Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 03:01:48 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 11 #3 - 11 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Today's Topics: 1. re: Delema: Loyalty to your school (scottm@scubadiving.com) 2. IOC Vice President Kim Accused of Pocketing Corporate Donations (Ray Terry) 3. Loyalty to your School (Art VanVranken) 4. Hackworth (FRANK CLAY) 5. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Catering_to_Gueppies_?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 6. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Not_getting_your_needs_met?= (bsims@midwesthapkido.com) 7. Never too old (Hapkido Self Defense Center) 8. Tukong Moosul (Jonathan D. Payne) 9. weight workout plans? (james fawbush) 10. Thank you (Charles Richards) 11. Re: The Mc Dojang- my experience (Michael Allen Langton) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 12:12:28 -0500 (EST) From: scottm@scubadiving.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] re: Delema: Loyalty to your school Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net i ran into this same problem a couple of years ago, so i'll speak from my own experience. i spoke with my instructor at the time about my feeling of emptiness at what i had achieved(was a 2nd dan in sport tkd). to make a long story short, i decided to leave because the sport side of martial arts was not what i wanted. as i had been coming up in hap ki do at the same time, the transition was pretty smooth. to sum it up, i advise talking to your instructor first and taking a couple days to think about it before making a decision. based on the training time you describe, you may also be hitting a plateau in your ma career. keep plugging away at your training to get to the next level. good luck :) --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 10:04:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] IOC Vice President Kim Accused of Pocketing Corporate Donations Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net IOC Vice President Kim Accused of Pocketing Corporate Donations By Soh Ji-young Korea Times Staff Reporter Kim Un-yong, the South Korean vice president of the International Olympic Committee (IOC) is suspected of embezzled corporate donations given to the World Taekwondo Federation, which he runs prosecutors said on Monday. The Seoul District Prosecutor's Office (SDPO) summoned Kim, a lawmaker from the Millennium Democratic Party (MDP), in the morning to question him on embezzlement charges and other irregularities. ``I will disclose everything during the prosecution's investigations,'' he said briefly to reporters before entering the SDPO building in southern Seoul. Prosecutors said they have found evidence that Kim pocketed billions of won donated by two major conglomerates to the world's taekwondo governing body and used them for personal purposes. They are also grilling Kim on allegations that he accepted more than 500 million won ($416,500) from two businessmen in return for helping them win membership in the Korean Olympic Committee. He is also being questioned about the source of the $1.5 million worth of foreign currency Kim had in his possession, and whether he smuggled any cash out of the country. The cash was found stashed in his private safe during a police raid on Kim's house Dec. 10. Kim admitted to partially accepting the money, but staunchly denied the bribery charges and claimed that the embezzlement reports were false. Prosecutors hinted that they will summon Kim one or two more times early next month before taking him into custody. Kim, the most powerful man in the nation's taekwondo circles and a longtime member of the IOC, has been implicated in a number of corruption scandals involving various athletic organizations. 12-29-2003 18:13 --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Art VanVranken" To: Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 13:15:17 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Loyalty to your School Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Been there done that! I agree with the ones that say you have a loyalty to your school , but the school has to have a loyalty to the students also. My first school catered to color belts and basically forgot you once you got to Black Belt. I stuck it out thinking it would change for the better till I reached 2nd Dan. It didnt! I searched for another school and got away from the McDojang . The new place was a small school with a Master who was always there. He was mostly always on the floor too. I understand that its a business and needs to run as one, but it should provide the service you are hiring it to provide. If it doesn't, Leave it! --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "FRANK CLAY" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2004 11:31:12 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Hackworth Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net John, Kevn Huston is blind., literally, and the certificate from Kim, Jong Song may have been accidental. The reason that you can't find anything on this guy at KHF is because he is a Taekwondo ChungDoKwan guy, allegedly a student of Uhm, Un Kyu. Ray, I have never seen any such medals in his dojang. I have seen run of the mill banners and awards. I am certain if one had such an award, such as any gold medal, it woud be prominently displayed in the dojang, or at the very least, in his office. Based on the perfomance of his Taekwondo students when I taught there, and in the "USNTA Invitational" against Master Fabian Duque's students (Master Duque is just a no one like the rest of us), who destroyed his students in competition, I doubt it. I was a referee at this event. You are talking about red belts who did not know what Taegeuk Il Jang was. I highly doubt it. Frank PS the students were witnessed by my fiancee who was even more blown away by what she saw than I. _________________________________________________________________ Get reliable dial-up Internet access now with our limited-time introductory offer. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 13:40:07 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Catering_to_Gueppies_?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Thomas: "......Many commercial schools cater to color belts and really don't have an adult retention program in place. Been there so I know what you're going through......" This problem has been endemic in KMA since I can first remember. In the WHF we have pressed GM Myung for specialized classes. You can call them "Black Belt classes", or "instructors classes" or "advanced classes" but the answer is always evasive. My guess is that there simply is not enough BB around to get together under a single teacher to make it cost effective. The trouble is that a good instuctor will not stand still but will begin to reach out to other arts to expand his knowledge. Of course, then you get into mixing material from various places and representing it as a single art and we all know about THAT discussion so I'm not going to say anymore there. There is also the arguement about being loyal to ones' teacher even if he has done about everything for a person that can be done. Sometimes I get asked why I don't leave the WHF if things are so crappy, but the fact is regardless of the organization one has to work from within to change things and sometimes inspite of the leadership. Hey! He can always kick my butt out, right? Happened before! :-) Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 13:43:57 -0600 (CST) From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Not_getting_your_needs_met?= Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear John: "....I'm now thinking of doubling up with another school in Hapkido. I think I can learn things that I can take back to my TKD club. Any thoughts out there? ...." Yeah. BE CAREFUL. For all their talk about character development MA schools are notoriously hypocritical and territorial. You could easily get bounced out of the school if it turns out that you have had the unmitigated gall to place your growth ahead of the ego of the shcool. FWIW. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Hapkido Self Defense Center" To: Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 15:14:27 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Never too old Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net You got in a airplane? I am impressed. <<>> Next time I will make you 80, or would you rather be 50? :) <<>> Jere R. Hilland www.hapkidoselfdefense.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Jonathan D. Payne" To: Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 14:21:07 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Tukong Moosul Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master Thomas, Thank you, It's been a long time since I have seen these. They bring back allot of good memories of Austin, GM Yi, and my Tukong family. Jon David Payne Tukong Musool: (Instructor) Three times! (Class) Patience! (Instructor) Three times! (Class) Consider! (Instructor) Three times! (Class) Forgive! (Everyone) Kiap! Kiap! Kiap! --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 14:51:43 -0800 (PST) From: james fawbush To: The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] weight workout plans? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I was wondering if anyone had any workout plans that would help me in martial arts. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 18:53:44 -0800 (PST) From: Charles Richards To: Dojang Digest Subject: [The_Dojang] Thank you Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Many thanks to GM West, Master Mac, GM Hodder, and many others that have believed in me over the last three years as Master Richards... After three years of putting up with me, I now have two red belts (2nd gup) that started in my garage. I hope they make it through the next year or so to Chodan and 1st poom. They are a father and son team (mom is back in school after earning a 3rd gup). I am looking forward to making the trek to Jackson with my own mutants :-) http://www.mojakwan.com/firstredbelts.JPG Yours in Jung Do, Charles Richards www.mojakwan.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2004 19:02:31 -0800 From: Michael Allen Langton To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: The Mc Dojang- my experience Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I agree with the premise that most of the Martial Arts schools that saty in business are the MC Dojang type. I have been a practicing martial artists in Fresno California for nearly fifteen years and have come across manny students that feel that they are at a good Mc Dojang. My comment is this. Before a student or promising instructor can make such a claim, they should venture out to what other schools are doing and what is being taught. I too was at a Mc. Dojang. The schhol didn't start out that way, and I believe that master Cho of Cho's Tea Kwon Do wanted to really teach a traditional way, but after several years of low enrollement he decided to make a change. I was there to see this change and in fact helped to create the first Commercial Tae Kwon Do school in the Fresno area. After being told that I was wearing my students out and that I nneded to not stress the self defense side of tae kwon do as much I really began to examine my reosons for studying martial art s. Sadly, I left a Master cho and decided to study under Don Vercellini. We had a small school for several years but slowly our traditional Han Moo Kwan Tae Kwon Do School began to only attract serious martialk artists. As a result, our school closed. We have survived and still exist as a TKD club in a local gym (Sunnyside Gym) Fortunaetly for me Martial Arts is not my profession. It is my art. Recently after discussing the close possible close of our club with the Master Vercelinni I went out to see other TKD Schools in the fresno area. The Largest school PILSUNG TKD, now owned by Master Cho's TKD's brother in law was the MC Dojang that I visited. In speaking to the head instructor and franchise owner iI spoke of finding a place for my son ( 1st dan) to train. Of course I was pitched with enrolling him into the MASTERS club. In the instructors inquirery into my background he asked if I had trained in weapons and if I was certified with WTF. Even though my 1st a n d 2nd degrees are with WTF, I opted to only obtain certification through the US Central Han Moo Kwon TKD Association for my 3rd and forth degree. I was promptly informed that I could train with MASTER "TIGER" LEE'S PILSUNG TKD and obtain my WTF 3rd degree. The point being that I truly believe that this franchize owner/ instructor/martial artist thinks he is part of a GOOD MC DOJANG. My only fear is that he hasn't seen anything else. It makes me wonder, would I know as much as I do about pressure points/vital points/ strategic real fighting/ self defense/ sparring/ and the internal systems taught by a traditional TKD school if I had stayed at the MC DOJANG. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest