Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:01:49 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 11 #44 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1600 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Judo Seminar (FirstPe315@aol.com) 2. Dan and forms (Frank Clay) 3. RE: Query regarding advancement (David Weller) (David Weller) 4. Sales pitch (Rudy Timmerman) 5. Re: Hackworthless (Dr. Daryl Covington) 6. Free Stuff (K. J. Durbin) 7. weapons training... (George Peters) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: FirstPe315@aol.com Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 03:14:52 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Judo Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To All- Mike Swain is coming to Ki Martial Arts in Aurora, CO (a suburb of Denver) on February 28th. Great opportunity to share the mat with one of the greats for 4-5 hours and sharpen up on the old Throwing and Grappling Techniques. Check out kimartialarts.com for further information. Jeff --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Frank Clay" To: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 06:33:15 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Dan and forms Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Danny, It could also be an old set called Chinte. This set is different from the ones you have listed, and though quite short, is a lively set. John Hancock is also familiar with this set I believe. Frank --__--__-- Message: 3 From: David Weller Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:02:22 -0600 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Query regarding advancement (David Weller) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Master Farral , I'm sorry my post was not clearer. I was not interested in helping this person skip a belt. My point was that even though this person is talented enough that a belt skip might be possible, he is not interested in fast advancement. His goal is to learn as much as possible and let the belts come as they may. I was trying to make the point that even newby's can understand that it's the journey, rather than the destination, that makes life (and Martial Arts) fun, interesting and worth a ticket!! Personally, I would never ask a student to skip a belt, regardless of talent. Shortcuts are things we take with our wives in the car to show our prowess over maps, and generally lead to a "bad" part of town. I do appreciate your input sir. Your thoughtful comments are consistent with all the good things in Martial Arts! Have a groovy day, dave On Feb 3, 2004, at 5:01 AM, the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net wrote: > Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 07:50:32 -0500 > From: "Farral, Kim" > To: "Dojang " > Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Query regarding advancement (David Weller) > Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > > Pil Seung... > > David... > > I recommend discussing this particular student and topic with a couple > of the Master Instructors (like Master Weaver and Master Mostowitz) > prior to the test...see what their opinions are...then approach GM Kim > if they support your opinion...but they will at least give you an > honest > assessment... > > It will ultimately be the decision of GM Kim since you are not testing > him privately and all advancements have to be approved by GM... > > I, personally, have no problem advancing a student by skipping a rank > at > Yellow Belt Level...Though I would only allow skipping a rank up to > Green Belt and not beyond... > > Pil Seung!!! --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:55:33 -0500 From: Rudy Timmerman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Sales pitch Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello Luke: Nice to have you on the DD. You'll enjoy the folks here, and if you can come meet some in person at JRs Jackson seminar in March. It seems like you have tried the "other route" before, now you can mingle with folks who have a bit more class:) > It's the issue of free stuff. For example, a lot of schools in my area > have a free uniform and/or free first session. The term "you get what > you pay for" comes to mind. I feel most people believe that. I agree with your take on free stuff, and if a prospect asks about that I usually tell them : "I'm sure the folks at the other school know the value of their lessons. I don't, so I can't really comment on their sales pitch". This usually brings a smile on the face of the prospect, and the question is dropped. Sincerely, Rudy W. Timmerman, Chief Master National Korean Martial Arts Association --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:12:30 -0800 (PST) From: "Dr. Daryl Covington" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Hackworthless Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Luke, I am a pastor. I have tought kids for free as part of the ministry of our church, and charged for lessons as well. In one case, current, I was charging for the classes, but to pressures from within the church, I stopped charging. The results were interesting. Of a class of over 80, including Many adults, simply quit. Months later, I started a new school outside the church, once again charging. The adults that QUIT the free classes came back. "Nothing in this world is free" seems to ring in the minds of people. If its free, its not worth much. Even from a Christian perspective, Salvation isn't free, It cost Christ his life. My advice is stay true to "you get what you pay for" and throw the "marketing scemes" of the day out the window. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "K. J. Durbin" To: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:28:33 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Free Stuff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: luke rose To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Hackworthless Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net This talk of money has brought a quandary to my thinking. I have a small school and I'm growing quicker than I ever have before. It's the issue of free stuff. For example, a lot of schools in my area have a free uniform and/or free first session. The term "you get what you pay for" comes to mind. I feel most people believe that. So, I don't do either of those things. I also explain my philosophy to people when they ask about it. I'll say something to the affect of "people don't value things that are given as much as if they earn it". So I instead have a 30 day money back guaranty. I'm also attempting to get local businesses to sponsor kids who can't pay for lessons. I agree with you about the free stuff, what is given free is sometimes not appreciated. It may be a different situation for you. I teach out of my home, my garage is converted into a studio. I offer 2 weeks free which equates to about 2 lessons a week, if the perspective student wants to attend more classes he or she is welcome. I look at it in two ways. One, (the most important) I want students who want to learn, if they find it is not for them, then so be it. I put no one into a contract to teach them, because "There's the door" works either way. The students (parents) sign a waiver, and articles of conduct. Secondly, so far I really haven't had to advertise. The students do that. But this works for me in my situation. But those two weeks that are free for the perspective student are well worth their time because they are really going to learn. And its worth my time because I get to teach what I love with some compensation as the frosting. Oh yeah----after all is said and done, they still have to buy the uniform. Hap Ki Won K.J. Durbin --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "George Peters" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 00:45:13 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] weapons training... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Most Esteemed Membership: I wish to pose a question to the membership of the DD. Should anyone object to the study of a particular weapon that is said to be not Korean? ie: such as the tonfa or nunchaku. Is there or has there ever been a list of "approved" weapons to learn? Is there or has there been such a list in regards to tournament useage of said weapons? If one wishes to remain or to be viewed as "traditional" are Chinese weapons also to be excluded? If your org does not offer weapons other than bong hyungs, should one be inhibited about getting instruction from "outside sources". Should or will your present instructor be offended by such behavior? Thank you for your time and kindness, I will read your answers with great interest. Respectfully, George _________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest