Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:01:46 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #132 - 16 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Korean language in class (A. Boyd) 2. Internet Patch Service (FirstPe315@aol.com) 3. RE: flags and bowing/saluting (John Wallace) 4. Re: crescent kick (Jeremy/Caltera School) 5. Superman (rich hodder) 6. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Korean_custom=3F_?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 7. taekwondo and taekyon movie clips (Davide Sorrentino) 8. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Naihanchi_Redux?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 9. I got in a fight last night in a bar; true story (Ken McDonough) 10. Thanks Master Rich! (Morgan James) 11. Re: Lorne's recap (Lorne Keatley) 12. student of GM Rim (Amed Hazel) 13. Re: Re: Lorne's recap (Braeswood Martial Arts) 14. Re: student of GM Rim (Braeswood Martial Arts) 15. Bar Fight and Analysis or Lessons Learned (Ken McDonough) 16. Alain Buresse video online (Dennis McHenry) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 23:07:23 -0500 (EST) From: "A. Boyd" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean language in class Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have to agree with Bruce on this one. I think it's awesome when people want to investigate a new culture fully and explore a new language. I think that is a necessary thing if we plan to survive the present and make a future. I envy those who have a facility for learning languages. However, apart from preparing students to come to Korea and study, I fail to see how using the Korean language for everything in class - especially when most people are parroting poorly heard/terribly transcribed sounds (as separate from actual words), is useful. Passing on real knowledge is fantastic but if it's unintelligible to an actual speaker of the language what good was it? A part of things is nationalistic. I cheerfully muddle my way through classes here in Korea using Korean and hoping that people get a sense of what I mean. I'm terrible at using the Korean language. People are pleased by my attempt. I do it because I am in Korea and the majority of people in class are Korean. Regardless I still think of my sword as a sword and not as a do or gum. Teachers who emigrate to English speaking nations use their own language because it's normal for them. On one memorable occasion I noticed that a class I was in charge of had two English native speakers and one Korean native speaker. Koreans study English in school for roughly 8-10 years. The English speakers had been in Korea for a little more than a year. I began to use English in class and the outcry by the home team was immediate and emotional. I don't recall complaining when the shoe was on the other foot - my foot. C'est la vie. I changed back to mangled Korean which meant nothing or less than nothing to the listeners and we communicated by body language. I did my best to teach and left dissatisfied. The Korean student complained not because she couldn't understand the class if were taught in English but because it was wrong to teach it in English. There's a big difference there in my opinion. ===== Anthony Boyd: Swordsman and English Teacher www.stormpages.com/haidonggumdo ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca --__--__-- Message: 2 From: FirstPe315@aol.com Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 00:33:56 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Internet Patch Service Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To All- Could whoever sent that sight oh so long ago on the Internet that does patches cheap, could you please do it again. Thx. Jeff --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "John Wallace" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] flags and bowing/saluting Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 21:42:00 -0800 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Our dojang had the US, California, South Korean, and Japanese flags on the wall (we're a Danzan-ryu jujutsu dojo as well). Since 9/11, only the US and California flags have been displayed for bowing to. I think our master instructor had the same thought as you Mr. Boyd, and realized that bowing to a foreign flag, however friendly the relations between the countries, wasn't something he wanted to perpetuate. Personally, I'm of two minds on the subject - I like acknowledging the Eastern cultures that gave birth to the arts I study; on the other hand, we can do that in other ways than by bowing to the nationalistic symbols of the modern countries where those cultures reside. John W. I Dan, TKD & 5th kyu, jujutsu (passed the latest board requirements!) Fremont, CA ------------------------ > From: A. Boyd[SMTP:ANTHONYBTBOYD@YAHOO.COM] > Subject: [The_Dojang] flags and bowing/saluting > Auto forwarded by a Rule > However you choose to spell it in English, "kuk ki" means national flag. "Won-ki" means Association Flag. The verb follows and is generally used to mean bow but it the case of flags means the right hand is placed over the heart. As an aside I find it rather interesting that it never occurs to most people how strange it is to expect someone of a different nationality to salute your flag. Respect is one thing. Saluting is something else. Do you know what I mean? --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Jeremy/Caltera School" To: Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 01:15:53 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: crescent kick Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >I've heard about the crescent kick on the DD quite a few times. Maybe JKN >Kat Kelley, since we have trained together, can tell me the kuk sool >name/version for this kick. (Or anyone else who has crosstrained in KSW) >thanks >michael whalen KSWnut Would this be called, antari? Jeremy Callner --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "rich hodder" To: "Dojang Digest" Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 07:17:43 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Superman Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master Mac, Thanks for the compliments, you and Mindy are giving me a swelled head. Not really, it's hard to inflate such an empty vessel 8^) . Master West asked me the next day if I had receieved the red boots and cape yet, I had to tell him that I had not. He said not to worry, he had not either. There was a funny side effect though, I had this uncontrolable urge to go around singing "Here I come to save the day" but that passed after a few days, much to the delight of Rosemary. SJN Timmerman, Thank you for the kind words, I will take them to heart. However, I think next time we take a picture with You, me and Master West, it may do the photographer a favor if I have a chair to stand on, that way I could at least come up to standing shoulder to shoulder with you both. Ok, maybe that would be, head to shoulder. Have fun and I will see you in July, Rich HodderGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 07:59:27 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Korean_custom=3F_?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Mark: ".....Bowing is a Korean (Asian) custom. Does it make the respect of your students more sincere to use a Korean sign of respect, then to use a more Americanized approach?....." Actually I don't think there is a culture around the World that does not use a bow to signify either recognition or deference. In the West people have been bowing all the way up to present day, including the time-honored gesture of "taking a bow" at the end of a performance. Although in most modern of times the "nod" is substituted for a full bow, there is nothing distinctly Korean, or even Oriental about the custom. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Davide Sorrentino" To: Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 15:17:01 +0100 Subject: [The_Dojang] taekwondo and taekyon movie clips Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi to all! I'm Davide from Naples, Italy! I'm looking for taekwondo and taekyon movie clips on the net, but i haven't found them... Do you know where i can find them? Thanks a lot!!! Pil seung Davide. --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 08:07:39 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Naihanchi_Redux?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Mac: ".... There were a lot of differences from when I first learned Edan and Samdan than how TSD does it and I had to make a lot of changes (I don't even remember the old way I used to do it - more from ShotoKan)......" At last count there are three variants to Naifanchi (four if you live in Tiajuana). When you execute this kata as a Korean hyung do you perform each of the variants as an individual form or do you chainthemtogether at some one to form a single long hyung? There is a lot of theory around these approaches and I am wondering if the folks who practice this particual kata have a special take on this. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 06:29:07 -0800 (PST) From: Ken McDonough To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Cc: martialscience@topica.com Subject: [The_Dojang] I got in a fight last night in a bar; true story Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I got in a fight last night. I did not start it. Details will follow. Ken --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Morgan James To: 'Dojang Digest' Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 09:38:42 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Thanks Master Rich! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thank you for the kind words and welcome into the USKMAF family Master Hodder. The weekend in Jackson was definitely one of the highlights of my MA carreer. I look forward to a long and prosper future with you, Master West and the entire USKMAF family. Can't wait to have you up here in "West By-God Virginia"!! James Morgan GTKDA www.gtkda.com --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 10:54:14 -0500 From: Lorne Keatley To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Lorne's recap Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi Master Mac, The palm strikes do mess up your insides a bit, but it is all survivable. Actually it is the only time I actually look forward to falling to the floor. The mats just seem softer then for some reason. :) Good for Mindy. Martial arts is the only sport where you can slap around friends and family with no repercussions. Well, there is hockey but no ice down south. Now lacrosse or rugby could be a substitute. I got quite a look from Master Tavassoli when he figured out what was going to happen to him. I was actually a little relieved that I was not going to be the only one. It will be good to see you in July. Lorne > > Message: 21 > To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 21:28:40 -0600 > From: d.mchenry@juno.com > Subject: [The_Dojang] Lorne's recap > Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > > " All in all, it was a great experience!! Even the palm strikes (just a > lttle though)." > > Master Lorne, I can't imagine what you received from the hands of Master > Timmerman - heck my little girl backhanded me upside the neck and almost > knocked my lights out - that and the following elbow upside the jaw > rattled my head. > > Master West showed us all what a little slap on the neck would do.... > well all except Master Tavassoli whom I think missed it, because he > looked unconscious at the time ;-) > > Lookin' forward to seeing y'all again in July here in Houston. > > Mac --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "Amed Hazel" To: Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 11:11:09 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] student of GM Rim Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I just wanted to introduce myself to the list. My name is Amed Hazel and I am a student of GM Rim Jong Bae. I have been training in Hapkido for 4 years under GM Rim. I trained in TSDMDK for about 10 years and about 16 years in TKD. I train at GM Rims Baltimore school under his direction. If I can be of any help please let me know. --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Lorne's recap Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:09:59 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Well, there is hockey but no ice down south. Now lacrosse or rugby > could be a substitute. Greetings Lorne Sa Bum Nim, We keep our ice indoors and pucks in the freezer here in Houston. Can't wait to see you all in July. Dojang will be kept as close to 65 degrees as possible. Sincerely, Kat --__--__-- Message: 14 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] student of GM Rim Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:10:52 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Welcome Amed, looking forward to your knowledge here on the DD. Kat Kelly Houston, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amed Hazel" To: Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 10:11 AM Subject: [The_Dojang] student of GM Rim > I just wanted to introduce myself to the list. My name is Amed Hazel and > I am a student of GM Rim Jong Bae. I have been training in Hapkido for 4 > years under GM Rim. I trained in TSDMDK for about 10 years and about 16 > years in TKD. I train at GM Rims Baltimore school under his direction. > If I can be of any help please let me know. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 15 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 18:07:13 -0800 (PST) From: Ken McDonough To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Cc: martialscience@topica.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Bar Fight and Analysis or Lessons Learned Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Over the course of the last several years I have increasingly questioned the traditional teaching methods. Sometimes I miss the mark and may be in error. However, last night in a bar (which was not a biker or bad ass bar) brings home to me the reality that fights last no more than 2 or 3 minutes. Within that brief time it is how you react to a situation and what your training has taught you. This is why I lean toward more combat oriented arts since you have to react to how your trained. So, I plan to meet a friend at this bar after work. I sit down at the bar and I'm having a drink. This long haired guy, tough looking, who is playing pool tells me to move from where I am sitting so he can get a shot. I tell him I will move a little to let him get his shot. Then he tells me a little later "I am not gonna be nice and ask you to move again." I tell him I will move one seat over but I won't be moving again. So he continues playing and talking to his meatball friend and they are both getting off making comments. I tell myself to move to another location and then my friend walks in the bar. He is a friend and I know I can't depend on him to fight. As I am leaving the bar area this guy sez something about kicking asses, and I agree with him. But, in a nice manner. I move clear over to the other side of the bar where there are tables, couples, and a dance floor. But my other eye is on the two meatballs who are not getting any girl action so they want to take there misery in life on someone. You know-- maybe there losers and can't get it up, or they hate their wife or boss. Who the heck knows, your just a target of their screwed up lives. So now these two meatballs are fingering me across the room and want me to step outside, like they think I am some stupid moron. Some of you readers may have done that. Nah, not me. I figure let them get off some steam and they will shortly return to their miserable lives. So, now this long haired meatball starts actually walking over to my table clear across the room. I am having a flashback when I was 22 years old and got my jaw broke and head cracked with a bottle when some other weird guy clocked me when I took my eye off him. But, I remain calm and tell my friend, "See this guy coming over, he wants to fight." It was surreal, sort of like a Pulp Fiction movie. Or maybe Resorvoir Dogs. I watch this mental midget with the long hair (like this is supposed to make him a bad ass) approaching my table clear across the bar and lounge. I know once he enters my territory, I will not be bowing, or trying any conversation. This mother--- wants my ass, and his friend is egging him on. He has to prove his manhood, and thinks I look like a target for his plight in life. He comes up to my table and starts talking some shit. Now, some of you on this list may have tried some other traditional stuff. Well, I like those Professor James tapes (out of New York), and I like that Tony Blauer reality stuff about adrenalin dumping. I don't know what came over me, but I clocked this mother------ and jumped on his ass. I pushed him into the table where about 5 couples were sitting. Continually punching this long haired mother in the face and stomach. Then when he tried to grab me I gave him a groin shot with my leg. Now, it was not a fancy smancy jumping aound shot, but a nice clean shot. And, you know at my age, I can't jump that high anymore. Then he went down and I jumped on him with my knee to his face. This stupid guy never knew what hit him. His meatball friend tried to come around and hit me, but the one woman sitting at the table told his hubby to grab him and he did. (I later bought him some shots). Now to tell you how moronic this guy was, he was still asking me to go outside. He was then asked to leave. Lessons Learned: - Don't engage in "any" discussion with someone like this. Don't even make simple comments. That was my big mistake. - Move away quickly from the situation and swallow your pride or ego. If you move away, you move away from the danger. - If you move away and they person comes after you--you have to attack. Don't wait to be sucker punched. Don't try to be nice. Move quickly. This action on my part resulted in a few hairs being out of place on my head. That was all. - Use what is available to you in the situation. I knew this guy would react with shock when I attacked him, crashed him into the tables, and did not play his game. - Be prepared to explain your actions later. Defend yourself first. People will not help you in the situation, they will just watch in shock. - Use a different exit, if possible, to leave the bar or restaurant. - Carry an edged weapon that is small and concealable. You may have to use it. Anyway, everyone bought me drinks after the fight. I think I am gonna stay home tonight. Bye, Ken McD... --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online --__--__-- Message: 16 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:33:36 GMT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Dennis McHenry Subject: [The_Dojang] Alain Buresse video online Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thanks to Mr. Rusty Solomon and having a camcorder available, I have added another example of a HapKiDo hyung to my forms video page featureing DD's own Alain Buresse taken while we were at JR West's Jackson seminar. Thank you sir for sharing this with us. Mac Master Dennis P. McHenry Houston, Texas USA E-Mail: D.McHenry@juno.com http://McHenry.homeip.net/TangSooDo TangSooDo Director, USKMAF ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719.866.4632 FAX 719.866.4642 ustutkd1@mailsnare.net www.ustu.org Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest