From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #588 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Mon, 22 Oct 2001 Vol 08 : Num 588 In this issue: the_dojang: Two Person Hyungs the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #587 the_dojang: Re: The other list the_dojang: Southern Hospitality the_dojang: Martial Child Abuse the_dojang: Complimentary condition of no posts on other lists ? the_dojang: punch names the_dojang: Re: archive search the_dojang: Re: strong opinions the_dojang: RE:Small Stuff the_dojang: RE:1st Ammendment Stuff the_dojang: RE: Numbers stuff Re: the_dojang: RE: Numbers stuff Re: the_dojang: punch names the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Emactkd@aol.com Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 22:02:56 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Two Person Hyungs Ray: As part of our training set we have several two-man forms and they are of both varieties. Jang Kwon is an integrated two-man form, with a flow that resembles a fight between the individuals. Two other forms, Hanson Daeryon and Cheel-bo Daeryon, are two-man forms very similar to sticky hands. I would be very interested in seeing both sides of Dan Kwon, which from its flow has always seemed like it should be a two-man set. I have found that the fluidity and grace of Chuan Fa forms has been a very good mix with the staccato nature of most Okiniawan derived forms. Sort of off-setting penalties. And they both provide a perspective to modern TKD forms. Just as a passing knowledge of Greek and Latin help with understanding a lot of modern English. E pluribus unum Rick Foley ------------------------------ From: "Dizzy S." Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 23:26:27 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #587 Illona wrote: <<<>>> Wow. I didn't know that. Aren't they both "Japanese" styles, though? Tang Soo! Dizzy _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ From: "Robert Martin" Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 21:45:02 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The other list I acutally had to kick the owner of the "other" list off of my list. He never did let me join his, even before the incident on my list. I don't post much here but find the things some of you say interesting. Ray does a pretty good job of keeping things fair and honest (I disagree wtih him on occasion ). Other people of other way of doing things, I guess. I just using this subject as a way to say thanks Ray and keep it going. Robert Maritn 4th Dan ITF > From: mtomlins@mail.volusia.k12.fl.us > Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 18:30:04 -0400 > Subject: the_dojang: The other list > > A strange thing happened to me about a month ago on the "other" list,,, I > rejoined the list and everything was ok,,, I didn't post on here as a > complimentary condition while I was on the "other" list,,, there were some > posts on there about how South Korea should reopen talks with North Korea,,, > and I voiced my opinion on this subject in my not so politically correct > way,,, as I know some of you have heard in the past,,, well after this post > was sent,, blamo,,, I recieved no more mail from this "other" message > board,, after several attempts to email them and find out what the problem > was there was no return mail to me,,, it is like as soon as I wrote a post > that some people didn't like I was instantly kicked off of their board,,, > wow,, you know I am an American true and thru,, and this seems to me to be > something akin to communism,,, at least on this board you guys listen and > debate,, isn't that what freedom of speech is all about? One word,,, > EGOTISM > Michael Tomlinson _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: DrgnSlyr5@aol.com Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 02:37:42 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Southern Hospitality While visiting in the South last week, I had the opportunity to attend one of Master West's classes. I appreciated the warm welcome and enjoyed meeting him and training with his students. If ya'll (or is the plural, all ya'll?) are in his area, it will be worth your time to plan a stop at his school. Thanks again, Master West! Sharon ------------------------------ From: DrgnSlyr5@aol.com Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 03:11:20 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Martial Child Abuse Forwarded message: << http://www.libertocracy.com/Webessays/Sports/abuse/Martial_Child_Abuse.htm I believe the answer to this article is to write (in mass) to the author of this article and the editor of this forum and let them know they are a bit misguided... >> ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 04:01:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Complimentary condition of no posts on other lists ? Mike, you noted: Response: I have voiced my opinion previously on the "other" "G" list and will not delve into it here since seasoned list posters know all about the individual. Moreover, if I mentioned the individual the "turn the other cheek" naysayers would evoke comments on how I should not say negative things about other people (similar to those morons who are protesting that we should not have any military strikes in Afganistan despite the loss of 6000 plus people). This is not the true martial arts way, and "blah, blah, blah." However, I am surprised that anyone would agree not to post on any list as a condition of being re-accepted to another list ? Do you expect any individual's sympathy for again getting whacked over the head by an arbitrary and capricious individual ? You accepted a "Taliban" like edict, eschewed your basic constitutional rights to Freedom of Expression, then once again get bounced from the same dude. Now you write with a puzzled and sardonic demeanor. So, you want sympathy or are you informing sophisticated readers that you made an error in judgment ? Or, just musing on a lesson learned ? If you learned a lesson, great. If you are puzzled by the outrageous treatment you received= WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE. The guy on the other list is a moron !! Bye, Big Ken __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Charles Richards Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 05:17:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: punch names Jireugi for punch. Chigi for strike. > And also, are the punches > named in the same way as kicks, eg ab chagi and ab ... or are the punches > ...Il ...E ...sam...etc? Frequently the body target is used in the name, e.g. momtong jireugi (trunk punch), mok chigi (neck strike), momtong yup jireugi (truck side punch). Then there are also jecho jireugi (push punch), baro jireugi (right punch) and bandae jireugi (opposite punch). I have also heard round punch, vertical punch, etc. Comments from others? - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- FWIW, We use area of "attack" and kong kyuk, or part of fist... Choong Dan Kong Kyuk - Center Punch Sang Dan Kong Kyuuk - High Punch Kap Kwon - Back fist Soo Do - Knife edge Yuk Soo Do - Ridge hand Kwan Soo - Spear Finger Il Ji Kwan Soo - "one blade of grass" single finger spear bandae chireugi - reverse punch Jang Kwon - Forefist (Jab) Jung Kwon - Palm Heel Nak-Say chireugi - hook punch Anybody have a translation for uppercut? Yours in Jung Do, Charles Richards Moja Kwan Tang Soo Do __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 08:21:21 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: archive search In a message dated 10/20/2001 8:59:40 PM Central Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << Late last night someone you may know, of know of, from Hawaii did a number of searches on our open archives to see if about thirty different list subscribers had recently posted to the_dojang. >> lol. musta been a darned slow night in the islands :) melinda Chajonshim Martial Arts Supply http://www.cjmas.com Toll Free: 1-877-847-4072 Proud Sponsor of the 2001 10th Annual US Open TKD Championships ------------------------------ From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 08:19:20 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: strong opinions In a message dated 10/20/2001 9:49:22 AM Central Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << I have been told I have STRONG opinions.... Apologies to the list for ranting instead of offering a solution... DEEP and HUMBLE BOW CR >> charles, not needed on my account :)....like i said....i understand the sentiments. hope you had a good weekend. melinda Chajonshim Martial Arts Supply http://www.cjmas.com Toll Free: 1-877-847-4072 Proud Sponsor of the 2001 10th Annual US Open TKD Championships ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 07:47:22 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: RE:Small Stuff "..... Rand McNally, a U.S. map company, has started to use both "East Sea" and "Sea of Japan" in its most recently published maps..." . Whhheee-eewww. Thank, Gawd. I have been REAL concerned about this. Now can we get someone to do something about the English Channel? How about the Irish Sea? Maybe the Straits of Gibraltar? Then there is always MY personal favorite-- the Gulf of Mexico. The UN World Health Organization estimates that 25,000 children starve to death each day on this planet, but I can see where we might want to spend a couple million organizing a study on identifying a sound PC name for the various parts of our sandbox. BTW: Considering whats being spent on this effort regarding the Sea of Japan, is anyone at all familiar with the conditions in state-run orphanages and shelters in Korea? Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 08:22:36 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: RE:1st Ammendment Stuff Dear Michael: "....A strange thing happened to me about a month ago on the "other" list,,," Sorry, my friend, I wish that had not happened to you, but I think you will need to get used to it. The very same things happened during WW I, WW II, the Korean Conflict (McCarthy Era) and all during and after the Vietnam War. Quite recently VOICE OF AMERICA which had earned a reputation of providing unbiased reporting and facilitating a true exchange of information regarding World events and the US position in them had its director removed and a Bush Admin appointee substituted. Apparently NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO has likewise been sharply criticized for not toeing the Yellow Journalism line. If such can happen to larger institutions as these it is not surprising that single individuals such as yourself would find themselves bumped for not joining into the general moo-ing with the rest of the herd. But tell me, are you REALLY surprised? I made comments on E-BUDO about the differences between Kumdo and Kendo, the contributions of Korean culture to the establishment of Japanese martial tradition, Chinese contributions to the nature of Japanese ju-jutsu technique as well as the responsibilities of better informed members towards educating less well-read members. Didn't take long to find that my posts were disregarded and my questions ignored consistently. If its any help, though, Michael, let me say that at a recent To-Ken-Kai ( Japanese sword show) here in Chicago this weekend I found much of the same arrogance and elitism. For each of the one or two genuinely nice guys I ran into there were six or seven bozo-s who apparently make a hobby of straining to impress people with their facility in Japanese sword minutia. When I did not demonstrate suitable awe you would be amazed at how quickly their interest in me evaporated. On this Net we talk a lot about training to deal with such adversities as muggings and fights. To my way of thinking the real battle we train to deal with is the ability to be who we are and believe what we do even while everyone around us is trying to make us into everybody else. If its any help at all I may not agree with what you have to say but I'll be the first to argue in favor of your right to say it. Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 08:33:21 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Numbers stuff "...Remember 9-11!..." BTW: Does anyone remember the flight number of the civilian jet airliner that the US Armed Forces shot down during the Persian Gulf War? It was a little while before the Locherbee bombing and I think between 200 and 300 men, women and children went down with the plane with no survivors. Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 7:16:41 PDT Subject: Re: the_dojang: RE: Numbers stuff > "...Remember 9-11!..." > > BTW: Does anyone remember the flight number of the civilian jet airliner > that the US Armed Forces shot down during the Persian Gulf War? It was a > little while before the Locherbee bombing and I think between 200 and 300 > men, women and children went down with the plane with no survivors. Or the KAL flight over the Soviet Union? 007. How about the TWA flight? 800. Perhaps one just three weeks ago... The Russian Tu-154 airliner shot down by the Ukraine? Yes, Remember 9-11! Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 7:18:05 PDT Subject: Re: the_dojang: punch names > Anybody have a translation for uppercut? Just a guess... olliyo jireugi/kong-kyuk? Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 7:20:48 PDT Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #588 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11!