Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 22:18:35 -0700 (PDT) From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #296 - 12 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sender: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: rterry@idiom.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Unsubscribe: Status: OR Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Sparring vs Fighting (Randall Sexton) 2. Training (Randall Sexton) 3. RE:Retirement Stuff (Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov) 4. Re: RE:Retirement Stuff (Ray Terry) 5. Dallas Area Hapkido (Farral, Kim) 6. More sparring (Charles Richards) 7. Break the chains Ray! (Charles Richards) 8. Ray, here's a thought (Gregory Giddins) 9. Thanks Mr. Beck=on the road again ! (Ken McDonough) 10. Sparring and KM Stuff (Alagna, Steven M) 11. Retirement travels (Rudy Timmerman) 12. Sweet Science of Boxing: Number 1 (Ken McDonough) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Randall Sexton" To: Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 00:26:43 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Sparring vs Fighting Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Randall... My Opinion...I don't know how you train your students to spar or fight or whatever you wish to call it, but you have a minor flaw in your concept of teaching sparring to students. Not a concept, but an observation of SOME schools. ..first of all you don't just put a bunch of white belts and yellow belts in an area with sparring gear or safety gear and tell them to start... you first teach them how to stand, how to react, how to move, how to block, kick, and punch in accordance with their opponents body position and movements...you teach them step by step...you start them out very slowly with very simple sparring against each other so they can become comfortable with someone kicking and punching at them...as they progress in rank....their speed, timing, coordination, power, and focus continue to develop...eventually they learn to respond and react on instinct and learn exactly how much power to use against an opponent depending upon the threat... Congrats; I have no problem with this. A Martial artist who is adept at sparring and has the correct mental perspective as well as self confidence has no trouble defending themselves in a real fight... going full out all the time teaches them only to hurt other people regardless of the situation...no control..no focus...just all out power...that is not the martial arts...they don't learn to read their opponent or their opponent's intent...they just know to go full out when challenged...so they have learned nothing of what the martial arts are all about...being paranoid is not the sign of a martial artist who can defend them self...being aware and ready is The One and Only... Tink I agree partly (and we're only talking opinion here). Control, focus etc., is part of martial arts, however, when you're life is in danger you must be the wildest dog, tiger, (pick your meanest animal) in the jungle. You're training will hopefully, unconsciously, translate into the "correct response." Being aware is big part of my training, but not paranoia. Also, you do not, in a street fight, have much "reading time." I can't remember where I read this (it may be a legend) but one Chinese master started two students at the same time. One started learning to spar while the other did nothing but Chi exercises. When the student who sparred all the time reached green belt level, he put them in a ring and the student who only did chi exercises soundly beat the other. Also, let me quote Loren Christensen here since he seems to have some fans on the BB. A cop with 29 years of experience, he says that not one fight went down exactly like a karate sparring match. "To me, sparring is only a training device, not an end objective and definitely not a determiner of real fighting ability." Anyway, thanks for the dialog. Randall Sexton www.laughinghara.com --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Randall Sexton" To: Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 00:28:57 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Training Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Randall, Got me curious. Exactly how do you train? Danny Dunn Tired and going to bed..will answer later. Why does your name sound familar? Randall Sexton www.laughinghara.com --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 08:07:04 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE:Retirement Stuff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Ray: Congratulations!!! HP is losing a good man. "......What will I do? Enjoy the summer! ......" Tell you what. Go visit Korea and lose yourself in the mountains. In about 30 years somebody will show-up in Seoul telling everyone about how he learned weapons stuff from an itinerant, nameless warrior. The rest of us will only nod knowingly when we note the stooped posture and stiff wrists reminiscent of said warriors' rounded shoulders and carpal tunnel. :-) Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] RE:Retirement Stuff To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 7:27:23 PDT Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > learned weapons stuff from an itinerant, nameless warrior. The rest of us > will only nod knowingly when we note the stooped posture and stiff wrists > reminiscent of said warriors' rounded shoulders and carpal tunnel. :-) We've never met, yet you seem to know me well... Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Farral, Kim" To: 'DoJang Digest' Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 09:06:26 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Dallas Area Hapkido Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net For the Dallas Area... Contact Master Larry LaLanne in Arlington...Hopefully he will be able to help you...I belive he has retired from Instructing but should be able to provide you with some names and locations...i am not sure if this phone number is still accurate but here it is with the last addresses I have for him... Home Arlington, Texas 76016 (817) 572 - 6230 School 1308 W. Arkansas Arlington, Texas (817) 795 - 3217 K. G. Farral Staff Mechanical Engineer ITT Industries 7310 Innovation Blvd. P.O. Box 731 Ft. Wayne, Indiana 46801-0731 Ph: (219) 451-5312 Fax: (219) 451-5476 kim.farral@itt.com ************************************ If this email is not intended for you, or you are not responsible for the delivery of this message to the addressee, please note that this message may contain ITT Privileged/Proprietary Information. In such a case, you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. You should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Information contained in this message that does not relate to the business of ITT is neither endorsed by nor attributable to ITT. ************************************ [demime 0.98e removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef] --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 07:19:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Charles Richards To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] More sparring Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <> I was able to defend myself mainly I believe because I have been trained to remain calm and I have confidence in my ability.. Why do you believe that free sparring is an important part of the curriculum? <> Anne, I view my new gups as black diamonds. As their instructor it's my job to apply enough and the right kind of pressure to be a catalyst for growth. As much as us gray beard's tell war stories about the old days, the Darwin method of blackbelt development really doesn't work in the USA (start with 100 students, and the 1 or 2 that survive my training make blackbelt). So how can I apply pressure that simulates the stress of a self defense situation. Free sparring (addrinaline rush and live unwilling opponent) Breaking (overcomming fears) Group Tests (performance ansiety, one chance to get it right) I'd say you were able to stay calm in your self defense situation due to your instructor applying some of these "pressures" to you.... Free sparring is an important part of my cirriculumn and learning to "fight/defend" because it developes skills needed for an adept martial artist, and skills that could be used to defend yourself; Distance judgement Timing Footwork Strategy Endurance If you spar at somepoint like Master Dunn and I (continuous) It can teach you how to slip, roll with a technique, and counter off of taking a hit.... So if you add some serious Hyungs practice (IMHO) you have a balanced martial artist with skills (muscle memories) developed to a level that could be used to defend yourself. Know as to some crackhead going tazmainian on you, would you rather have no muscle memories/skills as options, or some options? Yours in Jung Do, Charles Richards Moja Kwan TangSooDo Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 07:26:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Charles Richards To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Break the chains Ray! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <> I have accepted an early retirement offer from HP. Friday, June 28 will be my HP retirement date. Why do you care? After June 28 any email addrs for me ending in hp.com, like this one, will cease to function. Please use rterry@idiom.com if you need to reach me via private email. What will I do? Enjoy the summer! It will be my first summer off in ~25 years. I'll probably travel, teach, train and get in a few week-or-so long bicycle trips. I'll also probably travel a bit around Europe and elsewhere teaching weapons seminars. A few months (years?) down the road maybe I'll get bored and look for another job. <> Congrads on being unchained from the corporate world! That would make you free for the USKMAF TGT Party in August in Jackson and the Moja Kwan TSD/TKD party in September in North GA (Atlanta Metro) both are long trips so consider yourself invited :-) Put me on the mailing list for your weapons seminars, any planned for hotlanta? Yours in Jung Do, CHarles Richards Moja Kwan TangSooDo Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Gregory Giddins To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 09:48:24 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Ray, here's a thought Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hey Ray! Here's a new carreer idea: You could always come out to fiery Colorado and help us fight (read: watch in helplessness) the fires. Didn't you ever want to be a fireman? Greg G. --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 09:30:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Ken McDonough To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Thanks Mr. Beck=on the road again ! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Beck noted, in part: Thanks for the lead. I am gonna wait next time before I ask readers for recommendations for schools. Why ? Cause I am interviewing all over the place. Allentown, PA., last week, Dallas, Texas on Monday, Bedford, MA., on Tues, Quantico, VA., next Monday. One job requires 50% travel. Wow ! I could visit Dojangs throughout the Eastern seaboard and come up with some great stories. Meanwhile, I am starting some boxing classes tonight, re: stances, defense, combinations. "I am just a vagabond..." (source: Rudy Valee (sic), now deceased). Big Ken Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Alagna, Steven M" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 13:38:34 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Sparring and KM Stuff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Tink stated: ""A Martial artist who is adept at sparring and has the correct mental perspective as well as self confidence has no trouble defending themselves in a real fight..."" I really like what you say in your post except completely disagree with your above statement. Do you have any references to show this to be true?? Statistics?? Police reports?? First off a fight means you've consented to engage and you are now squaring off against your *opponent*. I'm more interested in *surviving* and attack, which is more likely to be a sucker punch or ambush... I'm hoping to avoid a fight by using my avoidance and awareness skills. Do you really think a MA that has those qualities is ready for every situation... a bad a$% biker who believes you cut him off who's used to regularly scraping with other bad a$% bikers... a 250 lb. gang banger jacked up on PCP... a professional thief/mugger that is going to anticipate what you are going to do... Do you ever watch cops when it takes 4 or 5 LEO's to bring down some dude who doesn't want to be controlled. "No trouble"... man that is a scary statement... I wish I had that much confidence... I know a lot of heavy-hitters in the MA world that are former/current bouncers, special forces, gangbangers, LEO's, people who have been there that will tell you surviving an attack is only a 50% probability. I firmly believe in training and so do they, but nothing is 100% and we are only trying to improve our odds. That much confidence will get you hurt or God forbid killed. Also, I believe being a little paranoid goes a long way, we need to be constantly looking for blind spots, which by definition is something we don't know is there, thanks again for that Animal (Marc MacYoung)!! James stated: ""Yes, KM seems to be a very very effective system in regards to self-defense. But if you are not careful they could get you in serious legal trouble."" I have heard that they KM does teach about the legalities, you probably just have to find the right school. I think too many people make blanket statements about a certain art or system. You don't want to rule anything out until you've visited a particular school and talked to the instructor. Nor do I nowhere see in KM where they tell you to beat the liv'in hell out of someone when attacked. Their knife defenses show an initial defense/offense, a close in trapping/restraint, a disarm, and then escape. Disarms are questionable and may not always be there, but they didn't show the defender kicking the snot out the person after and then stabbing them. There was the disarm and then escape. Steve --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 17:09:04 -0400 From: "Rudy Timmerman" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Retirement travels Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello Ray: I hope you know you are always welcome to travel North. My home is your home, and my Dojang is open to all. Happy retirement! Sincerely, Rudy --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 20:35:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Ken McDonough To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Sweet Science of Boxing: Number 1 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net First class in boxing on June 12, 2002. One instructor has fought professionally. Some information is basic, other new stuff. Lesson I. a. Hand wraps. b. Front stance: lead with left (if right handed), right foot in back in natural stance (no back stance). Always keep feet apart, do not drag, but step. c. Side stance. d. Pivot stance. Left foot always serves as pivot point despite direction of movement. e. Defense. Hands always in front. Never drop hands or pull one hand down as in Karate. -- Use right hand to catch X's jab. Don't reach. -- Elbows in, protect waist to face. -- Shoulder rolled toward X. f. Posture; Keep shoulder in front with body slightly angled to opponent. Hands in front. Knees slightly bent. Use "turtle shell" crouch. g. Drills: Use above knowledge to follow opponent using stances and changing angles and directions. -- back to front and back drill -- side to side drill -- follow opponent, changing directions h. Offense. Use above drills to employ jab. Jab=straight out, fully extended. Use string analogy to return jab to starting point. Keep shoulder toward opponent, and right hand near face (not to close). Change tempo. i. Offense 2. Catch opponents jab, switching directions, tempo, and timing. j. Speedbag= tempo drill; use side punch method, not to hard. Complete by going thru bag. Employ flat elliptical motion. k. Heavy bag= use jab only employing posture, stance, change of direction. Not to hard, get joints use to heavy bag. Change direction and timing of jab. l. Exercises. - Shoulder rolls. - Knee bends (4 count) - Situps (keep hands in front) and switch to cross overs. - Pushups (several series of boxer's pushups using 2 counts for one rep). - Stretching exercises. --Employ your own or use what shown, re: various stretches from arms to legs. Other comments: Bring water. Heavy use of timing rounds machine. Work 2 minute rounds, rest 1 minute. Move to different stations, re: speed bag, heavy bag, medicine ball, double end ball, jump rope. End of Lesson 1. McD... Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest