondering, how old would you (any martial arts teachers) want a student to be before they started teaching? Would you say grade mattered if they were teaching below their own grade, eg a yellow belt teaching a white belt? I'm curious because I want to start teaching but I'm only a yellow belt and I don't want to do something wrong...obviously, I only want to be an assistant instructor, but what are your views? Louise>> Louise, in my humble and maybe worthless opinion, there is a big difference between helping and teaching/instructing. I don't know what your abilities are or your understanding of the techniques and principles, but if you started with no prior knowledge, I would think that you may be qualified to only help and not actually "teach". Teaching almost always requires much more than showing someone where your feet should be, where that hands goes, how to move... I've been in TKD for about 3 years approaching black belt (next testing in about 6 months), have studied other MA's, a fast learner, athletic, and quickly able to employ techniques and strategies (not trying to puff out my chest in awe of myself, but trying to show where I'm coming from) but, as I train, sometimes 5 to 6 days a week, lights are now going on regarding a lot of the basic techniques taught to white belts. I'm not saying that a white belt can't apply techniques properly, but it does take that experience to help that white belt along properly. White belts hear what you are saying and are applying the techniques, but sometimes it takes a while and then suddenly the person says "Oh I get it!!" I've seen students who can run and organize a class, but they are not "teaching". Hope this helps a little. Steven M. Alagna ------------------------------ From: Creed71963@aol.com Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 17:45:01 EDT Subject: Re: the_dojang: Martial Art or Martial Sport In a message dated 08/29/2001 2:01:22 PM EST, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << From: "Patrick L" Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:32:30 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Martial Art or Martial Sport Dear Craig, I think it is a mistake to disparage knowledgeable teachers that choose to emphasize Art over Sport - or vice-versa. People who practice kata - People who practice sparring - People who practice randori - People who practice self-defense are usually formidable within their element. Even if proficiency in one does not translate directly into proficiency in another. IMHO each choice has benefits that prepare and enhance performance should the focus switch.>> I'm not disparing thoses schools that chose to emphisis sport over art. As I mentioned when I started this subject, are schools forced to chose stressing the sport aspects over the art in order to stay open? We've seen discussion about 'hard' forms of martial arts, and its safe to say that these practiciners are not going to be going to tournaments. But does are 'fast-food' society demand that we, as a people get 'immediate' satifaction by having that 'black belt' around our waists? We all know that there's black belts out there that are not fit to be yellow belts in either skill and temperment. Is this diluting the skill level of the martial arts, as schools stress the sports aspects because they can't stay open otherwise, or because that is the way the instructor was taught? But some schools 'sell' their belts cheeply. There are schools out there that do not service their students well. Just because they spar great does not mean they will be able to defend themselves in a street situation. But the belt they well implies that they can do these things when they cannot. >> My sole caveat is that the teacher be knowledgeable. Take for instance the thread recently about creating a cane form. If the person is new to Martial Arts, then perhaps a few years study in empty hand kata, jo/bo staff kata and other self-defense both empty handed and weaponed,would result in a higher quality result. To encourage just anyone with a stick to "make something up" would be irresponsible.<< I agree, but how many schools take the time to teach that? To study martial arts is a long term effort, while Martial sports is like being a NFL player - -- you have a limited time before you are past your prime. I think that people want something now, and are not will to wait for it. Some schools take advantge of it, and package a so called 'black belt package' Other schools lower standards to keep their door open. Now, that being said, there are many fine schools that do not fall into this McDojang mentality, they produce fine martial artists that are well rounded people who will pass the art onto their students with the same care and attention to detail that they were taught. There's nothing that can be done about this except to make sure the school you go to teaches what you wanted it to. Craig Getting in the WAY, >> ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 16:02:56 PDT Subject: the_dojang: list slow I'll be away from direct and easy computer access for the next week, so the list may be slow during that time. Just a heads-up... Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 16:03:17 PDT Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #508 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. 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