Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2003 03:01:48 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #291 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1400 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Independance Day (chuck@rimshapkido.org) 2. names on belt (gaby noufaily) 3. BMS 2003 and Have started learning Gicheon Mun (A. Boyd) 4. tkd teacher in london wanted (goof@444.net) 5. Re: Kukkiwon cert (Dan Monjar) 6. Re: Belt Factory (Paul Davis) 7. Re: Herding the Ox (ABurrese@aol.com) 8. Re: Dan Testing R Terry (Manuel Maldonado) 9. Test Failures (FirstPe315@aol.com) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: chuck@rimshapkido.org To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 01:26:24 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Independance Day Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >From Myself and all Student of Rim's Hapkido, both on and off the list,. we wish everyone a Happy Independance Day. Chuck Callahan --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "gaby noufaily" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 08:47:51 +0300 Subject: [The_Dojang] names on belt Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net  Every instructor tells us what he sees that it is right, but we as a student we are confused.I have a question regarding the belt. If it was written on it from one side the name of the student and on the other side the art that he is studying I would like to know on which side the name should be  and the name of the art should be.I am asking this question because my master told me that the name should be when you tie your belt on the left and the art name on the right, last week korean master told us that it is the opposite so I would like to know who is right.Thanks in advance. gaby ------------------------------------------------------------------------ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 02:35:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "A. Boyd" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] BMS 2003 and Have started learning Gicheon Mun Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Recently there was a wonderful exhibition at the CoEx in Samseong-Dong, Seoul. It was called the World Culture Open - Body, Mind, Spirit. An impressive array of martial and meditative arts were assembled for 4 days to promote and demonstrate their arts. Most of the demos were predictable, except for the ones put on by the Hanguk Taekkyon Federation. These guys finally found a way to present the material in a new format which could educate rather than just dazzle or entertain. Essentially, they had a single practitioner model techniques on one corner of the stage while a pair would demonstrate the sparring version of the technique against a partner and then the street version of the technique against a partner. The sequences built one upon the other with technique meeting counter-technique until a very long, demanding battle royale was taking place before us. Due to the design of the performance, even the uninformed spectators were able to follow each stage. While I was there I met a gent who studies Gicheon Mun near where I live and work in Seoul. I have been wanting to study this art for some time due to its connections to my primary art, Haidong Gumdo, and to rebuild myself from the ground up. So far, after my first week of classes I am not disappointed. The training is conducted safely, without the dangerous crap so commonly found in most warm-ups here. The curriculum is well-structured and each element of the art is rich in both technique and symbolism. The training is harder than anything I have been subjected to before and very, very extreme. It's not the kind of extreme that you imagine when you hear about doing marathon kicking sessions or something like that in a TKD class. It's the other kind of extreme where you open various joints to maximum extension, flexing all of your muscles to provide outward or inward force in very specific directions and hold it... for what seems like years. Just as you swear that you are going to collapse, sweat blinding you, drops spattering everywhere at your feet, doing your best to keep a smile plastered on your face (it's required), the instructor will whisper to you, "Just a few more minutes..." When you leave, you are drained, but the next day? No pain. No fatigue. Interesting. Last night when I left one of my more experienced classmates mentioned that in about two weeks I would probably get sick and be terribly sore all the time. "When you recover," he said, "You will begin to grow in strength." We'll see if that's true. I will keep you posted. For a mental image of Gicheon, think of Bagua Zhang and a little Preying Mantis. Weblinks include www.kichun.co.kr, and www.myhome.naver.com/gichun2 ===== Anthony Boyd: Swordsman and English Teacher www.stormpages.com/haidonggumdo ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 13:05:47 +0200 (CEST) From: To: Subject: [The_Dojang] tkd teacher in london wanted Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net hello i am new to this list. can anyone in this list recommend a taekwondo teacher in london, uk? i am 4th kup, 26 years old. thank you -------------------------------------------- Free Webmail courtesy of http://www.444.net/ --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 08:09:40 -0400 From: Dan Monjar To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Kukkiwon cert Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net --On Friday, July 04, 2003 03:01:48 AM -0700 the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net wrote: > Things may have changed since the death of Gen. Choi, but in the past > there was no way the ITF would permit you to also be involved with > the Kukkiwon. If you even taught the Kukki-TKD forms in an ITF school > you'd be kicked out of the org. > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com First of all, Happy 4th of July! Is the Kukkiwon stuff a big deal? I know that some people seem to live for it and treat it as almost a religious thing... but for more rational people, is it worth the extra money for someone to get the piece of paper? -- Daniel Monjar --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 08:58:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul Davis To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Cc: "Johnson, Don" Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Belt Factory Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Belt Factories Just to provide a little background our family was initially introduced to Taekwondo, as a means of providing a summer camp for our youngest daughter to attend at the age 10. Afternoons were pretty much dedicated to going and watching Morgan and her newly found friends work in concert, on their way to the next belt level. It was cute to go and watch her work on her basic blocks, kicks and learn the first form. Not until you watch a class of thirty children work as a team and act with almost precise timing as the instructor calls out instructions, do your realize the importance of Martial Arts. Here were children of all shapes and sizes with different backgrounds working together as a team. As the rest of our family (wife, son, myself) watched, the school owner always in a kind way asked and even prodded us to give it a try for a week to see if would be something we would be interested in. Our common response was maybe later when we have more time. In August of 2001 my daughter and her group were ready for their first belt testing, it was held at a beautiful Asian garden in Kissimmee, Florida. It was a wonderful experience to see children perform the basics and watch the instructors break boards and do more advanced forms for the friends and families attending. My son and I watched as the moment of truth for Morgan arrived, the final test before promotion, break the board with a step behind sidekick. She went through that board and you could actually see her confidence level grow as she bowed and took a knee. After testing, we as a family went to lunch and it was then that my son, (14) expressed interest in taking Taekwondo. Apparently, while watching the higher belts perform he saw that there was more to martial arts then what he had seen his sister do so far. When my wife and I discussed our son’s decision, she also wanted to take classes. I am sure you can see the pattern and yes, before long I also started taking classes. It had been about 25 months of family martial arts and it been wonderful, actually changed our lives forever. This is the point where the Belt Factory portion comes into play; sorry it took so long to get there. Through out the past 25 months many of the instructors have left to start their own schools and prosper in this industry. Many times we have been courted to leave our school for better rates and even closer locations to where we live, though not under contract we have always stayed with the Master who brought us to this point. Many students have stayed as well as many students have left, recently while shopping for dinner, our family met the father of one such student in the store. We both inquired how the families were doing and he wanted to know if we still worked out at the same school, in which I explained that we had just left class. At this point, his wife and daughter came by and standing in this public store was a 12 year old girl, in full uniform, Jr. Black Belt neatly tied around her waist. We were stunned, first because she was in full uniform, secondly, because we she left the school six months prior she was a brown belt. Her brown belt ranking was received about two weeks before her departure. At our school it would take 12 to 14 months to achieve this level from the brown belt. And at least another 6 months to receive a Black Belt (Poome or Dan) ranking. Her father explained that she will test for her Black Belt in September, this being July. So in as little as 9 months, this 12 year old will have went from a Jr. Brown Belt to Black Belt. My questions are simple; (1) does allowing a child with normal martial art skill’s access to continuous testing help this child? (2) Does the school Master have any responsibility once this child goes into the real world believing their skills will help them in a crisis situation? (3) Is our school the only one that strongly suggests that uniforms are only to be worn in the Dojang? I am proud to say that the wife and kids will test for Deputy Black Belts in August of 2003 and I will test for my Red Belt in September. We as a family will continue to practice Taekwondo at least until our son leaves for college next year. Then there will be three of us, eventually just my wife and I, but I have no doubt, all of us will always participate in the Martial Arts for life. Thanks to Master Ergle & Instructor Johnson. --__--__-- Message: 7 From: ABurrese@aol.com Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 10:35:37 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Herding the Ox Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have this book, since I always liked the pictures and lesson on the temple walls in Korea. (You will find these pictures in Japan and China too) This book would be way over the heads of 10-12 year olds. Yours in Training, Alain www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Manuel Maldonado" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 08:57:24 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Dan Testing R Terry Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Yes I know that, but I'm going on my own. The ITF has never issued me my Certificate eventhough I tested last year and I'm pretty much tired of waiting and I don't want any of my students to have to go through what I went through. Paying large sums of money never to see my certificate because "Master MacClollen stole the money" I feel that it's the ITF's responsabliity to see to it that everyone that is going to be promoted dose regardless if Master So and So stole the money or not. I don't care put him in jail or something I've patiently waited and personally don't care. My wife is mad since I had to take out a cash advance for this promotion, she said "what would you do if a parent of one of your students came to you looking for their Dan Jung""What would you tell them, how would you fix the situation" Well I got to thinking about it and have meet some real nice folks in the WTF that are willing to lend me a helping hand I would love to issue both certificates, but I've been waiting since May of 2002 and haven't got mine yet. And you know or have heard about how "prestigious"the Kukkiwon certificate is it's also a great way to promote Taekwon-Do. If It's not an ITF or Kukkiwon Dan It's not really a Dan. Manuel _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:46:42 -0400 From: FirstPe315@aol.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Test Failures Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net You might find this interesting my friend, but at the school I trained at for a long time, nobody ever failed a test. There was once a failed black-belt test and the experience was so miserable, the black-belts at the time I remember were questioning ourselves how and why the test even took place to begin with. We looked at it as our failure when he wasn't ready. Nonetheless, in what appears to be WAY too easy of an expectation, our tests were always hard, nerv-racking with exceptionally high expectations. Nobody ever took the success rate for granted, nobody ever talked about it, mentioned it, became egotistical about it or had expectations to test. The testing process was always an ardous experience, full of information and very interactive with the instructor and his black-belts. It worked just fine and produced many a warrior in that school in a highly traditional and respectful atmosphere. My question would be this. Why would somebody be asked to test when they were not ready. And if they consistently perform in class to be asked to test and then forget part of their form...they don't pass??? How ridiculous! Or they don't break their brick etc. I don't get it. Perhaps for those of you that have testing failures (except for attitudinal or procedural problems which are far more telling and significant in my opinion) can tell me for what those individuals failed for. Jeff In a message dated 7/4/2003 5:01:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > I am curious, do other schools have low failure rates at tests? In the 8 or 9 years I have been training, > I have seen very few people fail their belt tests (mostly > testing for black belt interesting enough).... --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719.866.4632 FAX 719.866.4642 ustugold@mailsnare.net www.ustu.org Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of The_Dojang Digest