Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:56:06 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 11 #115 - 17 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1600 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Scott Shaw (FirstPe315@aol.com) 2. Why do so many need to sign their name as "Master"? (Wicker, H. Keith) 3. name game update (Edward) 4. RE: round house-ball of foot (wendy lavery) 5. Name game (Wayne Watkins) 6. Name Game (Nathan Miller) 7. Roundhouse kicks (Dennis McHenry) 8. Roundhouse instep/ball (jmchie@wideopenwest.com) 9. Name Game (Dennis McHenry) 10. RE: name game (Denise) 11. RE: Round House - Ball of Foot (Stovall, Craig) 12. Master West's Seminars (Edward Gomez) 13. Re: Chuck Sereff (Robert Martin) 14. RE: RE: Round House - Ball of Foot (Rick Clark) 15. RE: name game (Tom Stanfield) 16. 90% at Cho Dan? (was: KKW/ITF differences) (Lasich, Mark D.) 17. Re: Master West's Seminars (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: FirstPe315@aol.com Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:08:33 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Scott Shaw Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net If getting articles published and being in national magazines made you legitimate, then Pelligrini would be legitimate too. That would mean Hackworth is legitimate too because him and his wife still regularly write a column in TKDT. The martial-arts world (at least the commercial martial-arts world) don't care about whether people are legitimate, can do the things they claim or are fraudlent, as long as they sell magazines. Jeff In a message dated 3/11/2004 2:22:43 PM Pacific Standard Time, the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > He > certainly gets enough magazine articles published...or at least he used to. > It seems there was a time I couldn't pick up a copy of Black Belt without > seeing an article by him. --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Wicker, H. Keith" To: "'the_dojang@martialartsresource.net'" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:02:56 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Why do so many need to sign their name as "Master"? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have a thought I would like to share.....of all the "true" KMA Masters that I have met....none of them ever sign their name as "Master so and so". IMHO, if you are really a Master of your art, then you should be humble enough not to refer to yourself as "Master so and so" or sign your name as "Master so and so". Comments? Keith Wicker --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:16:52 -0800 From: Edward To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] name game update Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have added the new names and their possibile spellings. There are only a few left un-named. Edward --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "wendy lavery" To: Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2004 05:06:47 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: round house-ball of foot Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bernard, Thank-You very much! Your tips were very helpfull and It most certainly will help to understand "what" I'm striking! Respectfully, Wendy Lavery --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:53:10 -0600 From: "Wayne Watkins" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Name game Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net #22 - Rick Senn #32 - Ryan Boone #33 Cedric Watson [demime 0.98e removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 05:59:30 -0800 (PST) From: Nathan Miller To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Name Game Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Heehee... Number 26 would be Charlie Veuleman - don't worry, half the time, even he can't spell it. :-) And number 27, that's me, has the last name of Miller. Nathan --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:48:43 GMT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Dennis McHenry Subject: [The_Dojang] Roundhouse kicks Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Rick: "That being said it would seem to me that there would be a reason not to practice kicking with instep of the foot - at least for those who do not want to participate in point sparing for competition." Sometimes the ball of the foot is good in compitition, as it can reach around someone's block and still make contact. To me, it all depends on what I'm using it for as to whether I'm going to use which part of my foot. I've been a student for a few years and have practiced both ways, so I can use either. As I usually wear those pointy cowboy boots (I live in the great state of Texas) it is difficult to point my foot anyway - and with the pointed toes and larger heels I would use those as my weapons, not the instep. With other shoes on, I'd tend to most likely use the instep. Bare footed, I have more of a choice depending on the situation and the target. I have tried kicking with the ball of the foot wearing tinnis shoes (tried to break a cement brick) and almost broke my big toe) - doesn't work very well. But I do agree with you Rick, that if one only practices with their instep (as many do) that would be the first instinctual weapon to use out of habbit. ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! --__--__-- Message: 8 From: jmchie@wideopenwest.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:54:46 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Roundhouse instep/ball Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net In our Hapkido/Ninjutsu school, we discuss both types of contact points with the roundhouse kick. Our focus is self defense. I personally use the instep when kicking on the target--less chance of injuries toes. But there is a contingent in our school who consistently shoot for using the ball. Why? Because when you are on the street with your steel-toed boots on, you don't need to worry about no toes. With any form of hard shoes, if you have to kick (something we don't generally advocate) you don't want to risk the bones on the top of your foot. Your toes are actually substantially more protected with most footwear. You pull those toes up and try to hit with the ball--fully realizing you are going to contact your opponent with the point of the foot. There's been so many posts recently I haven't been able to follow them all, so I apologize if this point has already been made. Jim McHie Jr. ps I will be going to the seminar with GM Lim next weekend. It will be my first time at one of his seminars. Can anyone tell me about him beyond what appears in his bio? What's he like? Thanks in advance for any information provided. --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:55:35 GMT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Dennis McHenry Subject: [The_Dojang] Name Game Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net #18 Master Denis Lee I don't know that #7 is Jason Thomas, unless there are 2 of them :-) I did meet #7 but forgot his name (sorry). I don't even see Master Thomas in the photo - must have snuck out during the photo shoot, but he was there too in Jackson. ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Denise" To: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:32:07 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: name game Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Representing the vertically challenged . . . uuh, those not of the taller persuasion: #18 ~ Denise Lee --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:40:44 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Round House - Ball of Foot Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Just to add my two cents. I don't consider the instep a preferred weapon in a self-defense context...unless you have the bone structure of a lowland gorilla. There's a reason you see a stomp to the top of the foot being taught as a self-defense tactic in many quarters...those little bones on the top of the foot are easy to break. It doesn't make much sense to use those relatively fragile bones as a kicking surface within the context of a full-contact strike unless they're covered with an inch or so of space-age foam (which ain't likely on the street). It's also been my experience that there is a severe danger of hyper-extending the ankle when delivering a forceful kick with the instep as a striking surface. This can happen when the range isn't quite right, and you end up hitting the target out on the toes, or the portion of the foot right above the toes. I've done this on occasion when doing some hard sparring, and it doesn't feel very good at all. In fact, it can be a fight ender...for you. My last TKD instructor made a simple distinction between "traditional roundhouse blade" and "courtesy blade". Traditional was with the ball of the foot as the striking surface, and this was the norm for basic technique, forms, one-steps, etc. The "courtesy blade" strike with the instep was only used for sparring...it was considered a courtesy not to tickle your sparring partner's spleen with the ball of your foot when kicking them in the bread basket. I like this distinction, and I also like the term "courtesy blade" as it serves as a reminder that it's something we do so that we can all go to work tomorrow...not because it's a traditional martial art technique that has stood the test of time. I think many people have forgotten this. Now, I've had people tell me that they stress the instep blade because most of us wear shoes these days (unless you live in Dogpatch). Their "theory" is that the ball of the foot is not available to strike with when wearing shoes, and that the shoe will protect the instep. Cool...my "theory" is that the traditional blade with shoes on becomes a toe kick. Think of the "Fouette" from Boxe Francaise Savate...in my opinion, one of the most devastating kicks a human can develop. I like the old theories when they make sense. Delivering force through the smallest possible surface area makes sense to me. "Ball of foot/toe of shoe" is a heck of a lot less surface area than the whole top of your foot. When it's done right there is a "sinking in" of the strike that just seems to go right through you. For those that have been hit in the gut by it, you know what I'm talking about. It's even more devastating when that same strike is delivered to the head. There's no "sinking in", but rather a severe and rapid special displacement of the entire head from the focused nature of the strike. How do you spell "concussion"...b-a-l-l-o-f-f-o-o-t. And of course, much less chance of damaging the foot or ankle when striking with the ball/toe, as opposed to the instep. Yes, it takes a little more time to properly cultivate the ball of foot strike as opposed to the instep (at least for me), but the results in terms of weapon development are not even comparable. The force transmission due to the smaller surface area, as well as the structural alignment of the leg/ankle/foot is just brutal. Case in point, I can block instep kicks all day long by just "covering and rolling" a la the classic structure of western boxing. Then again, I've caught someone's ball of the foot in my upper arm before from a "medium" kick, and I was walking around for about 3 days after that dragging my arm like Dr. Strangelove. It ain't nice!!! Humble thoughts for your consideration... CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This email transmission contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the individual or entities named above. If this email was received in error or if read by a party which is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error or are unsure whether it contains confidential or privileged information, please immediately notify us by email or telephone. You are instructed to destroy any and all copies, electronic, paper or otherwise, which you may have of this communication if you are not the intended recipient. Receipt of this communication by any party shall not be deemed a waiver of any legal privilege of any type whatsoever as such privilege may relate to the sender. --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "Edward Gomez" To: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:10:30 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Master West's Seminars Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi all, Have a question to the people that attended Master West's seminar this past week. I was wondering if you need to be a hapkidoin to attend. I hold a 3rd dan in TKD, soon to be 4th, and would love to go to the fall seminar. Would I be seriously disadvantaged since I don't have a hapkido background? ---------- Edward J. Gomez Director of Network Services ProxyMed, Inc 2555 Davie Road, Suite 110 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33317 (954) 473-1001 x315 (770) 885-4557 FAX Confidential, unpublished property of ProxyMed, Inc. (c) copyright as of the date of this email. ProxyMed, Inc. CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments and files transmitted with it, are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. It may contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. Moreover, this communication may contain the original sender's personal views and opinions, which do not necessarily reflect those of ProxyMed, Inc. . If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, or if you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by return e-mail and delete the original message and any copies of it from your system. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error, and that any unauthorized review, use, disclosure, distribution, forwarding, printing, or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited without our prior, written permission. --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:42:06 -0800 (PST) From: Robert Martin To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Chuck Sereff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I never seen this in any of his official bio information. Robert Martin Message: 11 From: "C. Bonner" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:00:29 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Chuck Sereff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr.Sereff also holds a black belt in Hapkido. And has put it in the U.S.T.F. curriculum.They do more hapkido than most I.T.F.(Chang Hun) school's. There is some Hapkido in the I.T.F. curriculum tho. C. --__--__-- Message: 14 From: "Rick Clark" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] RE: Round House - Ball of Foot Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:53:43 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi All, I have noticed a couple of responses to this thread that they find it might be difficult to kick with the ball of the foot if they have shoes on. I would like to offer an exercise to try - with some tennis shoes on, and if you have a tree in your yard. Try a few kicks with your shoe on and with the ball of the foot. You will probably have to make some adjustment to the position of your body as to what you might expect in the gym, but it will be minimal. I think you will find it is not only possible to kick a tree, but it is not as bad as you would think. Of course you will not want to kick full force, but with a light kick and they you can "learn" how hard you might want to kick a tree:-) This was one of the things Son Duk Son would do in his training - and if you have his book it will show him kicking a tree, perhaps with a side kick I can't remember. Rick Clark www.Ao-Denko-Kai.org --__--__-- Message: 15 From: "Tom Stanfield" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] name game Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:16:22 -0600 Organization: Westar Construction, Inc. Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net #17 - Tom Stanfield -----Original Message----- From: Ray Terry [mailto:rterry@idiom.com] Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 9:22 PM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] name game > The link didn't come through for some reason. Please repost. > > Thomas Gordon > Florida http://homepage.mac.com/ep3/ddwhoswho.jpg Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 16 From: "Lasich, Mark D." To: "Dojang (E-mail)" Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:29:05 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] 90% at Cho Dan? (was: KKW/ITF differences) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Rick Clark wrote: >I have been of the opinion for a long time that once you get to 1st dan >level you know 90% or more of the system. This got me thinking about my own training, and I would guess the number would have been somewhere closer to 60%. At cho dan the wealth of circular hand techniques were introduced, advanced "chambering" of techniques, advanced kicking techniques (e.g. advanced jump kicks may have some of the same components as their grounded counterparts, but these really must be learned new), new stances, new/continued philosophies, etc. In fact my newest hyung identifies 2 new stances, 4 new blocks, 11 new strikes and 2 new kicks! Looking at it this way equates to roughly 20% "new" techniques! On top of this, add advanced hossinsol, weapons, etc.......maybe after all this time I've really only scratched the surface! In my opinion, putting me down for 10% may still be generous ;-) In the spirit, Mark --__--__-- Message: 17 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Master West's Seminars To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:38:46 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Have a question to the people that attended Master West's seminar this past > week. I was wondering if you need to be a hapkidoin to attend. I hold a 3rd > dan in TKD, soon to be 4th, and would love to go to the fall seminar. Would > I be seriously disadvantaged since I don't have a hapkido background? No. There are plenty of TSD and TKD-only folks present. You would not be disadvantaged in any way, imo. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest