Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 14:57:57 -0700 (PDT) From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #280 - 6 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sender: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: rterry@idiom.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Unsubscribe: Status: OR Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Black Belts (Burdick, Dakin Robert) 2. Is Sparring Necessary (Dunn, Danny J RASA) 3. Re: BB (Sparring as a requirement) (Anne Skjold) 4. [Eskrima] Ties That Bind (Ray Terry) 5. I have decided to join new school (Ken McDonough) 6. Korean Terminology - Knee break (Damian Jones) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Burdick, Dakin Robert" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 08:31:20 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Black Belts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Clinton Boit wrote: > "Should everyone who trains adequately BE promoted if they meet the minimum > requirements?" You pretty much answered your own question here. If they are adequately trained and can do the minimum requirements, they pass, if only just barely. > "Should examination requirements be adjusted for people with special needs? > If so, where do you draw the line and what should you consider/not-consider > for a special needs?" That's up to you. What does the black belt mean to you? If character is more important than physical technique, then anyone who shows character and spirit can pass, regardless of their skill or abilities. If you view the black belt as a teaching degree, then the person has to be able to teach (and that means they have to be able to do the technique in the first place). One of the problems with this is that most schools are locked into the "belt=$" stance, where they are selling belts because the belts keep students coming to practice (and, they would argue, isn't that's what important anyways?). My opinion is that this is a bad idea. It CAN work, but it can also fail spectacularly. It can devalue the rank, and can introduce instructors who can't teach or worse, who don't even try (I've seen this one in action and it is devastating to a school). That said, let me also add that I believe martial arts should be taught by amateurs, not professionals, which of course colors my opinion. To my mind, there's better ways to make money than teaching martial arts, and if one keeps the money out of the equation, relations with one's students become a lot easier. Too often I either see students behaving like consumers (I put my time in, give me my belt!) and instructors acting like salesmen rather than guides (Of course you should join the black belt club! Everyone should train like I do!). > Lastly (sorry this is a lot o' questions), SPARRING for black belt ranks - I > have some up-and-coming gup students who are deathly afraid of sparring. > They spar in class, but are very hesitant due to fear of injury. If these > students are great students and rock when they do one-steps, fundamentals, > forms, etc....should they be held back as the go for 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th > Dans, etc. due to poor (not "equal-to-average ability") sparring? It sounds like they have other strengths, but if you are going to have them teach sparring, you ought to make sure they are not afraid of it. If they have legitimate fears of injury (for example, if they're in the 40 and over club), then perhaps you should promote them for what they're good at, but designate OTHER people to teach sparring. After all, you're going to need more instructors to teach fundamentals and forms than you will need to teach sparring. Yours in the arts, Dakin Burdick burdickd@indiana.edu --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Dunn, Danny J RASA" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 10:18:35 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Is Sparring Necessary Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Boit, I mean no disrespect, but the way you gave the background to your questions indicates that you are conflicted, as a therapist would say. I would say that if you really go back and examine what your art is to you and how you define it for yourself, you will have the answer. Now you may be just looking for some others who agree with you. In essence, your black belts are mirrors of you and your philosophy. As such they should mirror your personal ideals. Will all be perfect? No, absolutely none will. But they will represent your goals and ideals. But let me ask you another question to help clarify. If these students were performing their forms poorly, or their basic soo ki and jok ki, or their one step sparring, would you be asking this question? I have seen tkd association BB tests where the only form the testers were given to perform were their ranking form, and when asked to do a junior form, less than half the testers could do it. Sure didn't leave much of a positive impression about that association or its members in my mind. Sometimes the situation you asked about is difficult to deal with. But you might want to take a look at how your school trains in sparring. I believe it is better to wait 3-6 months to begin sparring, however the new students always are required to attend and watch. I also like to begin sparring using black belt or 3rd gups or above as partners. That way they have control, and can focus on letting beginners learn in a coaching environment. I also don't have any contact for beginning sparrers. I believe contact should increase gradually as the students' skill increases. Danny Dunn <<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for your time! Clinton L Boit, 5th Dan Sr Instructor of AIT Schools --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Anne Skjold" To: Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 11:07:25 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: BB (Sparring as a requirement) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net My question/opinion on this matter is why if your school is not 'sport' oriented, why would sparring even be a requirement? My school is not 'sport' orientated, although it is required to learn sparring techniques and sparring series' we are not required to spar to attainour BB, our instructors pphilosphy is that if you do everything well in an attack situation you will be able to "spar'. I do spar in tournaments etc. but one of my peers, doesnot and never has and probally never will. I do not believe the essesnce of a BB or a martial "art" is to be profient in the act of sparring or as some refer to it controlled fighting. Respectfully, Anne 1st Dan, WTF TKD --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net, policedo@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 04 Jun 2002 10:47:10 PDT Subject: [The_Dojang] [Eskrima] Ties That Bind Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Of possible interest to those on this list. Ray Forwarded message: Filipino Rope Techniques The Ties That Bind your Attacker by Andrew Breen Most martial artist familiar with the lightning-quick, staccato strikes of Filipino stick and blade arts. Few however, are aware of the unusual rope techniques of Filipino pananandata. Incorporating flexible weapons as well as the more common impact and edged weapons, pananandata is taught primarily in the central Luzon regions of the Philippines. The name pananandata is derived from Sanskrit, reflecting the historical and cultural origins of the Tagalog-speaking people of the Philippines. Pananandata incorporates the usual array of Filipino weapons, including the single stick, double stick, and the dagger-as well as any combination thereof. In addition it also encompasses a fully developed sub- system of rose and chain techniques not generally seen in the other Filipino fighting styles. There are a variety of rope and chain techniques to choose from, depending on the length, weight, strength, and "drop" characteristics of each particular weapon. For example, a chain, cord, or heavy rope can be used for whipping strikes. Lighter rope and twine, on the other hand, are nearly useless for striking purposes, but can be easily fashioned into a noose to capture or bind an opponent's arm, leg or neck. To understand the most effective usage of a given rope, its "drop" characteristics must first be considered. Simply put, a rope's "drop" refers to the way it falls or drops when one end is released. The heavier the rope, the "cleaner" the drop. According to Amante P. Marinas Sr., a 40-year practitioner of pananandata, "Ropes that drop clean are ideal for capture. Ropes that don't (drop clean) will need coaxing." Technique #1 The length of a rope is another factor to consider. If the rope has too much slack, it is difficult to capture the opponent's neck or arm because you cannot close the noose quickly. Most ropes, chains or belts should be three to four feet in length for best results. "If a rope is longer than the distance between your outstretched arms, you will be unable to stretch it by pulling its ends," Marinas notes. "The remaining slack lessens your control of the rope and makes it harder to snap quickly around the target." Closely related to a rope's drop characteristics is its weight. A belt or chain, for instance, could be used for preliminary strikes before employing an ensnaring technique. Generally, however, a thicker or more cumbersome weapon is easier for an adversary to see, and thus, defend against. A shoelace, while not an effective striking device, can be easily concealed due to its lack of substance. By hiding the shoelace in the fist of one hand, it can be brought suddenly into play and applied as a noose around the attacker's neck. It is important to differentiate between striking and capturing techniques. Pananandata rope techniques emphasize choking and binding tactics, not strikes. If a rope is heavy enough to deliver a stinging strike, so much the better. The real value of pananandata rope techniques, however, is their effectiveness in terms of immobilizing an opponent. Regardless of how strong or aggressive an opponent may be, he will not be able to resist a properly applied rope choke or arm lock. Unlike some empty-hand restraint and choking techniques, pananandata rope maneuvers do not depend on large hands, arm strength, or the like. Once the opponent is entangled in the rope or chain, leverage takes over and effects his submission. The arms and neck make the best targets for capturing techniques. Arm seizures are designed to neutralize and immobilize an attacking weapon such as a knife, stick or fist. Double-limb captures, whereby an attacker's follow-up strike is also restrained with the rope, are also possible. Technique #2 For a variety of reasons, the pananandata system places a greater emphasis on attacking the opponent's neck. For one thing, neck captures are usually safer than arm ensnaring techniques-once you have closed the distance, that is. In addition, applying an improvised noose to an attacker allows you much more control over his fate. Capturing and cinching the neck is, in effect, the same as garroting an assailant. A well-executed choke stops an attacker cold, preventing him from continuing his assault. The footwork involved in pananandata rope techniques is similar to that used with other weapons. According to Marinas, all advances and retreats should be done at an angle for safety's sake. Moving toward or away from an opponents attack at a 45-degree angle keeps the body out of the line of assault. Such angled footwork also places one end of the rope in an ideal position for the application of the noose. Marinas also advocates using short, quick steps rather than long ones. Shorter steps enable an individual to maintain his balance and execute the technique with control. In most cases, it is necessary to "soften up" the opponent with preliminary strikes before attempting a rope technique. Attempting to directly ensnare a free-swinging opponent's jab or, worse, his quick knife thrust, is not only next to impossible, but downright suicide. The key is to first stun the opponent and then wrap the rope around his arm or neck. "I use mostly an uppercut to the side, and then apply the choke or capture," Marinas notes. He also uses a double clap to the eardrum after maneuvering behind the at- tacker, then draws the loop tightly around his opponent's neck. The striking techniques not only stun the opponent, they also keep him from moving away before you apply the noose. To ensure the success of the ensnaring maneuver, it may be a good idea to hit the opponent two, three, or even four times during the course of the technique. The blows do not have to be heavy, just enough to facilitate the rope technique. Technique #3 To practice pananandata rope techniques, have a partner remain stationary, then slowly work on capturing his arm or neck and tightening the rope. Your partner aids in the process by extending his arm or lowering his head to simplify the capture. Once you have the basic maneuver down, the next step is to employ the ensnaring techniques against your partner's simulated attacks. While practicing, be sure to integrate the proper footwork and striking patterns so they will become second nature. Care must also be exercised to prevent injuries. A practitioner's empty-hand skills may be the most significant factor in whether a rope technique works. Before the technique can be applied, the practitioner must first evade and/or block his opponent's attack, counterattack as he closes the gap, and then strike again with stunning techniques to set up the ensnaring maneuver. "Without good empty hands, forget the rope," Marinas says. "You have to understand unarmed self-defense first." Thus, pananandata rope techniques operate in the reverse of other Filipino weapons. Generally, Filipino stylists first learn the concepts of armed combat application, then progress to empty-hand maneuvers. With rope binding techniques, however, practitioners must be fairly proficient in unarmed tactics before attempting captures and immobilization maneuvers. Once you have learned basic rope skills, you will discover that other flexible devices- electrical cords, belts, neckties, etc.- can be improvised into weapons as well. After all, you may not have a rope or chain available when you are attacked on the street. These other devices, however, can be just as effective. Pananandata rope techniques offer another option for defending yourself in the unpredictable arena of personal combat. Next time you are attacked on the street, imagine your assailant's surprise when you tie up his punch and yank him to the ground. It's a conceivable defense with Filipino rope techniques - the ties that bind. About the author: Andrew Breen is a Boston-based freelance writer. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 10:38:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Ken McDonough To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] I have decided to join new school Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Finally decided to get back to some serious training. Here is the course curriculum: Big Ken -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Damian Jones" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 04 Jun 2002 18:12:03 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean Terminology - Knee break Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi, You wrote enquiring about the Korean for "Two Hand Rolling Push Block (as in Ge Baek) Knee Break (As in Koryo) Outer Forearm Guarding Block (as in Do San) Knife Hand Augmented Guarding Block with palms up (as In Po Eun, but Middle Section) Tornado Crescent Kick Sliding Axe Kick Hidden Strength Thanks Again The One and Only... Tink" The knee break in Koryo is "mureup keokki" Not sure about the ITF forms as I think their terminology is slightly different. Axe kick is "naeryo chagi" not sure about sliding though. Hope this helps Damian _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest