Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 15:50:34 -0500 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #329 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sender: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Unsubscribe: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Game of Death Special (CKCtaekwon@cs.com) 2. Kido Hae and TSD (Cliff.Vaught@pmusa.com) 3. Re: Knife Throwing (ABurrese@aol.com) 4. Sparring (Barbara Campos) 5. Re: Kido Hae and TSD (Ray Terry) 6. RE: (Another) Book in the works (Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov) 7. traveling (Ray Terry) 8. World Kido Federation and the Kidohae (Steve Seo) 9. Re: Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux (Ray Terry) (ISA CONSULTATION GROUP) 10. Game of Death (michael tomlinson) 11. Canadian 4th of July (michael tomlinson) 12. Re: Tae Kwon Do Library (Grant D. Watson) 13. Re: Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux (Creed71963@aol.com) 14. hapkido debate (Hapkido Self Defense Center) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: CKCtaekwon@cs.com Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:58:48 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Game of Death Special Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray, I watched the show last night also. enjoyed it tremendously, and yes, lots more footage of the fights. and thanks for the web site on knife throwing. gary pieratt > Message: 14 > From: Ray Terry > To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) > Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 21:07:30 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: [The_Dojang] Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux > Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > > Interesting... While channel surfing I just happened across a 1 or 2 yr > old documentary that was airing on AMC, Bruce Lee: A Warrior's Journey. > Perhaps ya'll have seen it before, but it was new for me. > > It showed Lee's original plan for the movie Game of Death along with a lot > of fight footage that did not make it into the final cut, given Sifu Lee's > untimely death. > > Lots of additional footage of Lee and Gm Ji fighting. Very interesting to > watch Gm Ji looking so young, and without his glasses (of course you see > this in the movie). > > In one place they mention that Gm Ji was a 7th Dan in 1972, when the movie > was being made. I believe he was an 8th as Gm Choi Yong-sool promoted him > and Lee Joo-bang to 8th Dan in 1968. > > Fun to watch Gm Ji employing his favorite fighting stance and seeing him > do his back spin kick, always in the clockwise direction... > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com Gary Pieratt Castroville Karate Club www.askarate.com Success in life is largely the result of habit. Have a Great Day! --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Cliff.Vaught@pmusa.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:12:55 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Kido Hae and TSD Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Charles, Thanks for the reply and clarifications. I know from GM Hwang Kee's history the difficult process he went through in Korea to maintain autonomy from a unified Kwan structure. I don't really understand the rationale behind creating a unified governing body of all schools, styles, etc. Maybe Ray or Alain, again, can provide some insight. I also study Sayoc Kali in Richmond, VA. My instructor recently aligned himself with Super Kicks and American Freestyle Karate. I talked to the head of the school system and he firmly believes it takes 300 hours to become a Dan, no matter how many, or few, years it takes to get them. I didn't really say anything out of respect to him and the newness of the relationship - I know the SBDMDK requires a certain number of hours per year as you go through the Dan rank testing process. What do you think? Can the rank of Dan really be boiled down to "300 hours"? For schools like SBD MDK where it's a 4 year process to test for Dan - is that really necessary? I think it is, personally. I like a structured curriculum. 300 hours would result in a Dan in less than 2 years. I believe there is much more to the rank than the physical. Soo Bahk!! Cliff --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 10:29:56 -0400 From: ABurrese@aol.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Knife Throwing Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Making It Stick by Mike Janich, available through Paladin Press, is a good video on knife throwing. www.paladin-press.com Yours in Training, Alain www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 08:52:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Barbara Campos To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Sparring Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Kyong-nae, respectfully! I am a orange belt TKD student, and I've been following your interesting discussions for some time now. I see that all of you are very experienced and knowing MA's, and I'd like to take advantage of all you knowledge. I'm interested in sparring (Olympic style). Can you give me some pointers? I've never sparred, but I want to be prepared when I do. Thank you in advance for your time. Sincerely, Barbara Campos Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Kido Hae and TSD To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > unified Kwan structure. I don't really understand the rationale behind > creating a unified governing body of all schools, styles, etc. Maybe Ray or > Alain, again, can provide some insight. I personally see why the government wanted to unify the Tang Soo Do - Kong Soo Do - Tae Soo Do - Karate Kwans, but I see no reason to pull the non Karate-ish styles in also. > I also study Sayoc Kali in Richmond, VA. My instructor recently aligned > himself with Super Kicks and American Freestyle Karate. I talked to the > head of the school system and he firmly believes it takes 300 hours to > become a Dan, no matter how many, or few, years it takes to get them. I > didn't really say anything out of respect to him and the newness of the > relationship - I know the SBDMDK requires a certain number of hours per year > as you go through the Dan rank testing process. What do you think? Can the > rank of Dan really be boiled down to "300 hours"? For schools like SBD MDK > where it's a 4 year process to test for Dan - is that really necessary? I > think it is, personally. I like a structured curriculum. 300 hours would > result in a Dan in less than 2 years. I believe there is much more to the > rank than the physical. Yes, 300 hours seems to me to be unusual. On a side note, the Sayoc Kali folk claim they have no certified instructors anywhere in Virginia. Just fyi.?. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:25:28 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: (Another) Book in the works Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear J: ".....There will be one coming soon. It's going to be written by Master Richard Morgan who is a direct student of James Garrison, 9th Dan...... It should be quite good when it is finished....." Thanks for the heads-up. Personally I am not a huge fan of Master Garrison. My experience with his material has been to see an effort on his part to blend or blur the distinctions between Aikido and Hapkido. I am guessing that this would be something after the fashion of Hankido as developed by GM Myong, Jae-nam. There is also a kind of feeling that he used his background in Aikido to sorta buy his way into a Hapkido situation with an affiliation with a Korean Hapkido personality (whose name escapes me right now). I don't mention this to stir-up a political discussion only that I can imagine that a student of Master Garrison would tend to take a more Aikido sort of approach. Now granted, if the approach is more "Federation-style" or perhaps more along the lines of Tomiki then I will bet that there are some similarities that can be drawn. But I still hold that I (and maybe Micheal) would like to see a book on Hapkido biomechanics written by a traditional Hapkido practitioner speaking to such things as what I have come to identify as the "Four Deportments" (Misalignment, Un-balancing, Un-timing and Refinement), appropriate use of muscle vs leverage, angles of attack and defense, biomechanic relationships between armed and un-armed techniques and so forth. Thanks again, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima), the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] traveling Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net fyi, I'll be traveling from the 4th for a week or so. During that time I hope to keep the lists up and running. But if that doesn't happen, well, now you know. Have a fun and safe 4th. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:38:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Seo To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] World Kido Federation and the Kidohae Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Grandmaster In Sun Seo and the Kidohae's(which include's both the World Kido Federation and the Korea Kido Hae) reputation does not need to be defended here. For those familar with Korean Martial Arts history and/or have met Grandmaster In Sun Seo, his reputation and background are unquestioned. If you would like more information about the Kidohae or Grandmaster In Sun Seo, feel free to email me at seo727@yahoo.com. Also, you can visit my school in Fremont, CA for training, discussion, etc. Tae Kwon Do and Tang Soo Do are not martial arts included in the Kidohae charter as arts to be governed by the Kidohae. This speaks to an open question in terms of Tae Kwon Do in its current state in Korea and if it is considered a "martial art" versus a sport. In terms of Tang Soo Do, the open question is whether it is considered a Korean martial art versus it being a Japanese Martial Art. I respect anyone's claim that both are Korean Martial "Arts" but it is legitimate question to be asked(especially in Korea). That being said, at the time when the Kidohae was chartered(1963) those two "arts" where not included as arts to be under the Kidohae. Kidohae dan question? Here are some conservative estimates: 1000 schools that receive dan through the Kidohae 10 black belts a year for each school 20 years equals 200,000 I find it interesting that those who know very little about a highly respected martial artist would question his integrity in such a matter as I have read in recent postings. I encourage questions and discussions, but I hope as martial artists we are a little more respectful. I understand that there are high ranking(and those claiming high rank) masters out there who have little honor and are fakes, but I believe we as martial artists need be a more careful as to not paint too broad a brush. Steve Seo Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "ISA CONSULTATION GROUP" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 13:14:00 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux (Ray Terry) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I saw that last night too. It was the first time for me and really enjoyed it. If they had used this footage in the original movie, I believe it would have made a bigger splash. George Petrotta Ray wrote: Message: 14 >From: Ray Terry >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) >Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 21:07:30 -0700 (PDT) >Subject: [The_Dojang] Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > >Interesting... While channel surfing I just happened across a 1 or 2 yr >old documentary that was airing on AMC, Bruce Lee: A Warrior's Journey. >Perhaps ya'll have seen it before, but it was new for me. > >It showed Lee's original plan for the movie Game of Death along with a lot >of fight footage that did not make it into the final cut, given Sifu Lee's >untimely death. > >Lots of additional footage of Lee and Gm Ji fighting. Very interesting to >watch Gm Ji looking so young, and without his glasses (of course you see >this in the movie). > >In one place they mention that Gm Ji was a 7th Dan in 1972, when the movie >was being made. I believe he was an 8th as Gm Choi Yong-sool promoted him >and Lee Joo-bang to 8th Dan in 1968. > >Fun to watch Gm Ji employing his favorite fighting stance and seeing him >do his back spin kick, always in the clockwise direction... > >Ray Terry >rterry@idiom.com http://hapkido.4dw.com/ http://leftbehind2001.tripod.com/index.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 17:36:37 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] Game of Death Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray, I caught that show on Bruce Lee also, it was interesting and I got a kick out of seeing Doju Nim doing his Hapkido on Bruce (Lee) not (Sims),, very interesting and it showed how different the actual movie would have been if Bruce Lee would have been alive to finish it. Michael Tomlinson _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 17:38:53 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] Canadian 4th of July Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hey what do my fine brothers up in Canada do on 4th of July? Do you folks celebrate like us or with us? Do you folks blow up fireworks? Or do you folks just find some beavers and blow them up? Ha, I bet Rudy has done that more than once!! Michael Tomlinson _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:06:14 -0700 (PDT) From: "Grant D. Watson" Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Tae Kwon Do Library To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Do you have the General's Taekwon-Do encyclopedia > (15 volumes)? If you > do ITF-like TKD, that or his condensed (1 volume) > encyclopedia would be > a very good start, imho. I don't do ITF, but I have > both. No I don't have it -- yet. :-) Was it the one-volume work that was being discussed a while back with regard to 1965 vs. 1972 editions? If it's the same book, and I go the college-student-on-summer-break route and get it rather than the encyclopedia, which edition would you recommend? Does it matter much? Thanks, err... Ray. (Calling 16th dans by their first names takes a while getting used to, you know? ;-) ) ===== Grant D. Watson, Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 13 From: Creed71963@aol.com Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 15:21:46 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 07/03/2002 8:17:41 AM EST, the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net writes: << Message: 14 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 21:07:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] Gm Ji - AMC - Game of Death, Redux Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Interesting... While channel surfing I just happened across a 1 or 2 yr old documentary that was airing on AMC, Bruce Lee: A Warrior's Journey. Perhaps ya'll have seen it before, but it was new for me. It showed Lee's original plan for the movie Game of Death along with a lot of fight footage that did not make it into the final cut, given Sifu Lee's untimely death. Lots of additional footage of Lee and Gm Ji fighting. Very interesting to watch Gm Ji looking so young, and without his glasses (of course you see this in the movie). << Very nice scene, though I have to admit that the other two completed scenes were also interesting. Kareem was a very scary dude..... Craig --__--__-- Message: 14 From: "Hapkido Self Defense Center" To: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:46:06 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] hapkido debate Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Upon returning from my vacation in Texas, I have spent the past week just catching up on dojang matters. I have also been trying to catch up on my email. I have been reading this debate over hapkido technique and motion. I found a website called www.judoinfo.com and on it is has 41 animated techniques. To bad we do not have something like that in hapkido! The animations can be found at http://www.judoinfo.com/animate.htm. Jere R. Hilland www.geocities.com/hapkiyukwonsul --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest