Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 17:31:27 -0700 (PDT) From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #292 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sender: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: rterry@idiom.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Unsubscribe: Status: OR Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. RE: Korean Term (Woodard Brian (ChW/TEF8)) 2. RE: Korean Term (Wallace, John) 3. utz! (Davide Sorrentino) 4. Anne's Questions and Sparring (Dunn, Danny J RASA) 5. CDT (Morgan James) 6. Sparring & Fighting (Randall Sexton) 7. Compassion (Patrick L) 8. Parks and Rec Program Problems (Dunn, Danny J RASA) 9. RE: "Hey!!" (Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov) 10. Re: Parks & Rec Martial Arts Programs (Rob & Julie Frankovich) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Woodard Brian (ChW/TEF8)" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Korean Term Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 10:58:33 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net James; The "utz" is basically a "kia". Everybody develops their own unique "kia" sound. Usually a new student uses the word "kia" or "utz" in one-step & three-step sparring exercises to emphasize a "fight-ending" techniques or blow. Once your breathing techniques are second nature your own unique "kia" will emerge With each movement there is proper breathing (slightly audible exhale like boxers). The "kia" shout basically is used to focus your power into the "fight-ending" or finishing technique. Hope this helps. :o) Brian -----Original Message----- From: Morgan James [mailto:James.Morgan@TriadHospitals.com] Sent: Monday, June 10, 2002 9:42 AM To: 'Dojang Digest' Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean Term I'm still looking for the meaning of the Korean term "Utz". My instructor used to make us use this term when we were doing 1 and 3-step sparring. The person throwing the punch used to say "Utz" as in "Are you ready?". When the defender was ready he would also reply with "Utz" as in "Yes, I am. Throw the punch." On the World Tae Kwon Do Association website under the Summer Camp slideshow section there is a picture with the phrase "As the Utz is sounded at reverse punch, its echo reverberates throughout the valley." So, now I'm confused on it's real meaning. Thanks. James GTKDA _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Wallace, John" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Korean Term Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 09:06:00 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I think some Japanese karate styles kihap (or kiai...) by hissing "Osssss". Actually, I've heard that this might be a Western affectation...a mis-translation of the original usage. Sometimes I wonder what a native Korean would think of the various rituals we use in the dojang. I wonder if they would find anything familiar - or if it would be sort of a surreal experience, like walking into a Black Angus steak restaurant and seeing the waiters wearing McDonald's uniforms and poofy Chef's hats, with the patrons sitting on bar stools around low Japanese tables eating kid's breakfast cereal. If you know what I mean -JW -----Original Message----- From: Morgan James [mailto:James.Morgan@TriadHospitals.com] Sent: Monday, June 10, 2002 6:42 AM To: 'Dojang Digest' Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean Term I'm still looking for the meaning of the Korean term "Utz". My instructor used to make us use this term when we were doing 1 and 3-step sparring. The person throwing the punch used to say "Utz" as in "Are you ready?". When the defender was ready he would also reply with "Utz" as in "Yes, I am. Throw the punch." On the World Tae Kwon Do Association website under the Summer Camp slideshow section there is a picture with the phrase "As the Utz is sounded at reverse punch, its echo reverberates throughout the valley." So, now I'm confused on it's real meaning. Thanks. James GTKDA _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Davide Sorrentino" To: Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 18:18:04 +0200 Subject: [The_Dojang] utz! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi to all!!! But "Utz!" seems the same of Kyokushinkai karate "Osu!"... Let me understand... David from Naples, Italy... --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Dunn, Danny J RASA" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 11:22:18 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Anne's Questions and Sparring Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Anne, Maybe I misunderstood what you intended to say, but you said: <<< we are not required to spar to attain BB>>> I am still not clear exactly on whether you are required to spar in your school or not. I don't have your original post in front of me, but I thought you said something about not having to spar unless you wanted too. What you said in your last post was you were not tested on sparring on your BB test. Anne you said: <<<<< in an attack situation you will be able to 'spar'.>>>>>> I replied: <<< I don't believe sparring can be called fighting, even controlled. I have to disagree with your instructor. Fighting is a totally different world, even from sparring, and it should also be practiced as realistically as possible. Just because you know how to do a technique does not mean you can do it under an adrenaline rush, and with a non-cooperative partner. Also, you have to learn how to deal with being hit.>> Then Anne replied: <<>> I guess I don't understand what you are saying then. Are you saying you and your instructor consider sparring an "attack situation"? Or are you saying That, "in a real defense situation when you are attacked, you will spar"? My original comment above was for the latter interpretation of your statement. However, if your instructor considers sparring to be an attack, then I would say he is missing the point of sparring. You are welcome for my input. And I am very glad to hear that you were able to defend yourself successfully when you were attacked. And to your current question, yes I commonly have students work with partners both with and without sparring equipment on "set sparring" (my name for it) particularly with new combinations, counters to combinations, timing and guard recovery. And yes, bruises are common in my classes as well. Danny Dunn --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Morgan James To: 'Dojang Digest' Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 13:28:21 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] CDT Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net A while back I asked all of you DD studs and studettes about CDT vs. Krav Maga. All of the responses I recieved both here and privately suggested that I go with CDT because of it's direction toward liability issues, etc. I spent this last week in Glasgow, Kentucky participating in the Level IV Tactical Master Certification course and let me tell you all something. It was worth every second and every dime!! The techniques that you learn in CDT will by without a doubt stand up in a court of law should you have to go for defending yourself legally. I seriously doubt if this would be the case in Krav Maga. Yes, KM seems to be a very very effective system in regards to self-defense. But if you are not careful they could get you in serious legal trouble. Keep in mind that this is just my personal opinion. My CDT instructor did NOT at anytime say anything similiar to "CDT is better than Krav Maga because.......". He was way to professional to make such a statement. If anyone of you are looking into CDT for whatever reason, you cannot go wrong with deciding to go with it. I very glad I did and I look forward to a long career in CDT. This system that Thomas Patire has created is surely awesome! Just my 2 cents. James GTKDA --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Randall Sexton" To: Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 13:39:49 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Sparring & Fighting Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Randall: >> Considering that sparring is fake fighting and it does not come close to a street fight, why would you want to emphasize it? There are some benefits to > it, but only as a training mechanism and not as a measuring device for fighting ability. It will only train you to be a good sparring person. If that's what you want to develop, go for it.>> "So what are you saying. This person may be afraid to spar, but in a real-life combat situation there may be no problem??" How did you come up with this from my above paragraph? Give me a break. Sparring is not street-fighting, well that's true. But it somebody can't even spar, he sure as hell can't fight in a real-life situation. J No, I'm not going to give you a break! If you train to spar, you learn to defend yourself from someone who is sparring against you. Let's see here. Get in a big room with lot's of space and with all kinds of protective gear. Stand up in front of another guy dressed just like you who knows what you are about to do. Someone shout, "Go" and let the rumble began. I think schools who start adults or kids off sparring from day one are really doing them a disservice. First, they don't know anything and are just whaling the bejesus out of each other (and reinforcing bad habits) or they get hurt and are turned off or become paralyzed when someone shouts "boo" at them. Same goes for breaking boards or hitting a heavy bag without being trained for it. Break your wrist as a yellow belt and you have that memory everytime you step up to the bag. You train as realistically as possible without killing your students. Same goes for training for war. That includes the body but mostly the mind. If I wanted to test them, I guess I could hire someone to stand beside them in, say an elevator, them jump them like a Tasmanian devil! You think a lot of punches and kicks hurt? Look at all the sports events where the players smash each other in the face without going down. I let my students, particularly my BB TKD and TSD students who come in hit me full force with punches and kicks, just to get them started on the right path. It's an eye opener! People who train to spar have been smashed to bits by many a street fighter. I've sparred maybe 3-4 times (with mouthpiece and cup only) and realized quickly that I was wasting my time. My real life experience after learning MA was in an Adult Psychiatric Intensive Care Unit with psychotic people who felt no pain and who were five times stronger than normal. My original post was why would you want to emphasize sparring? It still stands. I train as if I could die at any time and believe me I'm ready at any time! The shotgun under my bed is even pointing in the correct direction should I need to roll out of bed and shoot those Taliban parachuting in my back yard! Randall Sexton www.laughinghara.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Patrick L" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 12:17:26 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Compassion Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Teressa, >...then you would know what it feels like, and have more compassion. For both sides.< Neither you nor I NEED more compassion. You and I disagree with how the portions should be meted out. Getting in the WAY, Patrick _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Dunn, Danny J RASA" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 14:47:08 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Parks and Rec Program Problems Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mark, The 2 biggest problems I had, and I had similar experiences in different areas, are 1) schedule changes where other programs and activities are given priority for a multi-use space, and 2) problems with running a program year-round. Most things these systems deal with are seasonal, so they tend to treat a martial arts class as if it had a 3 month season, then its over till next year, as with sports. Hope that helps. Danny Dunn PS. Locable storage space for equipment can be a problem. Some places don't have it so you have to carry equipment with you all the time. Other places have so many keys floating that you never know if your equipment will be there. Solved this one place by changing out the lock. --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 14:22:57 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: "Hey!!" Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear James: "....So, now I'm confused on it's real meaning....." I have no idea if this will help but the standard greeting in Kyokushinkai Karate is "osu" and is used habitually in the dojo, at seminars and sometimes even at social gatherings. It is the Japanese equivilent of saying "Hey". Depending on the circumstances I have heard it used to mean "Yes, Sir", "OK, I'm ready", "Hi-ya" and so forth. Consider it the "Swiss Army Knife" of MA recognition signals. My best guess is that Korean practitioners of various Japnese arts picked-up the habit during their training experience and just incorporated into their training ettiquette. It IS habit-forming. I have not been in a KK school for about 19 years and I still catch myself using it on and off the mat. FWIW. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 18:51:43 -0500 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Rob & Julie Frankovich Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Parks & Rec Martial Arts Programs Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mark (& All) - I've been running Parks & Rec (or Community Education, depending upon where you are) for 12 years. I've enjoyed the simplicity but it hasn't been a career. I like that I don't have to handle the registration and I get paid a class fee split (70% to me/30% to program) and profit from test fees & equipment/supply sales. I've let the Program decide the class fee, figuring that they know their clientele pretty well. A couple instructors in the area have the class fee paid monthly but a a bit lower rate than someone signing up with them. I also like that I get built in "breaks" during holidays. I don't like being at the mercy of the school's schedule and not having access because the school wants to run a program/event in my room. In the Twin Cities, Parks & Rec often "rent" gyms from the school districts to be able to expand their programming. This causes the above mentioned problem and can affect where the class gets to be held. My Brooklyn Center class has been moved 3 time in 4 years and will get moved again in hte Fall. Also, I don't like holiday breaks ;^) because people get time off and distracted from class. Overall, until my non-profit gets some grants funded or a good corporate sponsor so I can open studio, I greatly enjoy the classes and have about 40 active students between a Parks & Rec class & a Community Ed. class. Rob Frankovich Pine Tree Taekwondo www.tigerconsulting.org/taekwondo.htm >From: TNTcombatives@aol.com >Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 01:10:42 EDT >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >Subject: [The_Dojang] Parks & Rec Martial Arts Programs >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > >Greetings all, > > I was asked recently if I would be willing to start up a MA program >for the city's (my employer) parks & rec program. I have previously owned >and operated a regular TKD school, but would like the input of those >distinguished DD members who currently operate their classes through a parks & > rec. Pitfalls, advice, cautions, start up tips, costs, tuition rates >etc.....feel free to reply off list if you want. I'm sure I could figure it >out, but would rather not reinvent the wheel. > >Take Care, >Mark Gajdostik. ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest