Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:30:22 -0800 (PST) From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #166 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sender: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: rterry@idiom.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Unsubscribe: Status: OR Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Traditional or eclectic (Ray Terry) 2. Re: Choson Kwon Bup (Chosondo@aol.com) 3. A little Seoul in Paris (Ray Terry) 4. Re: From the HIDING IN PLAIN SIGHT File (Bruce Sims) 5. ACL reconstruction surgery? (Stan Lim) 6. Re: ACL reconstruction surgery? (Ray Terry) 7. Acupressure (Randall Sexton) 8. Hapkido...and Aikido Thoughts (Randall Sexton) 9. Doctors (SSHapkido@aol.com) 10. Grappling Rules (Braeswood Martial Arts) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:06:33 PST Subject: [The_Dojang] Traditional or eclectic Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Ray: when I think of traditional arts, I think of arts that have passed the > test of time - such as hapkido or taekwondo. When I think of modern arts I > think of arts such as hanmudo or kuksulwon. When you mentioned eclectic arts > the first thing that comes to mind is the 20 year old 14th dan who founded > his own MA after "years of scientific research" (re: ads in the back of any > MA magazine). Although I still wish I had my old 1969 GTO judge from High > School. It was modern then, it then became a classic and soon would be an > antique, unlike the pinto or vega... just my opinion. Yep, sounds reasonable. I see your point. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Chosondo@aol.com Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:08:10 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Choson Kwon Bup Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray: You are correct. The following is the lineage of Choson Kwon Bup: 1. Kim Chon Ji (Founder, 1850) 2. Kim Yong Suk 3. Kim Yi Soo 4. Sun Yu Mun 5. Atamian, Michael A. 6. Didia, Hyman V. 7. Cyrus, Ian A. Um Bup (Passive Methods): Grappling methods and vital point manipulation. Yang Bup (Active Methods): Thrusting, striking, blocking, kicking, butting, dodging methods, foot work, and weaponary. Ui Yak (Medicine): Oriental Medical theory, modalities, diagnosis, and resuscitation methods Um Bup, Yang, and Ui Yak are combined into cohesive and comprehensive methods of proaction and reaction. Unique characteristics of Choson Kwon Bup: 1. There are no lock-out motions as in a basic lead fist thrust. The elbow remains suspended on impact. 2. The body weapon of choice does not remain in contact with the target for more than a "split second" - create fluid shock. 3. Evasion methods are an intergral part of the delivery of all skills. Evasion, dodging and footwork are all meant to assume a position of tactical advantage - occupy the attacker blind spot. 4. Cocking or chambering motions are kept to minimum, i.e. telegraphing is kept to a minimum. Body positioning, footwork, and evasive methods compensates for this techincal error. 5. All motion utilizes angular rotation and eliptical (rotation) movements to reduce joint stress and repetitive strain injuries. To be continued.... Ian A. Cyrus, Headmaster ICF --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:13:14 PST Subject: [The_Dojang] A little Seoul in Paris Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net 'Seoul Park' Opens in Paris on Monday March 25, 2002 Parisians are now able to enjoy a Korean atmosphere, from traditional gardens to other scenic landscapes, without leaving their own city. A small park, named "Seoul Park," opened Monday (March 25) in the capital of France after 15 months of construction, with Seoul Mayor Goh Kun and his counterpart Bertrand Delanoe on hand. The 4,675-square-meter park was established in celebration of the 10th anniversary of sisterhood ties between the two capitals. Located on the northern tip of the Jardin d'Acclimatation in Boulogne woods, a large-scale park visited by some 1.2 million citizens each year, Seoul Park boasts eight major structures, each with its own theme. They are bridge under the moon, street along the stone wall, lawn hill, pavilion, stone floor, pine tree hill, flower bed and bamboo wood. The park also has 2,400 trees. "The park is expected to help Parisians and other Europeans get more familiar with Seoul, as well as help publicize the upcoming World Cup soccer finals in South Korea," said Mayor Goh at the opening ceremony. Seoul provided the construction cost and technology, while Paris offered the site. In a similar case, " Paris Park" was opened in the Mok-dong apartment complex of eastern Seoul in 1987. The government constructed it to mark the 100th anniversary of diplomatic relations between the two countries. Mayor Goh, on a weeklong European tour, will return home on the weekend after visiting London. --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:13:45 -0600 From: "Bruce Sims" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: From the HIDING IN PLAIN SIGHT File Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Ali: "...Sometimes they even leave the organization when things are not going the way they want them too. Has anyone found this to be the case in martial arts?...." Well "no duh," Ali. This isn't like a big revelation to you is it? In a comment I made on another Net I characterized the forces associated with Hapkido as a lot like the forces that build mountains. Certainly you have the plate techtonics which are continually pushing mountains up. Then you also have the constant eroding effects of wind, water and temperature cycles tearing those same mountains down. What do mountains look like? Depends on which set of forces happens to be winning at the time. In Hapkido I identify the forces as follows. 1.) Art degradation: There is never enough time to learn the whole system. Perhaps this is because the teacher is niggardly in disseminating the information. perhaps it is because the student is impatient to enjoy a position of accomplishment or recognition. The result is that the student may only really learn a significant part before leaving to do his own thing. In turn his student only stays long enough to learn a significant portion and then HIS student stays only long enough--- so steadily the art declines in effectiveness and efficiency because the entire corpus no long exisits to provide the unity among disparate techniques that produces the desired effect. 2.) Accretion of techniques: People find that the degraded art no longer holds its own compared to other arts so pratitioners start taking techniques from other places to make up for the arts' developed inadequacies. Nobody goes back to the original artists or master because he is either dead or too far removed from the most current pratitioners. The result is that one force steadily tears down the art while the other force builds it up albeit in a different fashion. Anybody else want to chip in with a heartfelt analysis of the obvious? :-) Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:45:22 +0800 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Stan Lim Subject: [The_Dojang] ACL reconstruction surgery? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello folks, I just found out yesterday that my ACL is torn. Apparently, it occurred nearly 4 years ago during my last TKD tournament. I am now considering surgery and I'd like to get some input from the members of this list. - What sort of procedure did you have? - How much did it cost? (I know it can vary a lot by location) - How well did the recovery go? - How happy are you with the procedure? - Any other comments or words of advise? Kamsahamnida! Stan Lim --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] ACL reconstruction surgery? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:34:04 PST Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I just found out yesterday that my ACL is torn. Apparently, it occurred > nearly 4 years ago during my last TKD tournament. I am now considering > surgery and I'd like to get some input from the members of this list. Yes, folks, and I was there when it happened. Or at least I clearly remember Mr. Lim limping around at the end of that day down in LA-land. Stan, so sorry to hear the bad news. Hopefully the folks here will chime in with some excellent advice. Take care of yourself my friend. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Randall Sexton" To: Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:59:49 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Acupressure Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ok, just send me $50 and I'll send you the certificate! Site not opening up must have been an internet fluke as I'm playing with it all the time..I have no toys! Randall Sexton www.laughinghara.com From: CKCtaekwon@cs.com I'm afraid to send you any money, you didn't promise the books, only the names, besides when I went to your web site, the first page opened up, then when I clicked on Hapkido, the entire page disappeared, nothing came up. Makes me wonder about the $247, would it disappear? :) have a great day! --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Randall Sexton" To: Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:40:48 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Hapkido...and Aikido Thoughts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "On another point, but applicable to the same line of reasoning is the matter of "compliance" or "cooperation" between practitioners. Unfortunately, at least in the art of Aikido, this has perhaps been taken to a fault. I will leave that for memebers of that art to address this." Years ago, I visited an Aikido school in Baton Rouge three times while I was there on business. Their joint locks were so loose that I thought I was being caressed. Their rationale was, that in a real fight, you would be so pumped up that the techniques would work! The instructor that night paired up with my wife and got peeved because she kept throwing him down. She gave me a look that said "what am I supposed to do?" We also did an exercise where we placed a paperback book on our head and did some exercises. His fell off; mine didn't, but then I had started reading at a very early age! To each his own! Randall Sexton www.laughinghara.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: SSHapkido@aol.com Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:02:07 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Doctors Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have seen it noted several times to remember that 50% of all doctors finish in the bottom half of their class. Might I point out that these 50 % are still among the top 2 % in the world when you consider the education level they have attained. So give that bottom half a break. Dr. S PS. Not in the bottom half. --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:24:09 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Grappling Rules Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Greeting Mr. Sexton, I have read over your post again and again. I keep going back to some of my teachings and have come up with this for you to consider. As I assume to not have your experience I believe you have more than likely thought of these yourself. The rules limit you to ground grappling techniques. This is an acquired art either through training or being a younger sibling. (LOL) I suggest using this to your advantage. As a "Hapkido Guy" I assume you have done knee and foot ground rules grappling There is an old Korean style of fighting that I cannot come of with the name of at the moment. But it involves and sand pit, a rope that ties one leg and one arm immobile and the first one to fall loses. There are similar move in the one knee one foot rules of grappling. One thing that comes to mind is the fact if you get a very large opponent, you may want to get him/her on his knees and bend him over backwards. As a woman I have found using large muscle group structures to my advantage works very well. Just a thought, that I am sure you have already considered. "sometimes you need to ask if the printer is turned on when they ask why a document doesn't print" Always with a smile. Kat from Houston --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest