Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:01:52 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 9 #588 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. "Actions & Mannerisms" (Dewitt, Garrett) 2. re: Cross training for TSD and TKD artists (Joel McTague) 3. Cross training for TSD and TKD artists (Dewitt, Garrett) 4. TSD and other Arts (Dunn, Danny J GARRISON) 5. RE: TSD and other Arts (Mike Michna) 6. Re: Wheeled chair technique (DrgnSlyr5@aol.com) 7. Chair techniques (Ray Terry) 8. Re: successor (ABurrese@aol.com) 9. another ITF website (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Dewitt, Garrett" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:44:53 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] "Actions & Mannerisms" Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Michael Wrote: I don't know about you folks but in my book a persons actions and mannerisms define who he is to me, and that is how I judge to either be around them and listen to them or to forget them and move on,, my two cents. Michael Tomlinson Hello Michael. This is a powerful statement/comment. I have believed and lived this exact thing for most of my life. A few years ago I met Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman and Grandmaster J.R. West. What I also saw in their "actions and mannerisms" has kept me training with/under Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman and whenever possible, I attend Grandmaster West's Annual Hapkido Seminar. Although it would be very positive for the majority of martial artist to see Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman and Grandmaster J.R. West on the cover of Tae Kwon Do Times, most of us who know them also know that "these two gentlemen are the real deal." To use your words Michael, "their personal actions and mannerisms" speak volumes. Master Garrett DeWitt www.btkd.net --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Joel McTague" To: Subject: re: [The_Dojang] Cross training for TSD and TKD artists Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 14:58:21 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Chris, I'll be testing for my third dan in TKD early next year and my 2nd Dan in Hapkido sometime soon as well. I found that hapkido works well once you start grabbing the person and TKD when you're in a punching-kicking range, but then there's the problem of what happens if the fight ends up on the ground or you're in need of a quick weapon or two. Additionally, my first instructor was very good at drilling us on blocks and we actually utilized them in sparring (both controlled in the dojang and out on the street), which seems to be a lost art in TKD. I've heard several practioners preach against blocks as an ineffective use of energy, increased risk of injury, and a better alternative of launching a quick counter. Although I formally studied other systems by enrolling in different schools so I could supplement my training, I did not worry that much about rank in those other styles. I look to see what the other styles have to offer and utilize it to complement those areas that are lacking in the more traditional TKD and Hapkido training. For example, my original Hapkido program did have some groundfighting in it, but it looks as if it would only take you to blue belt in the Gracie system, so I've looked at the Gracie system and studies the materials through their black belt. I didn't have a lot of traditional weapons training (just the obvious - stick, knife and gun) so I started incorporating many of the Japanese style weapons into my training. Wing Chung and JKD offer nice complements to Hapkido (my next series of incorporations), especially in terms of blocking. It is my understanding that there are several practioners who, at the higher levels, undertake their own research on different styles. If I recall correctly, there was either an essay or a report on the net that there was one person who, for their upper dan requirement, wrote a thesis on a comparason between Korean and Chinese martial art blocking systems. Joel Martin McTague, J.D., M.B.A., D.B.A. (Fin) candidate, R.F.C. 2nd Dan, Tae Kwon Do; 1st Dan, Hapkido mctague@worldnet.att.net --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Dewitt, Garrett" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Subject: [The_Dojang] Cross training for TSD and TKD artists Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 14:00:50 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Chris. Your searching for "something more" seems quite common within the TSD/TKD training area. I personally have trained in TSD (4th Dahn) and it seems like forever, in TKD (Chung Do Kwan 6th Dahn). My TSD instructor, GM Chung Lee, was very adamant about teaching us HoShinSul Hapkido. This Hapkido has remained with me and we have also incorporated quite a bit of Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman's Kong Shin Bup curriculum. The students at my DoJang really work hard at our "somewhat" complex curriculum, however, they thoroughly enjoy both Hapkido styles and the numerous techniques. I have trained with/under a few "internationally known" Grandmasters, however, my eyes and ears were really opened to the Hapkido/Weapons training a few years ago upon visiting and training with Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman. The bumps, bruises and total brain fatigue (thank you Mr. Lorne Keatley) I have endured over the last few years with Grandmaster Timmerman have proven to be a very positive training curriculum for us here in central Minnesota. Best wishes in your future cross training. Master Garrett DeWitt www.btkd.net --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Dunn, Danny J GARRISON" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 14:08:49 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] TSD and other Arts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Chris, I wont speak for TKD, because I haven't maintained a lot of close links, but second Arts by TSD folks are common, as I suspect they are for most advanced students. The most common I know of from friends and acquaintances are Hapkido, Tai Chi ( or other internal Chinese Arts)and Judo. A lot of folks also like to train with all sorts of weapons. Danny Dunn <<<<<<>>>>>>> --__--__-- Message: 5 Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] TSD and other Arts Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 14:15:32 -0600 From: "Mike Michna" To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >From my own perspective I agree. I also include Krav Maga in my training. It has excellent gun, knife and club defenses Michael Michna 2nd Dan -----Original Message----- From: Dunn, Danny J GARRISON [mailto:danny.dunn@redstone.army.mil] Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 2:09 PM To: 'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net' Subject: [The_Dojang] TSD and other Arts Chris, I wont speak for TKD, because I haven't maintained a lot of close links, but second Arts by TSD folks are common, as I suspect they are for most advanced students. The most common I know of from friends and acquaintances are Hapkido, Tai Chi ( or other internal Chinese Arts)and Judo. A lot of folks also like to train with all sorts of weapons. Danny Dunn <<<<<<>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 6 From: DrgnSlyr5@aol.com Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 16:22:18 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Wheeled chair technique Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 12/18/2002 11:20:15 AM Pacific Standard Time, the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net writes: << Any significant changes/updates from the basic set of chair hoshinsul techs? i.e. I have learned/taught basic chair hoshinsul (as opposed to your basic WWF steel chair techniques :) , but not sure how similar these would be to techniques that would work well in a wheeled chair...??? >> Not knowing what your "basic set" consists of, that's hard to answer. I'm assuming we're talking about a student who is chair-bound? In general, that rules out all the tech that must be completed by leaving the chair. (Example of an exception given below). Our "basic" set includes defenses against attacks from standing front, side, and rear positions, and side-by-side seating. From a wheeled chair, you have the variables of ground surface, whether or not the defender can use the chair brakes and/or turn the chair to advantage, and again, individual levels of limb mobility, coordination, and strength. One of my family members who was wheelchair-bound had this cool removable brake handle that would have made an excellent weapon. Do they still make chairs like that? Some time ago it was shared on a list (don't remember if it was this one or another) about a chair-bound MA being attacked. As I recall, he had good upper-body strength, but no use of his legs. He launched himself out of the chair and grabbing with his arms did a leg takedown. From the ground he applied a disabling finish which ended the confrontation. I know Patrick has taught students disabled from birth, and from strokes and accidents. Perhaps he can add here? Sharon --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 14:47:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] Chair techniques Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Actually, in hindsight, I guess my fav 'chair' technique -is- the WWF (now WWE) steel chair technique. i.e. pick up the chair and hit them over the head with it, repeatedly... :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: ABurrese@aol.com Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:11:14 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: successor Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mike T stated: "You can't tell me that the Hapkido that J.R. West learned and practiced in Vietnam during the war wasn't old style Hapkido." I don't know Mike, the TKD Times article said Chris G was the only American to practice "old style HKD." Just because Chris G was born in 1974 and GM West was practicing and received dan rank in the 60s (as well as other American students back then), don't you believe the TKD Times article? Or are you going to listen to someone like Vic C. who suggests that maybe someone, and not GM Ji, had something to gain by what was printed in that issue, and maybe what was printed was not very accurate? Hmm.... And I'm still not saying those that were practicing way back when are old, just experienced.... Yours in Training, Alain (who agrees with both Vic and Mike's posts) www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 17:39:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] another ITF website Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Forwarded message: New ITF Website and Contact Information Dear Members, I think you have already received the decision which was adopted at the ITF Board of Directors' meeting held in headquarters of International Taekwon-Do Federation in Vienna, Austria on 16th. Nov. 2002. As you see well, some traitors and plotters including Mr. Tom MacCallum were dismissed from their posts, but they are still attempting to destroy our ITF family by cheating you with the false communication. For instance, Mr. Tom MacCallum tries to approach you through the ITF website and even asks you to send all information and mails to his private house. Therefore, we made a decision to establish a new ITF website and e-mail at the Board of Directors' meeting. Let me advise you to get in touch with ITF in the future through the following addresses: Official ITF website: www.internationaltaekwon-dofederation.com, Email: ITFChangUng@hotmail.com The secretariat of ITF remains in the same place and the address is same as before. Yours in TKD, Hwang Kwang Sung Acting Secretary General ITF --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-866-4632 FAX 719-866-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest