From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V9 #19 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 16 Jan 2002 Vol 09 : Num 019 In this issue: the_dojang: Weapons Certification the_dojang: Feud and Drama the_dojang: The Masters Cup Championships the_dojang: Re: Hello the_dojang: AAU Taekwondo Newsletter January 2002 Re: the_dojang: Weapons Certification Re: the_dojang: Re: Feud the_dojang: RE: Weapons Stuff the_dojang: Weapons the_dojang: Demo the_dojang: Rank the_dojang: rank feud Re: the_dojang: Rank the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. 800 members strong! Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. 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To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "michael tomlinson" Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 15:01:40 +0000 Subject: the_dojang: Weapons Certification I understand the idea of becoming proficient with weapon training and having those weapons built in to the actual curriculum, like using a cane at a certain belt level, dan bong at a certain belt level, etc.. but nowhere in the many years that I have trained in traditional Hapkido ie: World Hapkido Federation, Korea Hapkido Association, Moo Ye Kwan Hapkido, Sin Moo Hapkido, or other arts before that such as Goju Ryu Karate, and especially Ninjutsu (which is very weapon orientated) does anyone offer a seperate certification in weapons? In Kobudo do you get a seperate black belt for your weapons certification or do you just learn the weapons in the curriculum along with everything else? I think it is the latter. I kind of have a feeling that this weapon certification is something that has been schemed up by certain American organizations for whatever reason,, mostly economic ones in my opinion. I could be wrong on this but a question for the board, how many of you have recieved a seperate belt or "weapons ranking" from your organization? And if so how long did the certification take? One weekend, buy the tapes and come for training at the Hilton? I am just curious about this type of "certification". My thoughts are that to be proficient may take much longer than the times alloted for the "certification", and if this weapon training is a part of the natural Hapkido curriculum then why do you "need" weapon certification unless you are trying to take the short and easy way out? Practice is very important in every aspect of Hapkido training and I am puzzled as to why you wouldn't just call your weekend "weapons training" instead of weapon certification? Come on guys who are we fooling here? Can I buy a video on cane techiques and then send in my certification "check", I know one Hapkido organization that does this,, I won't mention the name but I am sure you all know who I'm talking about, and after all of this am I better at the cane? Or am I just better at talking about my certification with the cane? No offense to anyone or any organization on here but I think this is a disservice instead of a help to Hapkido in general, call it what it is,, a marketing ploy. Michael Tomlinson _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "michael tomlinson" Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 15:20:53 +0000 Subject: the_dojang: Feud and Drama Frank writes: As far as both sides being at fault? Perhaps, however, since I had a talk with someone at the KHF HQ who informed me that Mr. Whalen said some interesting things about me while he was there, and incidentally he has never met me, nor seen me on the mat, I have shall we say a very poor taste in my mouth for him. I have never done or said anything to him.>>> Frank this kind of reminds me about the comments you made about Doju Nim Ji Han Jae on Budoseek,, remember those, you have never met him or taked to him but you still made those comments, no offense but sometimes it better to look inward then outward,, maybe now you see how it feels when this happens to you instead of you doing the EXACT same thing to someone else. Michael Tomlinson _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 8:02:01 PST Subject: the_dojang: The Masters Cup Championships The Masters Cup Championships Traditional Martial Arts Tournament Hapkido - TaeKwon Do - Tang Soo Do - Soo Bahk Do - Gum Do - Tae Kyun - Karate Sunday, February 17, 2002 Pennsauken High School, just off Rt. 73 in Pennsauken, N.J. Registration will begin promptly at 8:00 AM on Feb 17th. Hosted by Scott Yates. Call 856-719-1411 at MacKenzie's Karate for more information. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: TKDgalSamm@aol.com Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 10:55:37 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: Hello I have tried to do this once before, but it didn't work, so I will try to post again ... I would like to introduce myself to the people on this list. I have been involved in martial arts for 10 years now on and off. I've been in TKD mostly and a tiny bit in Hapkido. Some people on this list already know me, so hello again to all of you :) To those who don't know me, it's a pleasure to read your posts and I appreciate being included on this list! If this post works, then I'll try to post again sometime! Respectfully, Loretta ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 9:11:14 PST Subject: the_dojang: AAU Taekwondo Newsletter January 2002 Forwarded message: Here is your AAU Taekwondo Newsletter for January 2002. AAU Taekwondo competitions feature both Olympic and Point sparring, and traditional Taekwondo forms including: WTF, ITF, and TSD/MDK forms may be performed. For more information visit http://www.aautaekwondo.org In This Issue: *AAU Taekwondo Has 10th Record Year of Growth! *AAU Taekwondo Dan Certification Surpasses 1,000 Black Belts *AAU Taekwondo Program Endorses Wireless Electronic Scoring System *AAU Taekwondo Team Adds USA TEKNO as Official Supplier *AAU Team to Travel to Puerto Rico *AAU Tournaments & Events Schedule *AAU Taekwondo Has 10th Record Year of Growth! The 2000-2001 competition year was another record setting year of growth for the AAU Taekwondo Program. 2001 marked our tenth straight year of continued growth. Individual membership registrations jumped from 11,408 in 2000 to 12,931 in 2001. Here are some stats: Members: 12,931 Top Five Associations: 1. Gulf: 1433 2. Pacific: 1275 3. Maryland: 1132 4. Wisconsin: 875 5. New England: 817 Top Five Growth Associations by Percentage 1. Rocky Mountain: +104% 2. South Texas: +124% 3. Arizona: +86% 4. Gulf: +72% 5. Potomac Valley: +61% *AAU Taekwondo Dan Certification Surpasses 1,000 Black Belts AAU Taekwondo National Sports Chair Mike Friello reports that the AAU Taekwondo Program’s AAU Taekwondo Dan Certification has now certified over 1,000 AAU Black Belt athletes. The goal of the certification is to provide a fair, consistent and thorough testing procedure for AAU members which recognizes and incorporates their differences in style and training methods. For information on AAU Taekwondo Dan Certification: http://www.aautaekwondo.org/dan.html *AAU Taekwondo Program Endorses Wireless Electronic Scoring System The AAU Taekwondo Program has endorsed a wireless electronic hogu and headgear manufactured by Fair Play Sports Safety Company and marketed by T Point. Both companies are located in Scottsdale, Arizona. The AAU Taekwondo Program joins the Korean National Association of Taekwondo for All (KNATA) and the Pan American Taekwondo Union (PATU) in endorsing these products to insure accurate, impartial scoring in competition and practice, and to aid in promoting safety in educational training. *AAU Team to Travel to Puerto Rico The National AAU Taekwondo Team will travel to Puerto Rico this upcoming March 6-11 to participate in an international event. Team Members, both Junior and Adult, were chosen this past September 30th at AAU Team Trials in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. For those divisions/weight class Team Members unable to make the trip, our alternate (#2) player will be asked to travel. This trip will also be open to non-Team Member AAU athletes, coaches, and family members at a special discounted price. *AAU Taekwondo Team Adds USA TEKNO as Official Supplier USA TEKNO out of Ft. Worth Texas has agreed to become the Official Supplier of the AAU Taekwondo Team. The AAU Taekwondo Team, which represents the AAU at national and international competitions, is being outfitted from head to toe by USA TEKNO, including Headgear, Chest Protector, Forearm, Shin/Instep, Uniform and Warm-Up Suit. *AAU Tournaments & Events Schedule January 26, 2002 Central Florida TaeKwonDo Challenge 1250 Grant Ave, Mt. Dora, Fl Contact: Jack Gunter, Florida Chair (813) 689-2255 btkd@earthlink.net February 2, 2002 Massachusetts AAU Tae Kwon Do Championships North Middle School Westfield, MA Ray Shugart 413-786-4158 shugarttkd@aol.com March 23, 2001 Hardy's Challenge Exeter, New Hampshire Christina Hardy 603-772-5811 nhtkda@aol.com March 23, 2002 Southeastern Florida AAU TaeKwonDo Challenge Sebastian River High School, Sebastian, FL Contact: Jack Gunter, Florida Chair (813) 689-2255 btkd@earthlink.net March 30, 2002 Maryland Championship (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) Thomas Stone High School, Waldorf, MD Scott Fiorillo 301-375-9409 smtkd@crosslink.net April 6, 2002 Virginia AAU Championship (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) James Roberts Sr. 703-569-4838 703-569-4838 April 20, 2002 Ozark AAU Championship Webster University Gym, St. Louis, MO (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) Pat Weseman 314-296-3748 pweseman@aol.com May 5, 2002 Region #1 Championship (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) Niskayuna High School Niskayuna, New York Mike Friello 518-372-6849 mfriello@aol.com May 18, 2002 Region #2 Championship (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) Roger Cavanaugh 301-645-0450 rc111255@aol.com May 18, 2002 Florida AAU Championship (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) Kissimmee Civic Center, Kissimmee, FL Contact: Jack Gunter, Florida Chair (813) 689-2255 btkd@earthlink.net May 18, 2002 Southeastern AAU Championship (A qualifying event for the AAU Nationals and AAU Junior Olympic Games) Nashville, TN Kimberley Cerami 615-794-9559 k.cerami@worldnet.att.net July 3-6, 2002 2002 Youth & Adult National Taekwondo Championship Greensboro, North Carolina Mike Friello 518-372-6849 mfriello@aol.com August 7-10, 2002 2002 AAU Junior Olympic Games Knoxville, Tennessee Mike Friello 518-372-6849 mfriello@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 9:13:32 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Weapons Certification > I could be wrong on this but a question for the board, how many of you have > recieved a seperate belt or "weapons ranking" from your organization? I believe that the ATA might, via its Protech (sp?) program. ??? Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 9:14:47 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Re: Feud > If it's a fact that we members of the greater Hapkido community we are > all one argument away from having our rank revoked, then perhaps we all > need to be informed of this. And would you even want to be part of an organization that permitted something like that to occur? Ok, I'll shut up now... :) Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 07:56:20 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Weapons Stuff Dear Michael: "....It seems to me that you have heard of CERTIFIED instructors in Hapkido. Why does the concept of a Certified Weapons instructor seem far fetched? I have spent 18 years studying Bo, Tonfa, Nunchaku, Sai, Baton, Cane, and Dan Bong. Of these weapons the only weapons that seem to be exclusivly Korean in origin is the Cane and Dan Bong. I have never experience them in any of my Japanese or Okinawan studies....." Before I comment I bet you can pretty much guess my position on this, ne? All the same let me say that I have some concerns any time that I observe what I think are the following conditions. 1.) Mixing and matching aspects of disparate arts. 2.) Certification of what I consider sub-categories of a larger discipline. 3.) Parody of the more commecial applications of some systems or arts as introduced to Hapkido. Now, I am not going to play the Little Dutch Boy and pretend that I have enough fingers to hold back the oceans of Commerce. What I would ask is that activities such as the one advertise adhere tightly to Korean traditions rather than substitutue material from other arts. By this I mean that it would better serve the Hapkido community to have a seminar in which a sword class is truely Korean Kum Bup/Kum Sool (taught by one who has ranking in such) rather than a module on Kendo taught by a ranking IKF/KKA member. Likewise, a don bong class needs to be just that rather than jutte, cane rather than jo, and Korean staff rather than Japanese/Okinawan bo. I cannot speak for others, but I can share with you that I have long ago stopped attended such activities as I have witnessed a growing tendency, even on the part of qualified/recognized personalities to substitute material from other sources and represent it as Korean tradition. To my knowledge Dr. Kimm, He-young is about the only person who still stresses only traditional Korean MT. BTW: On another note: I was hoping to located information on a well-regarded Hapkido personality who I believe teaches out in your neck of the woods. I believe you might have mentioned his name during a discussion this summer. Do you know who I am referring to? Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 11:10:33 PST Subject: the_dojang: Weapons Just a, perhaps, last thought from me on the KHF weapons thread. Regardless of the certification, I still think it would be an interesting seminar to attend. And probably would do just that were I somewhere near that locale. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: "Rudy Timmerman" Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 13:33:54 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Demo Hello List members: I recently received a requesat to do a demo for an educational facility that is sponsoring an Oriental Culture event. I believe it is at a University. The place is too far away from my Dojang to lend assistance. Perhaps someone on the list can oblige. Please contact the person in charge "Crystal" direct. The area code (413) should help determine the location. > We are looking for a soloist/group willing to offer a short lecture on > Korean martial arts, entailing the history, purposes, and cultural origins > of martial arts, followed by a demonstration. > > Thanks for your help, > Crystal Son > (413)597-3606 Sincerely, Rudy National Korean Martial Arts Association ------------------------------ From: "Rudy Timmerman" Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 14:06:29 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Rank Revoke rank????? This tactic might have worked back in the early days, but the martial art community of today has too many options to stand for this sort of strong arming. IMHO, ANY association or person that uses threats or intimidation with regards to revoking rank is on a path of self-destruction. I applaud Master Terry for offering to mediate. Sincerely, Rudy ------------------------------ From: Dave Weller Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 13:19:44 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: rank feud Since this "feud" has been at least partially aired here in the venerable pages of the DD I think it would be interesting for those of us outside the Hapkido community to know what this story is all about. If there have been writings on this in the periodicals, please inform us when and where. Or if the participants care to share their sides (without intermediaries) that would also be cool. I think, from the bits and pieces on here, that the issues at hand here might be of import to everyone in the Martial Arts community. Knowing nothing about the "feud" , but always interested in a good fight, I remain, dave weller student wtf tkd "Practice a thousand hours and you learn self discipline. Practice ten thousand hours and you learn about yourself." Myamoto Musashi ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 12:25:48 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Rank > I applaud Master Terry for offering to mediate. Please, either Ray or Grand Poohbah of the Internet... :) FWIW, I -personally- have found both individuals to be reasonable people in my conversations with them and would love to help (well, perhaps that is overstating it) if I may be of assistance. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 12:26:17 PST Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V9 #19 ******************************* It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Fight Spam! Join CAUCE! == http://www.cauce.org/ Remember 9-11!