Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 06:38:43 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #440 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1500 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Teaching =? Training (Gaye Terzioglu) 2. Thank you ... (Gaye Terzioglu) 3. Re: ITF-KATU (Manuel Maldonado) 4. Re: Re: ITF-KATU (Ray Terry) 5. RE: Re: ITF-KATU (Jason E. Thomas (Y!)) 6. (no subject) (karina bouxin) 7. Conversions (Ray Terry) 8. Kuk Sul Do (Mario Bertacco) 9. ITF-KATU now USA-ITF (t.metzner1) 10. Re: Kuk Sul Do (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 14:19:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Gaye Terzioglu To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Teaching =? Training Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net << Gaye, Just my .02 but I thought teaching is training. michael whalen KSWnut" >> Mr Whalen, Dear Sir The way I look at it is teaching is part learning which is part of training. But training component is so minimal really because training, I believe, is when I can focus on my own techniques and I do not prefer to cut back down on the time during which I do not feel responsible for anybody else's learning, exercising, practicing, motivation time as the instructor in front of themm, but rather focus on repetition of my very own, in every aspect my training. Perhaps I should have added to my remark that teaching is a very valuable time for me in terms of learning. It is very obvious I think that teaching is a form of learning besides sharing knowledge, wisdom (little of that I have!), frankly I do not feel right and comfortable using that time to train with the students, I teach, I demonstrate, I observe, encourage, it is the students' time to learn, train, practice and experience. The students pay to be at the receiving end of all we can give to them. So in short, I will have to say again that teaching has slowed down my actual training and cut down my own training time. However, it has helped immensely with my technique, because it has contributed to my learning. It is a bit of a trade off but it is not a fair trade off still since the body does need more training than currently. Imho, unless someone has many years of practice under their belt, most likely they cannot keep their technique sharp by just teaching. Rust will creep in, in some shape or form. Respectfully yours Sir. Gaye Terzioglu PS: I love the siggy, KSWnut *chuckle* Gaye Terzioglu "Most problems can be solved by making decisions" --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 14:52:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Gaye Terzioglu To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Thank you ... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ... for the warm welcome Dear Sir. It is awfully kind to greet a digest newbie on these virtual mats :) <> I do not know most people's proper rank so to stick to the due respect to each person I refer to them by a Mr/Mrs last name and Dear Sir / Ma'am, until I skim through and find out how they prefer to be adressed to. *giggle* Yes my last name is an impossible one, I am perfectly happy with being called Gaye, that's what most people do :) It's just the pronounciation of my name that is a bit tricky. It sounds like "guy-er or gai-ae" but not "gay" as in "happy" :D. To answer your question, our Sir believes in having laughs while sweat pours down our a.. uhm foreheads and you know body and stuff. So our training consists of a lot of sweat, occasional blood, many bruises, ends with sore muscles and a sense of accomplishment. But I should say one of the main ingredients is the humour. Hmm tapping out while having a laugh is hard, but pain is substantial and for the love of God, one must tap no matter what. Oh, that humour is not something Sir uses just in his seminars, we get that - YAY - on a daily bases. And NO, we are not letting him go any more than he has to, twice a year!!!! Did you meet him first time this year? Or have you participated in his seminars before? I have not personally gone overseas and participated in any other seminars. However, we are fortunate that Sir invites and brings out on a regular basis wonderful people out here. I have had the opportunity to meet and learn from Do Ju Nim Ji (before anyone out there questions how to refer to him, this is how he wanted us to call him when he was here both times *smile*), Dr Kimm, GM Timmerman (what a wonderful seminar it was, just recently like a few weeks ago we were fortunate to do a few days of seminars with him and Sabumnim Lorne), and J.R West and the hapkido lady I miss dearly, Mrs Master West. Just a word of caution about me, I hope not to offend anyone by not having been trained in the ways of political correctness (for example, I do not get involved in the arguments about whether calling someone Master, right or wrong, well I do it anyways). And English not being my native language adds to that aspect and sometimes my questions or comments might sound a bit, well, politically incorrect. Please know I have not been raised in a political martial arts environment *big thanks to Master Booth for that* so I shall stay that way forever and ever. Wow, hmm, by the way, Master Booth thinks I talk too much and hardly any words of wisdom come out either. This is so true!!!!! *bows out* Respectfully yours, Gaye Terzioglu Gaye Terzioglu "Most problems can be solved by making decisions" --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Manuel Maldonado" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 15:07:16 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: ITF-KATU Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net So what are you saying? I should join Master Choi's organization? What about the money I've sent to GM Hwang? Do I get a lawyer, sue him, what? I'm sick and tired of this BS and quite frankly would like to just be rid of this whole situation. I'd like to be able to take my KATU Dan Certificate and transfere it over to WTF although I've heard from several of the friends on this digest that yes it can be done and no it can't be done. I'd just like to try and find out if it can be done, man, I feel like all this bla,bla,bla will make somebody dizzy. GM Lim is helping me out. Lets see where that will take me. I just hope that some day I can sit back and laugh at all this and not have to worry about all this. I feel that some day the ITF will no longer exist as we know it. I've spoken to lots of ITF high ranking Dans and they claim that the WTF just switched them over I hope and pray that I too can do the same. P.S. I do in fact have a 2nd Dan WTF that I earned while stationed in Korea with the US ARMY. Manuel Maldonado ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Get McAfee virus scanning and cleaning of incoming attachments. Get Hotmail Extra Storage! --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: ITF-KATU To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 15:56:10 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > of this whole situation. I'd like to be able to take my KATU Dan > Certificate and transfere it over to WTF although I've heard from several > of the friends on this digest that yes it can be done and no it can't be > done. I'd just like to try and find out if it can be done, man, I feel > like all this bla,bla,bla will make somebody dizzy. Either go direct to the Kukkiwon or via the USTU. If the USTU check with our state's president. See attached. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com ========================================================================= California State Taekwondo Association 26012 Marguerite Parkway #A Mission Viejo, CA 92692 949.348.2977 FAX: 949.348.2837 Master Byung Won Kang, President Re: CSTA Annual Meeting To all USTU Registered Club Members, You are officially notified that the CSTO Annual Meeting for year 2003 will be held on: Sunday, November 8, 2003 5:30PM The Dragon Restaurant (Korea Town) 966 S. Vermont Ave Los Angeles, CA 90006 213.387.8833 Dinner will be served for all USTU Registered TKD Club Owners. --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Jason E. Thomas \(Y!\)" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Re: ITF-KATU Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 18:01:11 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Does the USTU/WTF have a conversion program where they recognize the rank of Chang-Hon practitioners? Regards, Jason > -----Original Message----- > From: Ray Terry [mailto:rterry@idiom.com] > Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2003 5:56 PM > To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: ITF-KATU > > > of this whole situation. I'd like to be able to take my KATU Dan > > Certificate and transfere it over to WTF although I've heard from > several > > of the friends on this digest that yes it can be done and no it can't be > > done. I'd just like to try and find out if it can be done, man, I feel > > like all this bla,bla,bla will make somebody dizzy. > > Either go direct to the Kukkiwon or via the USTU. If the USTU check with > our state's president. See attached. > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com > ======================================================================== = > > California State Taekwondo Association > 26012 Marguerite Parkway #A > Mission Viejo, CA 92692 > 949.348.2977 > FAX: 949.348.2837 > > Master Byung Won Kang, President > > > Re: CSTA Annual Meeting > > > To all USTU Registered Club Members, > > You are officially notified that the CSTO Annual Meeting for year 2003 > will be held on: > > Sunday, November 8, 2003 > 5:30PM > The Dragon Restaurant > (Korea Town) > 966 S. Vermont Ave > Los Angeles, CA 90006 > 213.387.8833 > > Dinner will be served for all USTU Registered TKD Club Owners. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "karina bouxin" Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 20:38:20 -0400 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello to all. First I want to congratulate Terry for having such a great place to exchange ideas. Thanks! My subject, as stated, is testing for my 2nd dan which my master has asked me to. From reading previous newsletters and prior experience, this should be considered an honor. And in a way for me, it is but at the same time I'm very hesitant, thinking I'm not ready for this. Let me explain more in detail. I'm a 38 year-old female which had to take a leave of absence a year after getting my 1st dan because I needed arthroscopy done on one of my knees and just about when I was ready to return I had to go for the same procedure for my other knee (due to arthritis). I returned a year and a half later. I know that after the procedure there are things I can't do anymore or as well as before. I worked hard to get to were I am at the moment but still I don't think I'm ready for the test. It's been a almost a year since my return to TKD activity but like I said before, I'm very hesitant. Is it normal to feeling that way, hesitant, for us sort of middle age people? Do you think the procedure has something to do with the way I feel? Any opinions/comments will be welcome. Care2 make the world greener! Help the planet each day! It's free and easy: http://www.Care2.com/dailyaction/ --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 16:42:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] Conversions Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Does the USTU/WTF have a conversion program where they recognize the > rank of Chang-Hon practitioners? A conversion program? Not to my knowledge. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Mario Bertacco" To: Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 20:27:13 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Kuk Sul Do Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net What is the story on these 2 guys, they both claim to be Grandmasters of Kuk Sul Do http://www.kuksuldo.com/ http://yangskuksuldo.com/ Any Kuk Sool Won students on this list have any personal experience with these teachers? regards Mario --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "t.metzner1" To: Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 08:17:12 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF-KATU now USA-ITF Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dr.Steffen, You are right to point out some of the difficulties obtaining rank certficiates from ITF in Vienna. This has been a long standing problem. I have found it takes months, sometimes more. But this should not be a reflection of Grandmaster Hwang. On the contrary, he has been an advocate for the two individuals you mention. I have met both Mr. Karstadt and Mr. Roena. I was a coach with both of them on a couple of American Junior Teams in 1995 and 1998. I like Mr. Karstadt and found his son John to be one of the best fighters in the country. I also respect Mr. Roena for his martial arts ability. He is dedicated and one of the fittest people I have ever met. But both turned to GM Hwang after having troubles with GM Serref. GM Hwang convinced General Choi to allow both men to come into KATU under him when GM Serref wanted them both kicked out of the ITF. Unfortunately GM Hwang was unable to secure the certificates for them, there were too many obstacles. But he granted them both 6th Dan rank through KATU. When ever they were present, they were introduced as 6th Degree Black Belts and as the highest ranked students under GM Hwang, even putting them ahead of Mr. Oulundsen, 5th Dan but his own student for 25 years! They were seated at places of honor next to GM Hwang and he never said a dispararging word about either. I understand why you want that certificate, I would too if I paid the money. But don't blame GM Hwang. He went to bat for people, even those in disfavor with other GMs. He will sort out the problems with the ITF. Meanwhile, his organization (USA-ITF) retains its strong core. And I guarentee, his door will remain open to you and any others who wish to return. By the way, I have all my ITF certificates. Tom Metzner 4th Dan --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Kuk Sul Do To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 07:07:32 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > What is the story on these 2 guys, they both claim to be Grandmasters of Kuk > Sul Do > > http://www.kuksuldo.com/ > > http://yangskuksuldo.com/ > > Any Kuk Sool Won students on this list have any personal experience with these > teachers? I'm not KSW, but Gm Yang is a long time player. This other fellow looks to be fairly young. Yang's Kuk Sul Do dojang is about three miles from me. Not a huge school, but he seems to know his stuff. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest