Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 09:03:02 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #554 - 11 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Today's Topics: 1. running (michael tomlinson) 2. Re: Baked Potatoe (foxdragon@cuttingedge.net) 3. Re: Re: Baked Potatoe (SyksRep006@cs.com) 4. Question regarding Kuk Sool Books (Sun Mu Kwan) 5. Re: Re: Baked Potatoe (Ray Terry) 6. Louisiana (Charles Veuleman) 7. RE: Re: Kong San Goon a.k.a. Kusanku (Donnelly, Eamonn) 8. Re: Baked POTATO (tg dewey) 9. Beating the diet horse to death (Charles Richards) 10. Over the River... (Ray Terry) 11. November McDougall Newsletter (Brooke Thomas) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 02:45:41 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] running Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Now let me get this straight, IF I run too much it will actually be counter productive to losing weight?? I guess I missed that article in the National Enquirer. My running regime as of now is,,,, 4 miles on mon, tues, wed, and thurs,, take off fri, run 12 miles either on sat or sun,,, and take the other day off,, lift weights on tues, wed, fri, sat, and sunday, Hapkido on Mon. and Thurs,, eat lots of meat and eggs, and salads,, very little fruit and hardly no sugar or starches at all,,, I eat about an hour or more after I lift weights,, it is always heavy protein and vegetables, and I don't really gauge when I eat after running but it is usually quite a while afterward, I run before I lift weights, the one thing I do is take plenty of vitaminns and right after I lift weights I take a good dose of Yohimbe bark and ginseng, I buy both of those herbs fresh and grind them myself, that will really rev you up!!! What do you guys think,, am I gonna die soon doing all of this or should I just read another book and ponder the metabolic and physiological ramifications of the centrifical futility of all of the mental masturbation associated with the plethora of literary experts who have never ran further than the proverbial ice cream truck or had to pace themselves heading for the metaphoric elevator door closing on their lives as it heads up to the 5th floor where all the health and fitness books are in the library, I don't know maybe I'll just drop back and punt? I like the Zen idea of when you think about something too much a priest slaps you across the face and tells you to live in the NOW... IMHO doing is always better than theorizing... Michael Tomlinson _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 21:36:08 -0600 From: foxdragon@cuttingedge.net To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Baked Potatoe Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Message: 2 > From: "michael tomlinson" > > I'd love a baked potatoe, but when I eat them I feel like crap afterwards,, > it feels like I blow up like a pufferfish after I eat one!! If you think that's bad Mike, you haven't ate chili and sourkraut in the same day..... I love a good baked potatoe too. With lots and lots of Wisconsin butter.... Donna --__--__-- Message: 3 From: SyksRep006@cs.com Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 23:18:08 EST Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Baked Potatoe To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net i may have missed it but whats with the baked potatoes --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 20:45:13 -0800 (PST) From: Sun Mu Kwan To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Question regarding Kuk Sool Books Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I am wondering what the differences are between the red KSW book published by GM In Sun Seo and the black book written by In Hyuk Suh. I bought the red textbook version from a local bookstore and someone told me there was a slight difference between the two. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Baked Potatoe To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 21:23:54 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > i may have missed it but whats with the baked potatoes Just a comment about how one gets when on a no/low carb diet for awhile. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 22:58:19 -0800 (PST) From: Charles Veuleman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Louisiana Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Digest, <<>> People from here diet? I thought we were just supposed to kill everything that had four legs and eat it. Hmph... Charlie Veuleman ===== ------------------------------------- L. Charles Veuleman Natchitoches Karate Institute 204 Rapides Drive Natchitoches, LA 71457 318-356-7727 http://www.bluewavekarate.com ------------------------------------- --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Donnelly, Eamonn" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:08:08 -0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Re: Kong San Goon a.k.a. Kusanku Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Danny and Ray > > Snip "You need to check out Karate-do Kyohan by Funakoshi Gichen and > some other books on Okinawan Forms such as Karate Kata and Applications by > Morris and Trimble." and "Bubishi. Geo Alexander's title is Bubishi: > Martial Art Spirit." > > Many thanks for the leads, by coincidence I have already requested a copy > "Karate-Do Kyohan : The Master Text" and I will add "Karate Kata" and > "Bubishi: Martial Art Spirit" to my Christmas wish list. While we are > talking about good books I can also heartly recommend "Okinawan Katate: > Teachers, styles and secert techniques" by Mark Bishop to anyone who has > not yet read it. > > > Charles and Master Mac, > > Snip"Welcome from another DD TSD player!" > "Master Mac or Eric Madis may have more/better information, but look at > any Japanese Martial Arts Organizations/Texts, and what they have to say > about the origin of KusanKu." > "Others say it is the root form for the Pyung-ahn series of forms, which > is a view I personally don't agree with. As far as any history, I too > would refer to Mr. Eric Madis." > > Again many thanks to you both for your helpful advice. I too have heard of > the connection with the Pyung-Ahn forms and while I could see why someone > had made this association, I could not find any historical information to > confirm this one way or the other (with my somewhat limited resources). > > Finally I know it is a little early, but why not.......... > Nollaig shona duit (Lit. Trans. "Merry Christmas") > > > Eamonn > > Eamonn Donnelly - 1st Dan - Tang Soo Do > *: Slanesavage@yahoo.co.uk > Web www.Johnsonskarate.com > > > > Confidentiality Note: The information in this electronic mail ("e-mail") message may be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by privilege, work product immunity or other applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient the retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you receive this electronic mail ("e-mail") in error please notify us immediately by telephone on +44 (0) 24 7686 2000 or by e-mail at postmaster@cel-international.com. Thank you. Registered in England No. 3877626 Registered Office 256 Foleshill Road Coventry CV6 5AB --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:28:16 -0800 (PST) From: tg dewey To: The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Baked POTATO Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net People... this is killing me... It's POTATO!!! Not POTATOE.... --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:01:27 -0800 (PST) From: Charles Richards To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Beating the diet horse to death Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <> Did you wait 1-2 hours after running before you ate; you'll burn up more fat that way. And also, all your diet comments may be negated by the fact that you run so much, if that is in fact what you do. <> Dear Randall, Now you have my interest because I HATE running. But, can you direct me to some more research about how long to wait after eating to increase fat burning? I'm curious about that, and the fact that running may negate the effects of the diet....tell me more (off line is OK). For the rest of the list, remember I said read Dr. Atkins' entire book before begining the program. Everyone is familiar with the Induction (little to no carbs), but the ongoing weight loss and maintenance diet are scientifically finding you "no-gain" carb intake level, which is different for everyone. Sugar (including fructose) does not work with induction. However, for someone with a critical carb level of say 65-70 grams per day, fruit and high carb veggies may be a part of their regular diet. One of the big concepts of completing all phases of the diet is killing your addiction for sugar. My maintenance diet will probably look like the Asian Diet plus the habbit of getting on the scale daily and adjusting as needed, with Induction as a tool to use against "oops I went on a binge or had a craving..." I'm sure the rest of the list is ready to move on to another topic so if you have information pro or con about Atkins Diet, please post me privately to save Ray some bandwidth. Yours in Jung Do, Charles Richards Moja Kwan TangSooDo __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang), eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:40:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] Over the River... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Since many of you (esp in the US) may be headed over the river and through the woods for Thanksgiving dinner... have a good one. And remember those infamous woods from our friend the turkey, you are what you eat. gobble gobble... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:14:21 -0800 From: Brooke Thomas To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] November McDougall Newsletter Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List- I promised to send this in when it came out and I just received Dr. McDougall's latest newsletter. I am copy-and-pasting only the section as related to the Atkins Diet...I am sorry about the length: Atkins Diet Is As Good as Chemotherapy for Weight Loss Research released Monday, November 18, 2002, at the annual scientific meeting of the American Heart Association, showed that people on the Atkins low-carbohydrate diet lost more weight and had better cholesterol and triglyceride counts than people on a traditional Heart Association-approved low-fat diet. The study was funded by the Dr. Robert C. Atkins Foundation, a private nonprofit organization that funds research on carbohydrates and was founded by the author of the Atkins diet. The study was conducted by Dr. Eric Westman, an internist at Duke University's diet and fitness center. Studied were 120 overweight volunteers, who were randomly assigned to the Atkins diet or the Heart Association's Step 1 diet. The Atkins diet limits carbohydrates to less than 20 grams a day, and has no limit on intake of fats or cholesterol. The diet is mostly meat, poultry, fish, eggs, and cheese. The Step 1 AHA diet is about 30% of energy (calories) from fat, 50 to 60% of energy from carbohydrate, 10 to 20% of energy from protein, and less than 300 mg cholesterol per day. This is considered a well-balanced, heart-healthy diet, and is not really intended for weight loss. Here Are the Results (after six months): •Thirty-one pounds lost on Atkins versus 20 pounds on an AHA low-fat diet. • HDL (good cholesterol), up 6 mg/dl with the Atkins, down 2 mg/dl with the AHA diet. • LDL (bad cholesterol) - little change with either diet. • Triglycerides: down 49 % with the Atkins, down 22% with the AHA. So What Does This Prove? The results of the new study by Dr. Westman are not published yet, so all I have is the newspaper report. But Dr. Westman did publish results of subjects who had been 6 months on the Atkins diet in the July 2002 issue of the American Journal of Medicine (This study was also funded by Atkins).1 These results show: Cholesterol: Down 11 mg/dl LDL Cholesterol: Down 10 mg/dl HDL cholesterol: Up 10 mg/dl Triglycerides: Down 56 mg/dl Urinary Calcium: Up 86 mg/24 hours (a contributor to kidney stones and osteoporosis) Symptomatic Adverse Effects: 68% reported constipation 63% reported bad breath 51% reported headaches The AHA Diet Is Almost Useless: The American Heart Association Diet is only slightly better than the American diet and would not be expected to show impressive results. For example, 22 physician practices from communities in Western Pennsylvania and West Virginia treated a total of 450 adults with cholesterol levels in the 250 - 270 mg/dl range with the Step 1 AHA diet for 18 months.2 They showed a 5.4 mg/dl reduction in cholesterol levels in patients given usual care on the AHA diet. Comparing a useless diet (the AHA diet) to the Atkins diet proves nothing. What they need to compare the Atkins diet with is a very healthy, very-low fat, diet like ours. In 11 days we have shown an average decrease of 29 mg/dl in subjects starting from similar levels of cholesterol. What an Independent Study Shows on Atkins: The only study on adults ever performed which was independent of Atkins' financial influence was published in September of 1980 in the Journal of the American Dietetic Association.3 This study of 24 men and women for 12-weeks (4 weeks on the strict Atkins diet) showed the following after 2 to 4 weeks on the diet: Cholesterol: Up 12.3 mg/dl in both men and women Up 27.3 mg/dl in women Up 1.6 mg/dl in men LDL (bad) Cholesterol: Up 23 mg/dl for both men and women Up 37.8 mg/dl for women Up 11.6 mg/dl for men HDL (good) cholesterol: Down 2.9 mg/dl for both men and women Down 6.7 mg/dl for women Down 0.21 for men Uric acid (kidney stones and gout): Up 1.8 mg/dl[PARA]Free Fatty Acids (can cause arrhythmias): Up 426 mEq/ml (nearly doubled)[PARA]Triglycerides:[PARA] Down 45 mg/dl in both men and women After 8 weeks the average weight loss was nearly 17 pounds. Therefore, in independent research supported from a grant from the Washington Heart Association, cholesterol levels become worse with the meat, cheese, and egg-laden Atkins diet - big surprise. How Could Cholesterol Levels Improve by Eating Cholesterol? How did Westman get the results all your friends are talking about? The Atkins diet works by making people so sick that they eat less of all foods. The primary mechanism for this approach is to produce a condition called ketosis. In this state the appetite is suppressed and people eat less - including less cholesterol and fat - than they were eating before going on the diet. Ketosis is a condition that occurs naturally when people become seriously ill. It is an adaptive mechanism that allows the body to recuperate during times of illness rather than being overwhelmed by a strong hunger drive, forcing them to gather and prepare food. Because the Atkins diet takes advantage of a state found with illness, I call this diet "the make yourself sick diet." Similar changes in body weight, cholesterol and triglyceride levels also occur when people become ill for other reasons. A classic example is cancer chemotherapy. Typically people on these toxic medications become ill, lose their appetite, eat much less food, lose weight and lower their cholesterol, blood sugars, and triglycerides. Therefore, next time, in addition to testing Atkins' diet against a healthy plant based diet; there should also be a control group on chemotherapy for a realistic comparison. Atkins Is the Saddam Hussein of the Diet Industry How could anyone take seriously a diet program that served all that cholesterol and fat-laden food and caused side effects like calcium loss, constipation, bad breath, and headaches? Is it because people are so desperate to lose weight they would do anything? Even sacrifice their health? Look closely at people on the Atkins diet. They may lose a few pounds but they look like "death warmed over." They have sallow complexions, look tired and sickly. Would you expect otherwise? They are sick from serious malnutrition. And speaking of sick-looking people, before April of 2002 the founder of the Atkins' diet, Robert C. Atkins, appeared grossly overweight. I would estimate 60 pounds overweight - but it was hard to tell because he always covered his protruding abdomen with a large coat. Since April of 2002, when he suffered a cardiac arrest and nearly died from cardiomyopathy, arrhythmias, and heart failure, he has been conspicuously absent from public view. I call for an inspection of Dr. Atkins' health - this is not an unreasonable request. Such a public figure is obliged to make a public appearance - especially since recent reports of his diet proclaim it is heart healthy. Unfortunately, he has become the "Saddam Hussein of the diet world" - keeping potentially deadly secrets - the consequences on his own health of following his own diet - from the public. (See the June 2002 McDougall Newsletter to learn why I believe his own diet contributed to his heart failure.) So What Works for Losing Weight and Gaining Health? There is only one way to lose weight, to lower cholesterol, blood sugar, blood pressure, triglycerides, uric acid and to become healthier (looking and feeling healthy too) and that is by means of a low-fat, plant-based diet (and some clean habits and exercise). I would put the results of our diet up against any of the high protein gurus' recommendations, as well as the recommendations of the Heart Association. Those of you who follow such a program as ours should have no doubt about the results of such a contest. Until such direct testing is done you can rely upon thousands of research papers that show without any argument that high protein diets are hazardous and a low-fat high carbohydrate diet is the road to super health and lifelong weight loss.[PARA]References: 1) Westman E. Effect of 6-month adherence to a very low carbohydrate diet program.[NL]Am J Med. 2002 Jul;113(1):30-6. 2) Caggiula AW. Cholesterol-lowering intervention program. Effect of the step I diet in community office practices. Arch Intern Med. 1996 Jun 10;156(11):1205-13.[PARA]3) Larosa JC. Effects of high-protein, low-carbohydrate dieting on plasma lipoproteins and body weight. J Am Diet Assoc. 1980 Sep;77(3):264-70.[PARA] 2002 John McDougall All Rights Reserved --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest