Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 03:01:50 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #122 - 12 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Hapkido Eagle (Bryce Burrows) 2. Dr. James Dussalt? (Greg Nabel) 3. RE: Spiritual and other stuff (Ali Alnasser) 4. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Actually.............?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 5. Jackson Seminar (Charles Richards) 6. Bruce's Comments (Stovall, Craig) 7. Re: Hapkido Heaven (Victor Cushing) 8. Back from Jackson (Hapkido Self Defense Center) 9. Master West is Awesome!!!!!! (Braeswood Martial Arts) 10. Titles (Rudy Timmerman) 11. shindig survival (Ray Terry) 12. Re: Hapkido Eagle (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 11:24:17 +1100 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Bryce Burrows Subject: [The_Dojang] Hapkido Eagle Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi I'm looking for information regarding the hapkido eagle symbol (you know, the one with the spear) The best information I have indicates that it comes from Master Lee Jung Nam. This excerpt from an email discussion with another hapkido practitioner... "I met Mervin Tan Chye Long (Singapore Flying Eagle Hap Ki Do instructor) long ago in a gym in London and he started telling me all about how Master Sunny Tan Sar Bee and Master Lee trained together. He then showed my his uniform (Singapore), and the uniform of Flying Eagle Hap Ki Do (London). They use the same eagle picture and claim it's lineage to Master Lee. I also met Kim Jin Pal (http://www.jinpal.com/main-t.htm) when I was living in the USA. I trained with his son in a gym north of Washington DC. Kim Jin Pal spoke very well of Master Lee and was very excited one of Master Lee's students was in his class. Kim Jin Pal does NOT use the eagle image. http://www.bparanque.com/jinpal/ might interest you (Master Lee on the left image in the middle, Jin Pal is in the right image). http://hybrid-hapkido.tripod.com/hybridhapkido/id10.html Is one place that links it's lineage to Master Lee. http://hapkidokr.org/ is another. " Http://www.hapkido-info.net/html/family_tree.html is useful as well. Does anyone have any information regarding the origin of the eagle and spear (not so interesting in the meanings etc but rather the origin) -- Bryce Burrows [demime 0.98e removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature] --__--__-- Message: 2 From: gnabe@webtv.net (Greg Nabel) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 22:47:58 -0500 (EST) To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Dr. James Dussalt? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Looking up an old friend, Jim Dussalt: anyone ??? Thank you, g. Traditional Martial Arts & Holistic Therapy, Reiki / Qigong; Kama Sutra http://community.webtv.net/gnabe/SHIMMERINGLIGHT, gnabelhealings@aol.com, --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Ali Alnasser" To: Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 23:26:51 +0900 (KST) Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Spiritual and other stuff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >>>Your brain is physical. Your mental activity is physical. Your body and it's processes are physical. In the end...it's ALL physical. Your "spirituality" will be small comfort against the objective reality of the transference of kinetic energy from the gang banger's brass knuckled fist as he repeatedly smashes your face from the mounted position. Why is this so hard to get?>>> Mr Sexton, this is NOT what I said. I am not the author of this statement. It is sad that cops die all the time. Its something that should be expected in this day and age. While in the academy, there was a fellow who quite during his last two weeks of training after he realized he would have to kill someone if it really came down to it. All of the staff said: "Oh, really. Where have you been for the last 23 weeks of training".[TABLE NOT SHOWN] [TABLE NOT SHOWN][TABLE NOT SHOWN][IMAGE] --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:10:25 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Actually.............?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Randall: "......Don't knock the spiritual aspects too much as some of the world's greastest martial artists became that way because of it. The philosophy of most martial arts is to better oneself (in all ways) and to avoid violence; this philosophy should not be confused with the potentially violent techniques that are taught. ........" If you truely think about it, "spirituality" is actually what we are discussing. Oh, I know there is a lot of banter back and forth about power in ones' techniques, what happens in REAL conbat and so forth. But if you actually think about the tenor of the conversation what people seem to be comparing (even at a lesser- more subtle level) is the purpose or intention for why we are doing what we are doing. Formulation and maintanance of a Purpose is at the heart of spirituality, and while different people use different venues --- Religion, Politics, Social Consciousness, etc.--- we all know and fear what a life without a sense of Purpose would be like. In the Korean culture survival of the small group through consensus guided by a designated stong personality provides for much of the Purpose for their institutions. From what I have been able to gleen in my reading, part of the process is the continual rise of alternate strong personalities to compete with one another for the position of "guide". If there are enough individuals, the originating small group splits into two or three smaller groups under new leaders which continue to grow until they split again. It does not matter if the groups' designated activity is pottery, martial arts, iron-working or government--- the pattern remains the same. I share all of this because rather than dissecting what constitutes "effective" combat tactics and strategy in anachronistic KMA perhaps we need to be examining where each of our respective small groups are in the cellular process of multiplication. I believe this too is a matter of Spirituality (AKA: "formulation and maintanence of Purpose") in the Korean Martial Arts. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:56:52 -0800 (PST) From: Charles Richards To: Dojang Digest Cc: "J. R. West" Subject: [The_Dojang] Jackson Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear List, Glad to say I'm back in north Georgia after a fun filled weekend down in Jackson. I can only say it seems to just keep getting better. The warm feeling of seeing so many "old friends." and the excitement of meeting new contemporaries like Charlie V (who is BTW an excellent technician). This year for the kick punch guys we had about 40 or 50 folks in early for the TSD session. Master Mac really got us thinking on basic motion in an advanced way, and Master Lee gave me a new respect for the Yuk Rho Hyung by doing them first hand. Master Mac even let me bore folks for a few minutes :-) I also want to thank each an every session presenter for your dedication and southern hospitallity. My 7th Gup that went is still on cloud nine with excitement with all the stuff we learned this weekend. He's even grinning about the rest of the gups that don't know we'll be working palm strikes and other fun stuff this week :-) Of course GM West and his cadre always make me feel welcome and at home. I also want to thank list member GM Timmerman for the out in the parking lot brick breaking lessons, when he should have been resting for the three day drive back to Canada. Seeing the dedication and commitment to the arts people like GM West, GM Timmerman, and Master Booth put forth to make these events happen is truly inspiring and humbling. Seeing that level of leadership in action makes my strugle with Wansu seem like the easiest part of working towards my 5th Dan. If Ray will allow me the bandwidth, I'd also like to plug the July 26th event Kat Kelly will be hosting GM Timmerman for. All Texans should consider this a warning of a potential north Georgia invasion. And seriously, if you're serious about korean martial arts and missed Jackson, start making plans for Houston right now! Yours in Jung Do, Charles Richards www.mojakwan.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 12:01:33 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Bruce's Comments Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce writes, <<>> I can't argue with one thing that you've said in your post. I agree with most of it. Where I fall short is in trying to understand what in the world it has to do with what I was talking about. Either I'm not communicating well... One more time...and then I'm done. Violence happens. Other things also happen in life...like losing your job, breaking up with your girlfriend, scratching your favorite Lawrence Welk CD, etc, etc, etc. My point is very simple: 1. You are physically attacked, and the situation is "fer real". Rare? Depends largely on where you live, and your recreational habits. But it happens. 2. Some people think that at that point the governing principle is to "increase the love in the world" by refraining from inflicting undue harm (which is SO easy) upon one's misguided attacker because that would be outside the tenets of an art that I learned because Wing Chun was my first choice, but there was no Wing Chun school in the town that I grew up in, so I walked into this Hapkido school and it was really cool how they threw each other around, and this guy was talking about "ki" and "harmony" and it really struck a chord because I was all into Bob Dylan at the time, and I made the cognitive decision that if this gift called life were ever put into danger that I would somehow turn off the reptilian brain through some Herculean effort of cerebral gymnastics, and turn my back on my sense of survival while ignoring the fact that the aforementioned is the only reason humanity was able to pull itself to the top of the ecological food chain so that we could have things like Bob Dylan, the printing press, vanilla ice cream, and Hapkido...WHEW!!! 3. Some people are like me and believe that "living" takes precedence over "living up to" any dreamed up ideals within the literal "here and now" of a violent attack. Sue me for being selfish. 4. All other situations that did not involve a physical attack...I wasn't addressing. Now, I have no idea what Americans and their IGS (Immediate Gratification Syndrome), predatory nature of humans, character assassination, losing one's job, the rising cost of health care, emotional over-attachment to Enron and Martha Stewart's trading activities, or Dirty Harry (and other absurd icons of American machismo) have to do with the point that I was trying to make. I have a sneaking suspicion that they have a LOT to do with real and/or perceived events going on in your particular corner of this solipsistic tea party that we call "the universe". But I'm not qualified to make that determination...I leave that to the folks in the mental health care sector. Or, maybe you're trying to lend perspective by defining "what's really tough" within the context of the hum-drum existential vacuum of our daily lot. For what it's worth, I don't say the things I do in order to sound tough, or seasoned, or to put on the pretense of being a killer under glass, or to share the hard lessons I learned growing up on the mean streets of Bugtussle, AR. I say them because I think it's the only logical conclusion. In regards to the forging of my own character...that was all taken care of in June of 1998 when I was informed that my 8 day-old son had Down Syndrome. You don't know what emptiness is until you've stared into the black abyss of dreams and expectations that have been decimated quicker than the doctor can say "I think we need to run some tests". You may know this...you may not. I hope you don't. At any rate, I always appreciate any talk of martial arts "building character"...somehow all of that sweating and fighting didn't prepare me for my moment of truth. Trust me, there is no correlation between the depths of character that one has to draw upon in such a situation, and the number of times one has yelled "Yes, sir!" while standing at attention in a sweaty dobok. But that's my experience...other people's mileage may vary. Sincerely, Logan's Dad --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 15:20:01 -0500 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net,the_dojang@martialartsresource.ne t From: Victor Cushing Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Hapkido Heaven Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net How many times have you been somewhere wishing you were somewhere else? Well for the past three days I found myself thinking "This is where I always wanted to be." In case you haven't guessed the location was Master J.R. West's semi-annual Hapkido and related Korean martial arts seminar. What a great opportunity to train with all sorts of folks and in some cases finally put a real face with a smile on it to people I have corresponded with but never met before. I enjoyed the place, the people, and the food. I am already planning for August and the next iteration. Sessions I attended included ones taught by Master J.R. West , the venerable Master Ray Terry, the comedic and Hapkido styling of Master Geoff Booth, Master Jere Hilland, Master Perry Lyons, Master Instructor Javad Tavassoli (hope spelling is correct) and Wayne Watkins (who managed to jimmy open my rental car when I locked the keys inside it). I also got to socialize with Master Dennis McHenry, Master Rich Hodder, Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman as well as the others already mentioned. Some of my training partners included Alain Burrese, and Chris Lacava. For anyone considering how to spend three great days in Hapkido Heaven, go to Jackson, Mississippi in August. Vic Cushing --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Hapkido Self Defense Center" To: Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 16:26:57 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Back from Jackson Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net We had a great time in Jackson this past weekend at the 18th International Hapkido Seminar. Congratulations to Master Rich Hodder on his 8th dan in taekwondo and his 2nd dan in hapkido! It was great to meet many of you and see the others again! Jere R. Hilland www.hapkidoselfdefense.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: "Dojang Digest" Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 17:37:21 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Master West is Awesome!!!!!! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net WOW!!!! I can never say enough about Master West and all from the West Hapkido Academy. This past weekend was my 3rd seminar and I can tell you March will be an annual trip to Jackson. I always learn so much when I am with Master West and he has found a way for me to train with my master who lives some 2700 miles away from me. A simple thank you never seems like it is enough. So this year I brought along 2 students. I am sure we will at least double that next year. The 7-8 hour drive home was filled with nothing but stories of smiling sweating and learning all weekend. I am sorry we had to leave out so early on Sunday morning and miss the sessions at WHA, but I had two boys to get home to. To Master West and Mr. Watkins I thank you very much for your constant support and your mention of our July Seminar. To Charles, it was great meeting you and thank you for the plug. I am looking forward to welcoming you to my dojang. (Congrats on your two bricks. I am hoping to include brick breaking as part of our summer NKMAA seminar.) To all the 2004 after hours club participants, it was fun and educational. We will see if the Kat Luck hold out for 3 years in a row next March. Thanks to all my partners and a special thanks to Master Instructor Lorne Keatley for everything, and as always Master Timmerman seeing you always makes me homesick for the Sault. Kat --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 22:22:44 -0800 From: Rudy Timmerman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Titles Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Kat writes: > Hello Jere, (Kwan Jang) > It will be great to be a part of that picture this year. > BTW Native Texan myself (native Houstonian actually) > See you in a couple of days, travel safely. > Sincerely, Kat Hello Kat: I just got back from Jackson, and I had planned to get right to sleep; however, I could not help but notice the error in your note to Jere. As you have chosen me as your teacher, I could not let the opportunity to help you slip by. I realize we are pretty relaxed here on the DD, but if you are going to use a title, do it right and use "NIM" after Kwan Jang. I could have written to you privately, but there are many others who apparently are also not aware of this formality. I took the liberty to address this issue in public, because I am comfortable in the knowledge that you understand my motive is not to hurt your feelings, but to help. Sincerely, Rudy --__--__-- Message: 11 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:59:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] shindig survival Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Back from J-town. Had a great time down in Jackson at the International HKD and KMA seminar. Good to see ya'll again. Congrats to Master Hodder on his 8th Dan! Or should it now be Grandmaster Hodder. More later. Off to bed... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 12 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Hapkido Eagle To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 22:00:09 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I'm looking for information regarding the hapkido eagle symbol (you > know, the one with the spear) >From Grandmaster JI Han-jae... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719.866.4632 FAX 719.866.4642 ustutkd1@mailsnare.net www.ustu.org Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest