Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2003 03:01:49 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #561 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1600 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. KHF (Hapkido Self Defense Center) 2. KHF Rep (Frank Clay) 3. KHF Policy and Scum (Frank Clay) 4. RE:Cookie cutter school (Manuel Maldonado) 5. Re: My contribution to the Hackworth, and KHF dialog (Victor M Cushing) 6. Re: KHF (Jesse Segovia) 7. RE: Confucius say (Stanley Wojcoski) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Hapkido Self Defense Center" To: Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 10:29:15 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] KHF Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net James, in response to your post to Jesse - I will state that I know for a fact that the personal attack of his seniors has been going on for years. Jere R. Hilland www.HapkidoSelfDefense.com <<>> --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Frank Clay" To: Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 07:40:58 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] KHF Rep Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank Clay Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2003 6:05 AM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: The_Dojang digest, Vol 10 #559 - 8 msgs Jere, According to the KHF website, there is no US Representative. In my mind, the qualified candidate will not only have the skill of a martial artist, but the actions of one as well. To that end, I support the nomination of Master Whalen for that position. While he claims I am the respectful one, and the gentleman, I believe that he has me greatly confused for himself. His attitude and willingness make him an asset to the martial arts community, and his lack of politics, a breath of fresh air for me. On a side note, what I had perceived to be politics from people like Masters Terry, Whalen Timmerman, and the like in the end were actually warnings of what was going on. On the positive side, and yes there is one, I now understand how women, and others in abusive relationships arrive in that situation. To Master Terry and the others, thank you for your support and compassion I shall endeavor to be worthy of it. Though I will not be in Jackson this year, my intent is to make it as soon as possible. It will be a pleasure to sweat with the likes of all of you. Especially since some whom I have known don't like getting on the mat... but that's another story. Frank --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Frank Clay" To: Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 07:57:46 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] KHF Policy and Scum Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Johnson, First let me say, I know this individual. I know him very well. I was more pained that practically anyone, not because of any egg that may be on my face, but because the sacred bond of friendship was violated by this man. This is not a new problem, but one which has persisted for years. This person goes out of his way to slander and attack others, and more often than not it is untrue: He attacked Hal Whalen, and convinced all of us that both Masters Whalen and West were the enemies. Further, if he does not like you, or if you irritate him, he lacks the intelligence to disagree pleasantly and takes it a personal level... for example, he has told me Hal Whalen stole the girlfriend of one of his students, which is untrue, Ray Terry is a "pickle puffer" or an "old fag" (used alternately), Alain Burresse's wife held a less than honorable station in life (that one I don't like to repeat because it angers me... I would not want someone talking about my better half), and now he is making accusations against me saying that I don't pay my child support, which is categorically untrue. In fact, I paid three times my child support in October because of the hurricane and how badly it hurt my ex, with whom I have an amicable relationship and we still consider each other family. Finally, instead of accepting responsibility for his actions and saying, ok look, I made a boo boo, I get a call from one of his lackey's on Monday telling me I don't know what's going on and the Lee, Jae Whan is behind the fakes certs. I mean, please... What makes that argument more amusing was that I was told by a high ranking KHF master that he was going to try Lee, Jae Whan until I came forward and at that point he did not know what would happen. Grandmaster Lee, showed my better half and I friendship, and I am not going to repay his kindness, particularly for her in his guidance of her practice, with lies aimed at humiliating him. This is not someone that the KHF wants to represent them. He is infidelous (he has at least two illegitimate children, that he has told me about - unless that too was untruthful), and simply looks for more ways to get more in the sack, and yet has the gall to say that Ji Han Jae is an old womanizing drunk. Now couple all that on top of the ever growing list of people he has hurt. In my mind, the KHF should flat out expel this individual. These problems will not work themselves out, as they have persisted for over half a decade and perhaps longer. The KHF should put their interests in the hands of people who have KHF/HKD interests first. Not the fleecing of unsuspecting Hapkido-In. Frank --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Manuel Maldonado" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 09:32:46 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE:Cookie cutter school Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I I can say to you is RUN as fast as you can away from there. I hate to even ask I'll bet you any ammout of money the school is Korean Run. Nothing against it but thease guys come here and manipulate the system. Most people I've meet in my live are under the impression that just because the instructor is Korean he's "better" than everyone else. For one they are highly over priced and push their products on the student. If you were to come to my Do-Jang not only would I allow you to use your gear, but your pull over Do-Bok as well (even though we ourselfs don't use them). My thing is training heck you could come in a sweat suit as far as Im concerned,the Macho product dosn't make the fighter. Find your self another school and leave that McDojo. Just my opinion. Maldonado Kwan Jang. http://devoted.to/Taekwondo ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Get holiday tips for festive fun. --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 13:15:31 -0500 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Victor M Cushing Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: My contribution to the Hackworth, and KHF dialog Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I had made a promise not to post comments about the seminar to Richard Hackworth because he appeared at the time I talked with him in person on October 26, 2003 to be contrite and somewhat ready to make amends. I didn't feel it was my place to add fuel to the potential fire. I told him he owed the participants an apology and a refund, and that to be sure he listened to me, I said would forego any refund for myself Since there has been no corrective action taken, that promise is from my perspective now moot. There were a lot of people telling me at the seminar how great Hackworth was and that he was going to really shake things up. Funny how things turn out. I make some critical remarks at the seminar and I am outspoken, opinionated, and quite a character. Hey, I can live with that. How are those of you who ate the bullshit doing at getting to the top? I do have some real sympathy for all the hard working well meaning trusting folks who were conned. Just remember not everybody thought he walked on water. KHF: There were certainly KHF members who felt honored to see and perhaps meet GM Oh Se Lim. I paid a good deal of money to attend what was supposed to be an open seminar where GM Oh Se Lim was going to teach. He did not teach at all. All he did do was and make very brief ceremonial appearances. The very notion that this was an invitation to non-KHF HKD people to join and be welcome was spoiled at the very beginning by having anyone not in a KHF Official Uniform line up in the back row. So we had 1st Dans standing in front of 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th dans. If the KHF wants respect, they will need to show some as well. Richard Hackworth had apparent authority to speak for the KHF in the United States. The KHF either knew or should have known what his activities were. It is bad form to simply shrug their shoulders and say, "We weren't there, the other guy did it." and leave a bad taste in the mouths of a lot of people. If you are going to run a world wide organization, you better put in the monitoring and safeguard systems to protect your own name and the funds of the people who rely on you. There are letters posted on various sites either controlled by or linked to Hackworth supposedly signed by Oh Se Lim inviting people to come to the Florida seminar. The KHF should step up and apologize and give refunds for both the seminar and for rank fees that were collected in their name (even if they never got the funds). It doesn't make sense to think that an organization with 2,000,000 members can't afford to set this mess right. The amount of cash flowing in has to be staggering. The notion that there are not enough resources to provide services and corrective actions to their market has a hollow ring to it. The fly in/fly out quick visit smacks of the recent arrogance of some of our CEO's who got in trouble for their own life styles and bad business practices. Taking a wait and see attitude toward these issues and saying that the Korean approach is to if the problems work themselves out is disavowing any responsibility for them. It is offensive to see honor ignored this blatantly. Vic Cushing --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 15:20:02 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Jesse Segovia To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: KHF Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "John Johnson" wrote: > First, no, the KHF did not supervise the actions of the person in question. > He was allowed to act freely on his own accord to promote the KHF in > whatever way he saw fit. It appears this was a mistake. Is the KHF not responsible for the lack of supervision? > Second, he was never appointed as the US representative. Did no one in the KHF know this is exactly what he claimed to be? This has been going on for some time - I find it hard to believe no on notified the KHF about this situation. > Your final point about why he's been allowed to attack senior KHF members is > false. If in fact you are in a position to advise the KHF I suggest you research this matter further. Your information appears to be incorrect. Jesse --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Stanley Wojcoski" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 16:47:38 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Confucius say Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Confucius say (sorry, just couldn't resist that one:) "I am finally testing for my purple belt on Saturday 12/13/03. I was excited a few months ago, even disappointed when Grandmaster told me to wait. Now that I have permission I do not feel excited about it. Now, it seems it is going to be harder, and more difficult since I am close to black belt. (after brown belt of course). I practice 3x weekly and on my own, but for some reason, I have lost confidence. Does anyone feel a little scared when it comes to advancing to the next level? Am I just being silly?" Not at all. I just did part one of my 2 Dan test (TKD) this morning. I still get the butterflies before testing (there was a thread about that a couple years back). It's just your gut telling you you're ALIVE!!! A great thing if you can focus your energy instead of dwelling on the "what ifs". Understand it for what it is and use it to your advantage. I guess I am less nervous this time than previous tests, but that funny twinge in my stomach helps me corral all my energy and deal with the task at hand. It is akin to the "mind, no mind" state where you just naturally perform without even thinking about it. I am no Zen master or anything, but I have hit that level on occasion where the action seems to slow way down and I clearly see the opportunities opening up for me. Those times are what makes all this practice worthwhile. One of my sparring opponents today said to me afterward that he must have fallen asleep. I said no, I had a rare moment of clarity. Can you tell I'm still a little pumped? Part two tomorrow, stay tuned. Enjoy the journey, Stan Wojcoski Dan (and a half) Garcia's TKD, Hartford CT _________________________________________________________________ Winterize your home with tips from MSN House & Home. http://special.msn.com/home/warmhome.armx --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest