Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2003 03:01:49 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #508 - 17 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1600 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Chayon ryu (William.Baldwin@ureach.com) 2. Broken legs (eleusis) 3. Re: Making trainers (Debra Dunn) 4. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Breaking_?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 5. "Eric Walker"[The_Dojang] Using Rubber knives...to Jye (Robert Demers) 6. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Knife_Fighting_Practice_?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 7. Re: Re:_Breaking_ (Jye nigma) 8. dan bong (Hapkido Self Defense Center) 9. Re: Broken legs (Jye nigma) 10. live blade training (tim walker) 11. Correctly converting Korean Words into English (Steve H. Kim) 12. Re: Broken legs (Ray Terry) 13. mechanical board holders (Ray Terry) 14. Rubbers (Ray Terry) 15. Re: Broken legs (Jye nigma) 16. Re: live blade training (Jye nigma) 17. Re: Broken legs (eleusis) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 20:46:06 -0500 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: William.Baldwin@ureach.com, MD-S Subject: [The_Dojang] Chayon ryu Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Someone posted in reference to Chayon ryu: Hey Bruce: >"....If it is Korean... why is it a Ryu?...." I also attended the CHAYON Ryu school in New Orleans. It was explained to me that the words were deliberately Korean, Chineese, (mongolian?) and Japaneese to reflect the influences upon the art. It was strictly KMA at kgup levels (i.e., ITF/WTF taekwondo with a minor in Hapkido..)and Kung-Fu influences somewhere above BB level. Master Moon was a bit of a universalist as he recognised my blue belt in tang soo do. He stated that ALL KMA's were KMA, "They're all the same thing". (I am about 20 -25 posts behind on DD. Excuse me if a better reply has already been posted.) --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "eleusis" To: Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 22:34:07 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Broken legs Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I am a student at Kaya Martial Arts in Chicago. I entered my first tournament and after winning the first matches (one with a nice kick to the head) I blocked a kick and broke the fibula bone. I have had the cast off for three weeks now, I am still having pain when I work out but it is lower than the break site. Has anyone experienced this type of injury and if so how long until my body will recover and I can resume working out to full capacity? Thanks, Rich in Chicago Green Belt Taekwondo --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Debra Dunn" To: Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 00:28:45 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Making trainers Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Daryl, That is an excellent idea. I usually make wooden training knives, but recently have been looking for something that can "record" successful attacks. Couldn't afford those expensive trainers. But I am going to try your method. Thank you sir. Danny Dunn > We use a knife pattern cut from a 1/2 inch thick piece of durable plastic (Mine actually are cut from an old plastic cutting board / butcher block). One the pattern is cut int he shape you want, glue a piece of felt along the "blade". > > When sparring, you can cover the felt in lipstick. Then, you can tell wou really got "CUT". > Adds some fun and reality to knife fighting. > > On a personal note, I prefer to carry my Charles Daly 1911 .45 to the knife fight. ha ha > > daryl As for dan bongs and choong bongs, making them is easy with hardwood dowling or round hardwood molding. You can usually find oak, and poplar. Maple and hickory are harder to find, but are excellent. Easy to find diameters 1", 1.25" and 1.5" to duit taste. cut to length and sand sharp corners round. Belt sander followed by hand sanding is excellent. Add finish of your choice, or none. easy to add the string with a portable drill. Total cost about 2-4 bucks, depending on length and an hours labor to make half a dozen, including first coat finish. Danny Dunn --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 06:38:43 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Breaking_?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Manual, Rudy, et al: "......Hello all. I myself don't break boards, haven't for some 14 years I prefere concrete. The ITF uses board holders. A metal devise that can hold up to 15 boards. Maybe you should consider buying or making yourselfs one......" Is there a point at which breaking is a matter of diminishing returns? For instance, does it make that much difference to break 4 boards readily, as opposed to knowing that one can break 6 boards using proper equiptment and sufficent preparation? Does it make a significant difference to break 6 boards as opposed to 2 inches of concrete block? Watching a breaking competition I have seen people break large numbers of clay tiles with elbow strikes and have wondered these same questions. Thoughts? Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Robert Demers" To: Subject: "Eric Walker"[The_Dojang] Using Rubber knives...to Jye Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 08:02:00 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Eric wrote: My instructor has been training and studying for longer than I've been alive (I'm 35). I agree with what he says, and I quote him, "If you won't do it with a real knife, don't teach it." Going to stop being a lurker for a min... I train with an 8th degree Grandmaster and we use rubber knives. The outcome of defending yourself against a weapon is going to depend upon your ki and technique. Since class is a training process there is always going to be learning by error and there is no good reason to be hurting your students. Like Alice says: Use your head Eric wrote: The other quote that comes to mind is, "In the real world you can't defend against a knife so if you can, RUN!" and "The only time you can defend against a knife is when you've resigned yourself to death and your attacker KNOWS he's gonna cut you on the next stab..." This sounds real offbase to me since the idea is to protect yourself against the knife. You need confidence in your art. Resigning yourself to death will not increase your skills and most likely fill your body with additional adrenaline and fog your head. Thoughts like that have no room in your head in a life/death situation. You need to consentrate on the task at hand. Now if your attacker has a gun....different story. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 06:49:38 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Knife_Fighting_Practice_?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Folks: I suppose that people CAN use live blades for practice, but why? For myself I would agree that it may help your focus and remind people of the seriousness of what they are actually holding as a goal. On the other hand I think it is unreasonable to ask for trouble. For instance, there are Hapkido techniques that I CAN teach a White Belt but to do so is to ask for an increased probability of injury much reduced in higher belt ranks. I have seen Black Belts use live blades in paired sword work, but then they were both 8th degree BB and had over 20 years experience each. There is also the matter of culture as well. For instance in the Phillipines, Malaysia and Indonesia young men are introduced to live blade work at much younger ages than what you might see here in the States but then they have the culture to support such practices--- and they still start out with sticks rather than live blades. FWIW. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 07:13:10 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re:_Breaking_ To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Honestly, I'm not really into 'hard' style breaking. I'm more impressed by 'soft' style breaking. To a certain extent hard breaking requires skill, but in a case where one is breaking let's saying concrete slabs with spacers, I'm thinking the break down is: physics, gravity, momentum, and a little skill. I say this because think about it...alot of the people you see doing these breaks haven't truly conditioned their hands (some schools don't even teach hand conditioning) yet their students are breaking boards, and such? something doesn't add up. Jye bsims@midwesthapkido.com wrote: Dear Manual, Rudy, et al: "......Hello all. I myself don't break boards, haven't for some 14 years I prefere concrete. The ITF uses board holders. A metal devise that can hold up to 15 boards. Maybe you should consider buying or making yourselfs one......" Is there a point at which breaking is a matter of diminishing returns? For instance, does it make that much difference to break 4 boards readily, as opposed to knowing that one can break 6 boards using proper equiptment and sufficent preparation? Does it make a significant difference to break 6 boards as opposed to 2 inches of concrete block? Watching a breaking competition I have seen people break large numbers of clay tiles with elbow strikes and have wondered these same questions. Thoughts? Best Wishes, Bruce _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Hapkido Self Defense Center" To: Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 10:21:33 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] dan bong Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "...The definition of a dan bong is 12inch by 1 inch in diameter but there is quite a bit of room for variance." I made several from wood dowels and several dozen from PVC. I cut and sanded the pvc ones and wrapped them in electrical tape, ie: cane style. It was even cheaper to mass produce them for the dojang this way. Jere R. Hilland www.HapkidoSelfDefense.com --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 07:21:52 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Broken legs To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I was told that a cut (in flesh) truly takes a year to completely heal, but not sure about a bone. one would think it would be as long or longer for bone. But what I would suggest you doing is instead of directly blocking (you directly stopping your opponent's energy) you focus more on redirecting (going with your opponent's energy), parrying and evading. This way very little contact and no direct contact is made on your injured leg. Do you practice foot checks? I call them foot checks...where you sense your opponent getting ready to launch a kick, and you intercept it either before it launches or in the early beginning of it being launched. If not you might want to try that. How did you break your leg? did you block directly with it? Jye eleusis wrote: I am a student at Kaya Martial Arts in Chicago. I entered my first tournament and after winning the first matches (one with a nice kick to the head) I blocked a kick and broke the fibula bone. I have had the cast off for three weeks now, I am still having pain when I work out but it is lower than the break site. Has anyone experienced this type of injury and if so how long until my body will recover and I can resume working out to full capacity? Thanks, Rich in Chicago Green Belt Taekwondo _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "tim walker" To: Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 10:28:31 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] live blade training Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <> I guess if I couldn't find a sharpened stick to poke in my eye...;) timo (I'll keep an eye out for you) --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Steve H. Kim" To: Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 07:56:23 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Correctly converting Korean Words into English Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Slowly creeping out of lurk mode.... Howdy everyone. Long time reader, first time writer (sorry, too much talk radio). I'm hoping someone can answer this question for me. Does anyone know if there is a book or a website that instructs someone on how to correctly romanitze Korean into English. It seems much easier to teach younger kids Korean terminology if it is written down, but the way we have it written down on our current curriculum, seems to just butcher the Korean language. I write this post with quite a bit of embarrassment because I am Korean but raised in the states so my Korean is fairly weak, and correctly romanizing these words would actually help me quite a bit (it's for the kids). Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Steve Kim Victorville Tae Kwon do --__--__-- Message: 12 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Broken legs To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 08:13:14 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I am a student at Kaya Martial Arts in Chicago. I entered my first tournament > and after winning the first matches (one with a nice kick to the head) I > blocked a kick and broke the fibula bone. I have had the cast off for three > weeks now, I am still having pain when I work out but it is lower than the > break site. Has anyone experienced this type of injury and if so how long > until my body will recover and I can resume working out to full capacity? I did this once many years ago. Mine wasn't bad enough to warrant a cast, just cracked it. But it probably took a couple of years before things were back to normal. Not that I couldn't workout, etc. But discomfort and pain was present for a rather long time. Slow down, give it time to heal. But keep training. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 13 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 09:14:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] mechanical board holders Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net On the topic of mechanical board holding devices, the first one I saw in action was one that Hee Il Cho used during his 1st Beverly Hills Open that was held at Beverly Hills High School (Calif) circa 1982. It was interesting, but keep in mind that one serious problem with such a device is that if you don't hit the boards perfectly on target and kick part of the holding device you may very well end up with a broken foot. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 14 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 09:17:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] Rubbers Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I train with an 8th degree Grandmaster and we use rubber knives. Granted, a lot of people do use them. I give you that. It is just that knife people do not use them, very frequently... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 15 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 09:56:39 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Broken legs To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net How did you break your leg? Jye Ray Terry wrote: I did this once many years ago. Mine wasn't bad enough to warrant a cast, just cracked it. But it probably took a couple of years before things were back to normal. Not that I couldn't workout, etc. But discomfort and pain was present for a rather long time. Slow down, give it time to heal. But keep training. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard --__--__-- Message: 16 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 10:02:17 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] live blade training To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net lol....those guys are bananas to me....But I'm on the outside looking in. I guess one can view different aspects of the martial arts as being specialists in that field. For instance, I have learned many weapons, but I doubt I'm a specialist at all of them...I am just proficient at using them. I look at the martial arts like doctors and specialist...a doctor can remedy a large number of problems, but a specialist can go into more depth to remedy a certain problem. I kind of look at the martial arts in a similar way. Some styles where they do forms, weapons, hand to hand, etc. are like doctors, and some where they do a particular thing day in and day out are specialists with those things....but in saying that...I can use a knife but doubt that I have the level of mastery they have....but then again I'm a chef so ....LMAO Jye tim walker wrote: > I guess if I couldn't find a sharpened stick to poke in my eye...;) timo (I'll keep an eye out for you) _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard --__--__-- Message: 17 From: "eleusis" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Broken legs Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 16:02:19 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Jye and Ray, Thanks. I broke it by blocking a kick directly (Master Park had warned me repeatedly to no rely on my size and to quit taking hits but I was a cop for 8 years and used to it so until this I had no motivation to quit) the hit went directly against the leg. I honestly thought it was just a cramp and kept fighting but in the next round when I tried to kick with it the shock when I hit my opponent really jarred me. I did keep training taking a week off to let things settle. I was able to test for my next belt and instead of breaking with my right leg I used my left to snap the board. but now I have this constant companion in the form of a throb. its lower than the break site where the ligaments and stuff are around the ankle I think so they must just be sore from in activity when they were in the cast. I wont quit, I like it far too much. Rich ----- Original Message ----- From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 9:21 AM Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Broken legs I was told that a cut (in flesh) truly takes a year to completely heal, but not sure about a bone. one would think it would be as long or longer for bone. But what I would suggest you doing is instead of directly blocking (you directly stopping your opponent's energy) you focus more on redirecting (going with your opponent's energy), parrying and evading. This way very little contact and no direct contact is made on your injured leg. Do you practice foot checks? I call them foot checks...where you sense your opponent getting ready to launch a kick, and you intercept it either before it launches or in the early beginning of it being launched. If not you might want to try that. How did you break your leg? did you block directly with it? Jye eleusis wrote: I am a student at Kaya Martial Arts in Chicago. I entered my first tournament and after winning the first matches (one with a nice kick to the head) I blocked a kick and broke the fibula bone. I have had the cast off for three weeks now, I am still having pain when I work out but it is lower than the break site. Has anyone experienced this type of injury and if so how long until my body will recover and I can resume working out to full capacity? Thanks, Rich in Chicago Green Belt Taekwondo _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest