Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 12:25:47 -0500 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #322 - 8 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sender: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Today's Topics: 1. seminars (DrgnSlyr5@aol.com) 2. ? for Hapkido teachers(inc Master West)-irime nage (JSaportajr@aol.com) 3. Awareness Color Code (ABurrese@aol.com) 4. Old School vs New Age (Charles Veuleman) 5. Korean Sensei again (Mac) 6. RE: Black Belt Tests (Anne Skjold) 7. Re: Korean Sensei again (Kakita Kentei) 8. Braeswood Martial Art Center (Mac) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: DrgnSlyr5@aol.com Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 00:16:09 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] seminars Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net << In fact, I routinely hear it reported that some of the best stuff to happen at seminars occurs after hours, or over lunch, informally. My position is that there is no reason for this not to be an INTEGRAL PART OF TRAINING ON THE MAT. >> I have to disagree with this last statement. Especially at an open seminar, many participants will be unknown to the instructor. Typically, there are many ranks present and often several styles represented. The explanations that may be desired by advanced practitioners are often over the head of less-experienced students or those from a different background. Teaching time and content must be to the benefit of all present. The limited time allowed in a seminar makes it impossible for the instructor and helpers to completely personalize the instruction for every student, especially when long explanations are desired. The "informal" teaching that occurs around seminars during non-structured times often happens for the following reasons. The instructor has seen the students' dedication by their hard work on the mat during structured sessions and has had a chance to observe a person's movement and gauge their ability to understand and apply what is being taught. This provides him/her with a better understanding of what further concepts the person can benefit from. The instructor, through conversation, has gotten a glimpse of the student's heart. The way a student speaks of their own instructor, of others in the arts, and the teachability displayed, all affect how the seminar instructor(s) is inclined to impart further information. I have been at seminars where students were relieved the mat time was over so they could socialize about non-MA topics. I've also attended seminars at which the joy of MA was such an integral part of people's lives it naturally flowed into off-mat times. The latter environment is conducive to developing the kind of relationships, even in such a brief time as a seminar weekend, that lead to the sharing of the deeper material. But one has to be present for the mat time and available for the off-mat times in order to benefit. The more advanced the practitioner, the less one may find of "new" treasures at a particular seminar. But one can certainly polish the gems one has, see a different facet of that gem, and have the opportunity to make new friends. At a multi-art seminar my instructor and I attended, there was little that was new to him. But rather than just teaching the Hapkido portion of the seminar, he was also out there enjoying the opportunity to participate as a student as others presented their arts. He came away with better insight as to how others approach self-defense, the respect of other high-ranking instructors in their arts, and one particular new technique he said in itself was worth the weekend. Perhaps it is more beneficial to go into a seminar willing to accept whatever gems one may find rather than a particular one. Sharon --__--__-- Message: 2 From: JSaportajr@aol.com Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:10:40 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] ? for Hapkido teachers(inc Master West)-irime nage Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I just saw some Hapkido video clips from the web site of the Netherlands Hapkido Federation. There was a Korean Master demonstrating and he did a fairly classical Aikido technique known in Aikido as Irimi Nage (forgive me if I misspelled this). One sees Aikidoists practice Irimi nage all the time, its very basic. It is known as an entering throw, where you enter and take the opponent in the in the direction he or she is already going, usually with a hand on the back of the opponents neck or collar leading him in this circular direction, then suddenly reversing direction -- often using the other arm in a sort of clothes line technique. I have not encountered the classic irime nage in Hapkido training or seminars. Ive seen leading the opponent and then reversing the momentum into a wrist throw, for example, but not the classic irime nage as practiced in Aikido. So my question for the Hapkido teachers is: Do you know the Irime Nage of Aikido? Do you teach it in your Hapkido curriculum? Is this standard in Hapkido curriculum or is it added by certain Hapkido masters who may have greater knowledge or experience of Aikido.? Master JR West who is also ranked in Aikido would be of help here. Jose --__--__-- Message: 3 From: ABurrese@aol.com Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:31:36 EDT To: animal@zz.com, the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Awareness Color Code Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Recently I was asked about the Awareness color code history. While I have been teaching the white, yellow, orange, red a long time, and believe it originated with the military, I don't know much more than that. I know many others use this or something very similar. (In one of Loren's books, he uses stages rather than colors) (In the book Trail Safe, Bane uses white, green, yellow, red and then Black which some military and police forces use) I've heard that Cooper taught the white, yellow, orange, red code, but not sure if he wrote it anywhere. (Don't see it in his Principles of Personal Defense.) Anyone know the history? Thanks, Alain www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:42:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Charles Veuleman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Old School vs New Age Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I passed!! I can't move, but I passed the test. At least my fingers can type. Anyway, nah, I am not changing styles at all, just figured it would be a good will gesture to hang out with them a little bit more. Ah, but screw it, I still have alot to learn from chung do kwan. Still don't know chul gi 2 or 3, ja on, ship su, and a couple of weapons kata still to go, so i'll just stick to my guns. Thanks guys. Charlie V. P.S. to any of my students who are on the list, don't freak out, it was just an idea, you know those monday/wednesday people are still scared of us anyway :D ===== ------------------------------------- L. Charles Veuleman Natchitoches Karate Institute 204 Rapides Drive Natchitoches, LA 71457 318-356-7727 http://www.bluewavekarate.com ------------------------------------- Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Mac" To: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 14:25:39 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean Sensei again Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Charles wrote: <> Our school's website is http://koreanschoolskarate.tripod.com <> Erik, I noticed the MDK logo combined with Sensei (a Japanese tittle, but normal for CDK TKD) and the kanji/hanja for "kara" versus "T'ang" used for karate, but you are a Tae Kwon Do Moo Duk Kwan School? Just curious.... any insights? Yours in Jung Do,>> --------------------- I too found the site confusing. The "Tang Soo" MDK emblem, and then on the front page using "Kong Soo" characters but using the Japanese terms "Kara Te" and Sensei for teacher while also writing about TaeKwonDo (Korean). So was this a TangSooDo or TaeKwonDo dojang? He gave background on both. And didn't he say he was Chung Do Kwon but gave the history of the MooDukKwan? I do understand using the generic term "karate" though, as at least around here it tends to be a universal term for martial arts to the general public (that's why I use it too). The only other minor detail was the Um/Yang fist logo - the red and blue were flowing clockwise instead of counter-clockwise. I know what you're thinking.... I must be anal retentive :-) Later, Mac TangSoo! --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 14:29:37 -0500 From: Anne Skjold To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Black Belt Tests Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thank you Ms. Laurie & Mr. Julian for your input. I would like a few more responses though and maybe putting my testing requirements down will get some more responses. 1-8 Pal Gwe Patterns, 7 Basic One-steps, 15 Basic Kicking, 5 Counter Attacks, 5 3/2/1 Steps, 6 Advanced One-steps, 6 Advance one-step counter attacks, 21 Movement, 22 movement, 15 Face Contact, 14 Tae Kwons, 20 Reaction Techniques, 5 Knife Self Defense, 30 Series, 10 Advanced Kicking Counter Attacks, 7 Intermediate Kicking, 5 Hapkido Techniques, Oral (80 plus taekwon do related Korean terms), Written (What is Black Belt), Breaking (in the air turning Side Kick, plus two Instructors choice) Thank you in Advance, Ms. Anne --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 15:38:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Kakita Kentei Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean Sensei again To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Greetings Master McHenry, Thank you for viewing my school's site. The images I have on there come from my instructor, David Hillgrove, Sr. The black and yellow one is the patch we wear on our left breast, and the other image, um/yang with fist and wreath is a patch we have embroidered on the backs of our gi (dobok). Sa Bum Nim Hillgrove is very unassuming of his own rank, and prefers the title Sensei. I would desperately love to get more information from him, but when I ask who his instructors were, he says everyone he works with teaches him something, but he does mention two names, a Master Pye, and a man named Master Steve (I forget the last name), who he studied with in Colorado. We use a melange of terms, for example we wear gi, and work out in a dojo, our kata are the Pyong Ahn series, but we do a tremendous amount of leg work in our workouts. One text he cites is Moo Duk Kwan Tae Kwon Do, by Richard Chun. In its entirety, the system we study is "Moo Duk Kwan, Tae Kwon Do, Korean Karate". For what it is worth, Sensei Dave as he prefers to be called, is known here in Maine, and Masters Mike Clark, and Sabumnim Jeff Wood treat him as an equal. One apocryphal story I have heard is that there was a test here in Maine for a Fourth Dan Black Belt, and Sensei Dave was asked to be on the test board that evening. I couch this by saying that I had been informed by others more knowledgeable than myself, that one needs to be two ranks higher at minimum to sit on a promotions board. Be that as it may, he only wears a black belt to class (if he even wears one), with no stripes, but I have seen him wearing a belt with black and red, but I am not sure what it meant. Sensei Dave runs a reasonably informal school. He's very much concerned with training us in excellent technique and control. Then again, I'm only a 4th gup green belt. Thank you, Master McHenry for your time. Erik Brann --- Mac wrote: > Charles wrote: > <> > Our school's website is http://koreanschoolskarate.tripod.com > <> > > Erik, > > I noticed the MDK logo combined with Sensei (a Japanese tittle, but normal > for CDK TKD) and the kanji/hanja for "kara" versus "T'ang" used for karate, > but you are a Tae Kwon Do Moo Duk Kwan School? Just curious.... any > insights? > > Yours in Jung Do,>> > --------------------- > I too found the site confusing. The "Tang Soo" MDK emblem, and then on the > front page using "Kong Soo" characters but using the Japanese terms "Kara > Te" and Sensei for teacher while also writing about TaeKwonDo (Korean). So > was this a TangSooDo or TaeKwonDo dojang? He gave background on both. And > didn't he say he was Chung Do Kwon but gave the history of the MooDukKwan? > I do understand using the generic term "karate" though, as at least around > here it tends to be a universal term for martial arts to the general public > (that's why I use it too). > > The only other minor detail was the Um/Yang fist logo - the red and blue > were flowing clockwise instead of counter-clockwise. > > I know what you're thinking.... I must be anal retentive :-) > > Later, > Mac > TangSoo! > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang > > ===== Kakita Kentei Crane Clan Jade Legion Samurai * Experienced 5 * Unique 2F 8C 12HR 13G 4PH * Will Only join the Crane Clan or Jade Legion Double Chi * Will attach jade items for 4 less gold. Kentei may always focus first against Shadowlands personalities. * Open: Once per turn, challenge a Shadowlands personality to an unrefusable duel. "Corruption is a shortcut with short term gains and long term losses." Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Mac" To: "The Dojang Digest" Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 19:57:30 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Braeswood Martial Art Center Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Kat Kelly's Braeswood Martial Art Center had their grand opening this weekend in Houston TX. Spectators were entertained by demonstrations from: -Master Troy Trudeau, 7th degree Tae Sool Won (list member) -Master "Mac" McHenry, 6th degree Tang Soo Do (list member) -Master Jackie Smith, 5th degree Pasaryu -Master Chris Evans, 5th degree Kenpo -Mr. Richard Coleman 3rd degree Tae Sool Won (list member?) -Miss Mindy McHenry 2nd Degree Tang Soo Do -Mr. Keith Wicker 2nd Degree Tae Kwon Do (list member) -Mrs. Kat Kelly 1st Degree Kong Shin Bup (list member) Mrs. Kelly was a great host and we all had a great time. I want to thank her for her hospitality. It was impressive that all the guys from Tennessee could drive at least 14 hours all night and perform so well at the demonstration (Trudeau, Smith, Evans & Coleman). I wish Mrs. Kelly all the success in the future. She is a member of Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman's National Korean Martial Arts Association which was represented very well. I look forward to seeing everyone again at Master JR West's 17th International HapKiDo and Korean Martial Arts Seminar August 16-18 in Jackson MS. Information about Mrs. Kelly's school can be found at: http://www.braeswoodmartialart.com/ Information about the National Korean Martial Arts Association: http://www.nkmaa.com/ Information about the United States Korean Martial Arts Federation: http://www.hapkido.com/ Information about the World Tae Sool Won Association: http://www.wtswa.com/ --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest