Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 08:39:02 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #260 - 15 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1400 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. A Question (SEXTONR003@hawaii.rr.com) 2. USKA (Dennis McHenry) 3. Old time protection (Rudy Timmerman) 4. Re: opening my own school (thanks) (Aloaf@aol.com) 5. Re: Bruce and Rain on sparring...... (George Peters) 6. HDGDF website (A. Boyd) 7. white space (Lucy Westcott) 8. Beer mug smash (rich hodder) 9. RE: Irish teaching Americans Korean Martial Art (Michael Rowe) 10. Bruises (Charles Richards) 11. Hogu stuff (Ray Terry) 12. Good old days (Burdick, Dakin R) 13. Ouray, Colorado (Braeswood Martial Arts) 14. Ko Dan Ja Dee (Charles Richards) 15. RE: white space (Wallace, John) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: To: Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 16:57:06 -1000 Subject: [The_Dojang] A Question Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <> When my parents first spanked me! Randall Sexton www.LaughingHara.com --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 03:25:14 GMT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Dennis McHenry Subject: [The_Dojang] USKA Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Charlie <> Back in about '81 when I was your age I was a member of the USKA, when Master Maria Doest was the state rep. I did some training in Shorie Ryu with her. Although I didn't attend their tournaments, Master Doest was Nationally rated (back in the late '70s) #1 woman in forms, fighting and weapons by Karate Illistrated. That was where I first learned bo, kama and sai. The hand gear was more of a thin foam tube with a loop on the end to hold on with your fingers, and an opening on the side. Many times you hand just seemed to slip through that opening when punching.... :-) Yea, brings back fond memories... Mac ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 23:28:39 -0400 From: Rudy Timmerman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Old time protection Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray writes: > In full-contact continuous Taekwondo tournys the only protection worn > back > then was a hogu, a cup (for the men) and maybe a mouthpiece. Some > wimps > (like me) wore those elastic shin and instep pads. No gloves. Ray my friend, now you make some of us feel real old with the "only protection worn back then was a hogu":) As I recall the old days, there was nothing to wear; however, I do remember a number of competitors taping folded cardboard to their shins, but that was it. I also remember when GM Rhee introduced the first prototype glove at the North American TKD championships. It was a round foam tube with a flat end on it, and it had two holes in the business end for a piece of shoe lace to grab onto. The shoe lace was there to keep the thing from falling off your hand, and no one cared that it would rip your face. No one worried about a little thing like getting your face ripped back then; indeed, we had hoped that the glove would keep us from being disqualified for drawing blood. When it was found to cut your opponent, most guys would not wear it anymore (and that was not because anyone cared about the other guy a whole lot). Yet, with all of the blood and guts, most competitors would develop good friendships with opponents. I still communicate with a number of old competitors. Sincerely, Rudy --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Aloaf@aol.com Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 01:05:04 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: opening my own school (thanks) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thanks to al who replied to my post. I really appriciate it, I never even knew there were Irish Martial arts... WOW! This gives me some really great idea's :) Master Muldinado thank you too, I will most definately take you up on your offer and contact you with my periodic questions, that's for your well thought response to my question. Thanks again Dan O'Boyle Blue Belt TKD --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "George Peters" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 02:10:47 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Bruce and Rain on sparring...... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Good Sir and Maam: Please forgive me for addressing both of you at the same time, however my thoughts on the matters you posted blend together. Martial artists come in all shapes and sizes. As we progress through learning our respective arts, we discover that certain techniques work better for us due to body type, age, physical limitations etc. When sparring with a smaller person, since I am fairly large and powerful, I have been instructed to work on technique not use physical strength as the technique is at the heart of the art and as we age, in the end technique will be all we have. ( although we all realize in the end that true power, not physical strength comes from technique) Anyway perhaps you might consider how frustrating it is also to lots of guys when they have to spar with a small, very quick ( and usually ultra-flexible woman). Should people condition themselves to withstand a blow? I would answer "certainly". Should people want to always get blasted? My son has been a Dan for several years, has excellent technique and can bench almost 400 lbs. These types of people have had a great impact (pun intended) on my thoughts in these areas and now-a-days I would say perhaps only when training for full contact matches. The federation I belong to only sanctions "light" contact. There are most certainly safer ways to train the body to withstand punishment, anyone who needs this need only speak to their KyoSaNim or SaBumNim. In reference to smaller people whipping on larger ones, even though I have been instructed to "take it easy" on smaller partners, for some reason it is only the rare person who will refrain from using full power or even control whether it is Deh Ryun or HoSinSul . After a while I will ask the other person to calm down. If they don't, then perhaps a firepower demonstration is in order. If I feel said person can't withstand a demonstration of this sort, it is time to talk with them after class or speak with SaBumNim. My tolerance of these things has not grown since I "took it easy" on a partner and got almost 3 years of pain, rehab, and twice a week to the doctor resulting in a signifigant bill. My training was not 100% until very recently. Anymore I'm inclined to only ask once for someone to "cool it" before I give back what I'm getting. Does Bruce or anyone else have any thoughts on this? I worry as compassion is a tenet of the arts. I hope my thoughts and observations have been of some service. Tang Soo! Respectfully, George Peters _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 02:41:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "A. Boyd" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] HDGDF website Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce, The old version of the website (Korean only) had a forum. All Korean websites regardless of topic, function, or purpose, have forums these days. I am not sure what form the English site is ultimately going to take. I was given an opportunity to edit the content for the site but have not heard any of their plans for it. From what I read, it stands to reason that the site will not be solely for the dissemination of information. Their dream is to bring all practitioners together on a level playing field. I for one will be happy to continue trying help do just that. The Korean website is up and running again (www.hdgd.org) but the English link wasn't active the last time I checked. I just handed in the edited revisions on Monday so I expect it will be a week or two before anything pops up. ===== Anthony Boyd: Swordsman and English Teacher www.stormpages.com/haidonggumdo ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Lucy Westcott" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 17:42:56 +1000 Subject: [The_Dojang] white space Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I noticed that one of my posts yesterday was good, and the other wasn't, and I don't remember there being any difference in the way I wrote them. I am posting from Australia, south-east Queensland, but what would that have to do with anything? Lucy ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Hotmail now available on Australian mobile phones. Click here for more. --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "rich hodder" To: "Dojang Digest" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 07:40:18 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Beer mug smash Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Randall, any good Irishman would certainly know the beer mug smash, however, given that there are non-Irish folk on the list I think that a clarification needs to be made regarding that particular technique. An Irishman never abuses alcohol so in the beer mug smash, one must be sure to drain the contents of the mug prior to smashing it on the head of their friend 8^) just a bit of Irish wisdom, now where is that bottle of Bushmills?? Rich Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "Michael Rowe" To: Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 08:00:43 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Irish teaching Americans Korean Martial Art Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Being as I am part of a proud Irish Heritage I find that Hapkido has wonderful techniques that enable me to defend myself without ever spilling a drop from my pint of Murphy's :) Michael Rowe --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 06:43:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Charles Richards To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Bruises Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <> Mac you crack me up... Well my girls kick like mules and are very proud of it. FWIW everyone in my school knows what happens if you lower your gaurds during sparring ;-) The only thing I have to worry about for bruises in my school is full power roundhouse kicks. For some reason when a student finally thinks they are going to "gets one in on SaBumNim" there shin/instep runs into my shin and not my one big ab. It doesn't seem to bother me, but the first time they do it they seem to get a beautifull bruise on the shin ;-) Ray, When I point sparr in my dojang I don't wear a headgear. We have the opinion that if a blackbelt gets hit in the head they deserved it. I've found it keeps me honest and seems to have developed my high level parries and evasion skills. A few of my faster students have been able to "slip one in," but then that just raises the bar, ne? Hope everyone is training hard and look forward to seeing many of you at AAU nationals in Knoxville. Yours in Jung Do, Charles Richards www.mojakwan.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). http://calendar.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 11 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 06:55:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] Hogu stuff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net On the topic of protection, a bit of hogu trivia... I believe the use of the hogu (in Korea) began in the 1950s. By the early 1960s it was required to wear one during the sparring portion of national (Korea) level promotion tests for TKD. I've seen some of the very early ones and regularly used the models made in Korea in the mid to late 1960s. They were very hard, stiff and heavy. Worse than wearing 2 (or 3?) Level IIIA Kevlar vests (soft body armor). Not easy to move in, but they did protect your ribs a bit from a good kick to the ribs or solar plexus. To get used to them you would wear one the entire class as well, of course, as the extra sparring sessions that followed class. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:16:20 -0500 From: "Burdick, Dakin R" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Good old days Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray wrote: Headgear?!? We don't need no stinkin headgear. If you got kicked in the head, that was your fault. Motivation to train harder the next time, if you survived to fight again... Me: Actually, we don't need headgear. All headgear does is give you a feeling of safety that is unwarranted, and keep your skull from breaking when it hits the concrete floors most of the tournaments are held on. It does not prevent brain damage, or knockouts, or ring deaths. Control is a better answer. Who has the current count of ring deaths in full-contact tkd? My last count was three. Can you tell I prefer point fighting? As for bad safety gear, my personal favorite was the old Safe-T-Punch from Jhoon Rhee in the 1970s. It was a cylinder of foam rubber, that you just pushed over your fist. Pretty bad, but all that was around at the time, and the first foam rubber gear anybody had! Jye wrote: when did you first fall in love with the martial arts? Me: I got beaten up daily in junior high. My most vivid memory of a beating was when I was in 8th grade and three 11th graders had me cornered in the back of the bus, heel kicking me with cowboy boots. Still don't like cowboy boots. When I got to college, I wanted to learn martial arts because of (of course) Bruce Lee and the desire to be able to defend myself. As a friend of mine on rec.martial-arts said long ago, "...but of course I still get beaten up everyday in the dojo!" Yours in the arts, Dakin Burdick dakinburdick@yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: "Dojang Digest" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 10:12:20 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Ouray, Colorado Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello to all, I have a student vacationing the first two weeks of July in Ouray CO. Are there any dojangs in this area that would welcome them to train while on vacation? Thank you, Kat Kelly Chief Instructor Braeswood Martial Arts (713) 283-6000 fax: (713) 283-8400 www.braeswoodmartialart.com --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 08:31:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Charles Richards To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Ko Dan Ja Dee Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Master Lee, Good to see your views on the DD. We have had many email threads that always get me to thinking and evaluating why I do things the way I do. I must confess I struggled with the Tang Soo Do Ko Dan Ja Dee the entire year before my 4th Dan exam. I considered the midnight with red, the black with red, the plain black belt and my current wide belt. I have to admit my decision is based on logistics unique to me and my school, and my school's philosophy. We don't wear patches (monsuki). The only thing we might put on a patch would be yin/yang aka balance. So we wear Black (um) pants and White tops(yang) and the circle (change) is represented by the belt. What I do is traditional in that it tends to follow Lee, Won Kyuk's Tang Soo Do a little more than Hwang Kee's. It's not likely that I will wear the midnight belt although I like what it represents (always possible to improve/get a little darker). And I understand the Weh Kong, Neh Yu principle in the Midnight and red belt. I can't find any logical reason for the complete jacket trim other than Hwang Kee liked it, but some time around the 1950's it became in vogue for MDK practitioners. Research prior to the 1950's I don't see any trimmed tops and I dont see any red stripe belts for Masters. I do however see your point since the 1950's Jacket trim has become a clear sign of Blackbelt rank and the central red stripe has clearly distinguished ko dan ja from u dan ja. So my question for you and Master Dunn and others on the list. Is it more confusing for other gups and other TSD blackbelts to have a 4th Dan without the distinguishing belt? In your opinion, does the failure to wear the central red stripe make my belt "less traditional" and if so can you explain your basis for that determination? Always looking forward to learning more about our wonderful art Tang Soo Do, Charles Richards www.mojakwan.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). http://calendar.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 15 From: "Wallace, John" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] white space Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:24:08 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi Lucy Posting from Australia doesn't have anything to do with your on-again, off-again white space issue; I just lived there from 1974 'til 1980, near Sydney (Ingleside). Are you near Port Macquarie? I have family friends there, and remember my holiday trips to their house with fondness. -JW -----Original Message----- From: Lucy Westcott [mailto:booksie_girl@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 12:43 AM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] white space I noticed that one of my posts yesterday was good, and the other wasn't, and I don't remember there being any difference in the way I wrote them. I am posting from Australia, south-east Queensland, but what would that have to do with anything? Lucy ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Hotmail now available on Australian mobile phones. Click here for more. _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1400 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719.866.4632 FAX 719.866.4642 ustugold@mailsnare.net www.ustu.org Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest