Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:14:04 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #170 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Back home (d.mchenry@juno.com) 2. Korean Sword Sources (Dunn, Danny J GARRISON) 3. Re: Back home (Ray Terry) 4. Re: Korean Sword Sources (Ray Terry) 5. Swords and Turtle Press videos (J T) 6. Koreans and swords (Burdick, Dakin R) 7. Chicago, DownersGrove Semiar (Chosondo@aol.com) 8. USTU Office Email Change (fwd) (Ray Terry) 9. koreans sword II (Burdick, Dakin R) 10. Brisbane Australia (Braeswood Martial Arts) 11. Amsterdam (Rudy Timmerman) 12. RE: Amsterdam, 7 things (Ali Al-Nasser) 13. Re: RE: Amsterdam, 7 things (Ray Terry) 14. Future Home Gym Additions (Ken McDonough) --__--__-- Message: 1 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 22:17:16 -0500 From: d.mchenry@juno.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Back home Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net So Ray, how was Amsterdam? Get into any bar fights? ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Dunn, Danny J GARRISON" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 07:59:48 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean Sword Sources Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce, I sure haven't had any luck finding a Korean blade. If anyone has any sources, I sure hope they will share them. Danny Dunn <<<<>>>>>> --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Back home To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 06:19:49 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > So Ray, how was Amsterdam? Get into any bar fights? Nope, no bar fights. I just kept thinking to myself, now what would Big Ken do. Then I did the opposite... Ray "Ken, just kidding" Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean Sword Sources To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 06:27:45 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >I sure haven't had any luck finding a Korean blade. If anyone has any sources, >I sure hope they will share them. There is/was a place in Seoul (Insa dong) that fronts and old sword maker in Inchon. His swords were once recommended by Robert Young (of Black Belt), so I hunted them down (not easy) and visited their hidden 2nd fl office. It was run by a police man and I understood that most of their swords were made/sold to non-Koreans as swords were apparently illegal in Korea. ??? During the hard sell in their office they started showing me their list of recent customers. The list was a copy of customer passports. Near the top was a copy of Dr. Kimm's passport. You selected the model you wanted, paid the $$ and then they would make and send you the sword. When I returned home I called Dr. Kimm to see if he recommended their swords. I thought I might write back to purchase one if he recommended them. His reply was "no I cannot recommend them, at this time". I didn't ask for more info. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 06:30:27 -0700 (PDT) From: J T To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Swords and Turtle Press videos Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net First of all I want to thank everyone for their references to the sword dealers. I am doing research on the to find something that will fit my needs as well as my budget. I am not looking to collect them, I should have made more clear in my original email. I am looking for cutting swords to practice with. As much as I would like to use a Korean sword dealer, they are scarce in the states. I tried having my in-laws in Korea purchase one, but they can not do it without some sort of liscence through a sword school. So I will keep on searching. I told my wife to have them give us the dealer's name and we would contact them. As for videos, I am purchasing the Haedong Kumdo, Advance Knife Fighting, Jang Bong Patterns, and Martial Arts Instructor's Desk Reference. I want the Haedong Kumdo to see the difference in what they do as opposed to what we do at our school. Plus they do more cutting and that is more interesting to me than the sparring that we do. I will let you know about the Hanho video. Over all I just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their advice. Jeremy (the evil one not the good one on the list) ;) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo http://search.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 08:52:10 -0500 From: "Burdick, Dakin R" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Koreans and swords Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce wrote: "On the other hand I was a little sad that we aren't doing more to encourage folks to buy Korean in the sense that there are probably a few sources of quality blades in that country if we just do our research. Without encouraging folks to purchase from Korea I believe we run the risk of allowing such industry to disappear." Well, as I said, the Korean place that was suggested was simply acting as a middleman for a Japanese sword outlet. I assume that isn't the kind of industry you are interested in perpetuating. If anyone can suggest a Korean manufacturer, we should take a look, but frankly, I have yet to see a decent Korean sword except in a museum. The swords that I have seen, and that I deem as "traditional Korean" are the double-edged straight sword common in Taijiquan (before 1600) and the Japanese single-edged katana (after 1600). The "big butter knife" seen in some Kuksul schools is touted as being a "traditional" Korean blade, but I've never seen a picture of it in a Korean museum or in the Freer Gallery. To me it looks like an executioner's sword (one side, rounded end) used only for chopping off heads that were being held quite still. I understand that Koreans hate Japanese, and vice versa, but I don't think we have to do the same to do "traditional" Korean arts. For one thing, many of the early swordmakers in Japan were actually Koreans, who were generally assigned the grunt work the Japanese didn't want to do. Secondly, the Muye Tobo Tongji (that classic of the Korean martial arts) is filled with Chinese weapon and tactics, but lists the "Japanese sword" as being the best. All of this inspired me to do a web search about the whole rigamarole. Here's what I came up with: At http://www.concentric.net/~sdseong/kmar.vid.sw.htm, Robert Young (1995) writes: "Korean sword makers developed quite advanced manufacturing techniques which helped spread the reputation of Korean blades throughout the region. It is widely believed that Japanese sword-making skills originated from imported Korean methods. Japanese craftsmen proceeded to happily perfect the skills, while in Korea the rise of Neo-Confucianism led to official disdain for the arts of war there. Consequently, the militaristic society of feudal Japan encouraged weapons-making, while the scholastic society of Korea despised it. Korean sword-making technology was left to stagnate." We can see a picture of In-Hyuk Suh with a straight single-edged blade at: http://www.kuksoolwon-eastbourne.co.uk/images/ksn-with-sword-1.jpg The Ssaurabi Academy of Swordsmanship (Korea Swordsmanship Federation, Inc.) has some great examples of Koreans doing Japanese sword techniques: http://sword.co.kr/ssaurabi/02.php The World Kumdo Association webpage has some great shots of more Koreans doing Japanese sword techniques at: http://www.wka.org/master%20Jun.html For the names of the parts of a katana in Japanese and Korean, see: --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Chosondo@aol.com Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:07:17 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Chicago, DownersGrove Semiar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I would like to remaind everyone on the list that I will be conducting a seminar in Downers Grove, Ill. Info follows: Where: American Martial Arts Acdemy 5225 South Main Street Downers Grove, IL 60515 630--852-4422 Contacts: Masters Randy Stigall & Glenn Gavin Curriculum: Basic Principles & Practice of Oriental Medicine within the context of Martial Arts and Principles & skills of Choson Kwon Bup from a bio-mechanical perspective. I am looking foward to meeting some the list members who live in the Chicago area. You you then. ____________________________________ Ian A. Cyrus, Headmaster International Chosondo Federation Choson Kwon Bup - Hapkido - Taekwondo 7252 Valley Avenue Phila., PA 19128 215-483-5057 --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 07:22:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] USTU Office Email Change (fwd) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net As of May 1st the USTU Staff email addresses will be the following: President Sang Lee - ustutkd2@aol.com or president@ustu.org Mr. Bruce Harris, Executive Director & National Events Director - ustued@mailsnare.net Ms. Jeanna Mendoza, Administrative Director - ustugold@mailsnare.net Ms. Lisa Pseniska, Finance Director ustufinance@mailsnare.net Ms. Jennifer Combs, Manager of Sports Programs usturef@mailsnare.net Ms. Dedra McClay, Dan Office Sr. Manager ustudan@mailsnare.net Ms. Maureen Jensen, Membership Service Manager ustumember@mailsnare.net Ms. Lynda Henry, National Events Manager ustuevents@mailsnare.net The USTU Staff (only) American Online email addresses will no longer be valid after May 1, 2003 Sincerely, Jeanna Mendoza Administrative Director, US Taekwondo Union --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 09:34:45 -0500 From: "Burdick, Dakin R" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] koreans sword II Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sorry! Microsoft Outlook occasionally sends stuff without me telling it to. To continue... You can find Japanese & Korean names for sword parts at: http://www.martialartistquarterly.com/MAQ-2002-Fall/article.php?Article= 1 You can see another photo of the Kuksul straight single-edged sword at: http://www.kuksoolwon-eastbourne.co.uk/images/ksn-new-sword.jpg To me, this one just doesn't make sense. A single-edged blade is for cutting, and cutting is made easier by a curved blade. Like the one used here: http://www.kuksoolwon.com/images/B &WPhotos/b&w005.jpg A picture of the royal guards atDeoksugung Palace can be seen at: http://worldcup.metro.seoul.kr/en/event/traditional/traditional_03.htm These guys used a Hwando (a 90cm-long sword), but I couldn't get a good look at it. Anybody have a better picture? The sippalgi folks use a straight blade like a machete with a square end. See this at photo 9 at: http://www-2.knu.ac.kr/~sibpalgi/pic/98bal/a.html Isn't that a [Chinese] gongfu weapon? But look, even the famous Scott Shaw uses a katana! See this at: http://www.scottshaw.com/kumdo/ That's GOT to prove it, right? :) How about the Korean love for breakdancing? This can be seen at: http://wk.koreaherald.co.kr/SITE/data/html_dir/2003/04/10/200304100003.a sp By the way, you can find yet another example of why Koreans hate Japanese at: http://www.jca.apc.org/JWRC/exhibit/Korea59.htm Be forewarned, it contains graphic photos of Koreans killed in Japan after the Kanto earthquake. Take care, Dakin dakinburdick@yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: "Dojang Digest" Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:32:37 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Brisbane Australia Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello all DDers, I have a student traveling to Brisbane Australia this June and was hoping to find him a Hapkido School to train in while he is there. Thank you for your assistance. Kat --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:18:01 -0400 From: Rudy Timmerman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Amsterdam Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray writes: > Yep, a great time! Of the seven things important to enjoying life, I > found > six there. History, art, architecture, sex, drugs and rock-n-roll. > :) > But no martial arts... > > Ray Terry Hello Ray: With all of the above to "look at", no wonder you did not find a martial art school -- no time:) Sincerely, Rudy --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "Ali Al-Nasser" To: Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 02:10:44 +0900 (KST) Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Amsterdam, 7 things Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray, You should have contacted Klaas Barends who is a list member. His master, Master Ko is in the Netherlands for a few months giving seminars. [TABLE NOT SHOWN][TABLE NOT SHOWN][IMAGE] --__--__-- Message: 13 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] RE: Amsterdam, 7 things To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 11:19:14 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Ray, > > You should have contacted Klaas Barends who is a list member. His master, > Master Ko is in the Netherlands for a few months giving seminars. Yep, we tried, but it didn't work out... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 11:41:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Ken McDonough To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Future Home Gym Additions Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thanks for the comments on the home gym...need a few more ideas from you ladies and gents. Was thinking about one of those long Muay Thai bags that almost touch the ground. Also one of those long poles to the wall that the ballet dancers use to stretch. As luck would have it the pharmacist in this clinic where I work has a brother that is a well known architect. I met with him recently. Now this guy has built multi-million dollar buildings, churches, and so forth. Anyway, he came up with some plans for the gym that will blend in with the house. We will include a shower and toilet. Of course the fridge is a must stocked with the various elixirs mentioned by Mr. Whalen. Above the gym will be the staircase to the storage area. Past the workout area will be the workshop for the 67 Chevelle SS and 57 Chevy. I will be taking donations for this endeavor. Now kids--do what Soupy Sales recommended to all the boys and girls years ago on his TV show. Here goes. When your mom and dad is asleep I want you to go into their pants pocket and pull out that wallet. Next, take out those green pieces of paper with various pictures of various Presidents, some of whom I don't recall. Place those green pieces of paper in an envelope with a stamp and send to me, Big Ken at: Big Ken's Gym Projectc/o Big Ken's ranchTulsa, OK. 74133 Note: These donations are tax deductible. Thanks for the kind gifts. Keep 'em coming. Big Ken --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719.866.4632 FAX 719.866.4642 ustutkd1@mailsnare.net www.ustu.org Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest