Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 17:13:06 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #407 - 16 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. 401 received, thanks! (Ray Terry) 2. Re: Electronic Scoring (SallyBaughn@aol.com) 3. Re: The LA boyz (Tom Kennelly) 4. Ft. Wayne Seminar (J.R. West) 5. Jewelry and clothing... (J Thomas Howard) 6. 20 questions! (wild horse) 7. RE: re: Danger of ear rings (Wallace, John) 8. Re: The LA boyz (Ray Terry) 9. Re: Why Not Taekwondo (SallyBaughn@aol.com) 10. Re: Re: Electronic Scoring (AE Bohanon) 11. Re: 20 questions! (Ray Terry) 12. Re: Tournament Sparring (SallyBaughn@aol.com) 13. RE>KSW forms (MW) 14. several items (Hapkido Self Defense Center) 15. Re: The LA boyz (Tom Kennelly) 16. Re: Kuk Sool forms (Timothy Seitz) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 08:21:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] 401 received, thanks! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Issue #401 received. Thanks! Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 2 From: SallyBaughn@aol.com Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 11:06:01 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Electronic Scoring Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Amy B wrote: << I just have to say I was a timekeeper at Portland State University where they had a competition and we used this electronic scoring. It had a lot of bugs since it was the first time being used. But, by the end of the day the only real problems were the judges not telling the timekepper/scorekepper what to do. >> I don't think there's anything to be done about the lack of communication between judges and timekeepers. : ) Sometimes you have really great understanding and then again, sometimes the judges do their own thing and you have to figure out what you're supposed to do. Do you know what scoring system they were using? There are two or three out there that I've seen, probably more exist. We're always on the lookout for the one that's the ultimate best. What seems to be the problem with the systems I've seen is that the judges usually only get about 5 minutes of instruction and then go to the rings (sometimes they only get the instruction when they reach the ring). IMHO, allowing all judges to judge a match during the pre-event referee seminar should be standard procedure. --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Tom Kennelly" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] The LA boyz Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 11:06:48 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net If we were in fact beating up on the LA boyz I would have to commend them for standing their ground. I believe the interaction has been informative. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Terry" To: "The_Dojang" Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2002 10:01 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] The LA boyz Folks, give the Louisiana Bluewave guys a little break, ok? Give someone else a hard time for now. Ya'll can beat up on the Natchitoches boyz again in September... :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "J.R. West" To: "Dojang Digest" Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 10:33:44 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Ft. Wayne Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dakin: We were very sorry to hear that you were unable to attend, as several of us were looking forward to meeting you, BUT, family always comes first. I will be doing the HKD thing in Ft. Wayne, IN on Nov. 16th, 2002, and prior to that I'll be in Seabrook (Houston), TX on Oct. 19th, and the MD-PA area on Nov. 2nd. I hope to see you in Ft. Wayne and possibly spend some time together Friday night before the seminar. Further info on these dates is available through www.hapkido.com under the "Seminars" page. People ask how I obtained the rights to "hapkido.com", and Wayne's answer is "we got it before anyone else had websites", over 10 years ago......J. R. West www.hapkido.com --__--__-- Message: 5 To: "the_dojang" Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 10:49:20 -0500 (CDT) From: thomcat@binary.net (J Thomas Howard) Subject: [The_Dojang] Jewelry and clothing... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net People were asking about jewelry---here is the blurb from our handbook about jewelry and such. ---------------- Class Preparation and Etiquette Keep uniform washed and in good order at all times. Yourself also---we get up close and personal in class, and so we need to keep in mind other people's delicate sensibilities. (Including the instructor's.) Other things to keep in mind: No gel/hairspray in hair. Fingernails (and toenails) must be kept short. No jewelry (rings, bracelets, watch, earrings, necklaces, etc) except for a wedding ring or stud-type earrings. (Note: you may get the earring post driven into your skull during class if we are doing groundwork, headlocks, or head wraps. Wear at your own risk.) If you have any other piercings, bear in mind we grab and twist various parts of your body. Again, wear at your own risk. Occasionally, depending on the weather, the instructor might give permission to wear a t-shirt instead of a dobak top in class. For these cases, the t-shirt must either be completely blank, or a Hapkido t-shirt. ------------------------ So, that is what we do. Mostly, people with stud-type earrings don't have problems---but occasionally someone DOES get an earring post driven into their skull during a groundwork day. When they do, I tend to shrug and tell them that since they are adults capable of thought, it was their choice. For people with other piercings, I strongly advise using athletic tape on it if they can't take it out. The weather comment above (regarding t-shirts) is a hold-over from a day when we had a 102 degree temperature, 98% humidity, no fans, and the air conditioning had been out for three days. Extra-heavyweight uniforms are just no fun at that point. (Plus, it makes people realize how reliant they are on grabbing uniform tops for certains throws and groundwork.) Ah---just remembered: for those having a problem with "Korean Karate," are you aware that sometimes Hapkido is called "Korean Kung Fu?" :) Thomas ------------------------------------ thomcat@binary.net hapkido.4t.com "If you aren't modeling what you are teaching then you are teaching something else." --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "wild horse" To: Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 17:11:03 +0100 Subject: [The_Dojang] 20 questions! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi there people! Um, several trivial questions i'm afraid (please excuse my lack of knowledge!) What does Pil seung and taekwon mean when written at the of posts,etc? Mr Terry- what do you mean by caveat emptor? What are all the different types of taekwondo and how do the differ eg CKD, WTF, ITF and why are there so man different types?! Regarding earrings and jewelry; we are made to remove any types if we forget, we get 3 press ups! it works! If you have ever been caught by an item eg a ring, you will understand how painful it is for both parties! ok, im done, thank you for your patience. Wendy.Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Wallace, John" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] re: Danger of ear rings Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 08:52:41 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net My school has a blanket prohibition against any body jewelry (ear, finger or otherwise) during class and tournaments. Its just part of what you agree to do when you sign up - no justification necessary, although the safety issues are pretty obvious. That said, I have on occasion forgotten to remove my wedding ring, which is a simple flat band. Its definitely no longer round! Its sort of a wobbly oval. Its 14k gold, so its not the softest type of gold either. I've actually gotten bruises both on the ring finger and the neighboring fingers from the ring, so even this very simple form of ornamentation has consequences for training. One of my sparring partners was wearing small stud earrings under her headgear (she also simply forgot she was wearing them). At one point during our match I noticed the left collar of her dobok was getting bloodstained. We went over to the side of the mat and I had a look to see where she was bleeding. There were about three punctures on her neck and behind her ear from the post on the earrings. With the adrenaline from sparring she hadn't even felt the pain (I had drilled her with hook punches at various points in our bout). Nothing serious - just messy. -John Wallace 1st gup TKD (just tested for I Dan!) Fremont, CA -----Original Message----- From: Lasich, Mark D. [mailto:Mark.Lasich@alcoa.com] Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 5:33 AM To: 'Dojang' Subject: [The_Dojang] re: Danger of ear rings Gary writes: > Please share with me your school's policy and Why they cannot wear earrings > during training. If it is a safety issue, explain the danger of > wearing them. I have seen cases where even with sparring head gear on, one lady had her earring come loose and tore the ear lobe. Not a good situation. The posts are sharp, stones could come loose leaving the sharp prongs exposed. Broken pieces could fly into someone's eye, or could be stepped on causing one to lose balance, fall, or get cut, etc. Earrings are quite easy to spot. It is the ATA policy across the board that they are not permitted in class or tournaments. It is amazing how may people don't even consider the potential risk to themselves and others. I have been telling more and more men to remove their earrings before allowing them to begin a sparring match at tournaments! Now, what about OTHER body piercings? Those are not as easy to spot, but probably even MORE dangerous to the wearer. I figure it is part of the uniform, to NOT wear jewelry, and encourage others to consider it that way as well. This shows respect for themselves and for others. The only thing that is allowed in the ATA is a flat wedding ring, having no stones. HOWEVER, one testing I was performing double knifehand speed breaks, and through all the excitement the technique was not 100%! So, today I still have an OVAL wedding ring as a reminder! Yes, I bent my wedding ring on the technique! So, I even remove that now - especially for board breaks! I have been known to actually take my watch, chain, ring off in front of the class before we bow in. Nothing better than setting expectations by example! In the spirit, Mark _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] The LA boyz To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 08:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > If we were in fact beating up on the LA boyz I would have to commend them > for standing their ground. I believe the interaction has been informative. Agreed. And that is why we should beat on them again come September... :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: SallyBaughn@aol.com Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 12:17:08 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Why Not Taekwondo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net raul.del.pozo@immi.gov.au wrote: << To refer to TaeKwon-Do as "Korean Karate" is not only ridiculous and misleading but also insults the integrity of all the existant independents arts of both Japan and Korea (albeit historically sharing brotherly roots). The term "Korean Karate" has no currency outside of the United States and frankly is as meaningful a description for TaeKwon-Do as would be to refer to Kung Fu as "Chinese Karate" >> Well then, how sad that the original Korean instructors who brought Taekwondo to the US were insulting the integrity of the art when they used the term. And by the poster's logic I suppose the term TaeKwon-Do has no currency under the World Taekwondo Federation. BTW, most Anglo-derivatives don't use capital letters in the middle of words, are you insulting all Anglo-derivatives when you use the spelling "TaeKwon-Do"? --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "AE Bohanon" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Electronic Scoring Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 09:24:55 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I don't remember the name of it, sorry. It was really strange. I had only been studying Taekwondo for like 3-4 weeks before they asked me to help out. I agreed because I wanted to go and see what a tounament was like. Then they put me in the staging area which was fine, but when the sparring began I was put up as a timekeeper/scorekeeper. I will tell you, for being new at the sport, never seen it done before out of class, a lowly white belt, I was scared! ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 8:06 AM Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Electronic Scoring > Amy B wrote: > << I just have to say I was a timekeeper at Portland State University where > they had a competition and we used this electronic scoring. It had a lot of > bugs since it was the first time being used. But, by the end of the day the > only real problems were the judges not telling the timekepper/scorekepper > what to do. >> > > I don't think there's anything to be done about the lack of communication > between > judges and timekeepers. : ) Sometimes you have really great understanding > and then again, sometimes the judges do their own thing and you have to > figure out what you're supposed to do. > > Do you know what scoring system they were using? There are two or three out > there that I've seen, probably more exist. We're always on the lookout for > the one that's the ultimate best. What seems to be the problem with the > systems I've seen is that the judges usually only get about 5 minutes of > instruction and then go to the rings (sometimes they only get the instruction > when they reach the ring). IMHO, allowing all judges to judge a match during > the pre-event referee seminar should be standard procedure. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 11 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] 20 questions! To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 09:06:26 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Mr Terry- what do you mean by caveat emptor? It should show up in your friendly dictionary... but it means 'let the buyer beware'. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 12 From: SallyBaughn@aol.com Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 12:33:02 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Tournament Sparring Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net DR1965DAVE@aol.com wrote: << Some of the videos we have viewed show underbelts sparring using full contact while in tournaments. Is this something I should be concerned about? >> I believe most tournaments will not have full contact for children; however, you can check the tournament rules or ask the tournament director whether full contact is allowed for children (usually considered as 12 and under). After observation, should you find that the contact is heavier than you feel is safe for your children, you always have the right to allow/require them to bow out of the competition. Having said that, please remember that often a parent is much more afraid for his/her child than the occasion warrants. Not that accidents don't happen, but junior competitors rarely have major dangerous incidents. --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: 22 Aug 02 11:45:48 -0500 From: MW To: the_dojang Subject: [The_Dojang] RE>KSW forms Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Can anyone tell me where I could find good quality videos of Kuk Sool forms? It would be greatly appreciated. Jeremy try their website: world kuk sool association they have tapes on forms /techniques BUT: for only $49.95, that's right, only $49.95 I'd be happy to dust off the old camcorder and make you one !! michael whalen KSW For real, If you are ever in the houston area would like to meet/work out/converse about KSW with you. --__--__-- Message: 14 From: "Hapkido Self Defense Center" To: Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 12:57:43 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] several items Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Actually Mac, you will see me before March as I plan on attending the seminar in Seabrook with Master West in addition to the Fort Wayne one. I still get one trip a year alone, so Seabrook will be it (folks, if you have been married over a decade you will get that one). But we will both be there with our students in March. Scott said he will show up at the Houston one so I may have to hog tie him to keep his promise. Also Mac, I may be going back to Austin this Winter to teach another hapkido seminar there. I will let you know. Dr. Burkick! Glad to see you will make it to Ft. Wayne. I hope to see you in Jackson next March! Bruce, you have been quite and I assume you will attend. <<>> Sally, Now you tell me!! :) At least I am comfortable knowing that my baby brother, who turned 40 2 weeks ago has aged allot, being that he is married WITH children. Jere R. Hilland www.geocities.com/hapkiyukwonsul (married without children)! --__--__-- Message: 15 From: "Tom Kennelly" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] The LA boyz Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 13:40:33 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ok. I will just have to put a reminder in my calendar. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Terry" To: Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] The LA boyz > If we were in fact beating up on the LA boyz I would have to commend them > for standing their ground. I believe the interaction has been informative. Agreed. And that is why we should beat on them again come September... :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 16 Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 15:42:08 -0500 From: Timothy Seitz To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Kuk Sool forms Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Jeremy, There are two definitive sources for the Kuk Sool forms. One is a video series of 6 tapes and the other is a two volume set of textbooks. Both sources include the under black belt forms as well as the under black belt technique requirements. They can be ordered at www.kuksoolwon.com or by calling (281) 255-2550. The videos include some extra stuff like weapons forms and demonstrations, but the textbook series is better overall as it is more recent. Both the video series and the textbook volumes are best used as reference material only. The primary purpose of these materials is to standardize the curriculum and to give a reference point against which instructors and students can check their techniques and forms. They aren't useful as an instructional series, especially for people who aren't in Kuk Sool already. Thus, it would be a collosal waste of time to try to learn the forms from video, and even worse to do so from the books. If you'd like to just get a sense of what our forms look like, the videos would give you a good picture of that, but they are pretty expensive if that's all you want from them. Some of your friends who study Kuk Sool will most likely have some demonstration tapes. Borrow those if you can. Those would be more fun to watch. As a world wide martial arts association, the World Kuk Sool Association, led by In Hyuk Suh Kuk Sa Nim, has done remarkably well at keeping a standard and uniform curriculum across the individual schools. That makes it possible to have fair and reliably judged tournaments and it is extemely helpful for students who have to transfer to a new school. The tapes and textbooks have been invaluable in the standardization process. Timothy Seitz University of Illinois >Can anyone tell me where I could find good quality videos of Kuk Sool forms? >It would be greatly appreciated. > >Jeremy --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest