Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2004 03:01:50 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 11 #178 - 11 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Re: Which IHF ? (Master Allen) 2. Re: Re: IHF (Master Allen) 3. RE: Public Perception of Hapkido (Kip McCormick) 4. Re: Re: IHF (Ray Terry) 5. Re: Which IHF ? (Ray Terry) 6. (no subject) (DrgnSlyr5@aol.com) 7. The same WHA? (Christopher Spiller) 8. Re: IHF (confused) (Klaas Barends) 9. Dojunim Ji Seminar (Kevin Janisse) 10. Good Friday (Ray Terry) 11. (no subject) (gerrald) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Master Allen" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Which IHF ? Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 16:51:50 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "Actually I believe there are now more than three HKD orgs recognized by the Korean gov. With perhaps more to come." As far as how many HKD org there are, I do not know. New one's appear every day. I only know of three that are listed as IHF. "I do not believe that Gm Han's IHF is recognized by the Korean government, nor is it interested in that." I will call Grandmaster Han and make sure. I am glad you can speak for him though. He knows me pretty well. He and my instructor used to teach together back in Korea (1950's and 60's) on the military bases. Master Jeff Allen Chief Instructor President-American Headquarters www.hapkiyoosool.com www.intlhapkido.com International Hapkido Federation ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Terry To: The_Dojang Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 10:02 AM Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Which IHF ? > Completely Different IHF. We are not connected to them at all. There are > actually Three IHF recognized by the Korean Gov. Your IHF website claims you are the -only- IHF recognized as such. "Please do not confuse the International Hapkido Federation with any other organization with the same name. Our organization is one of only three Hapkido organizations recognized by the Korean government. We are NOT affiliated with ANY other US organization of the same name." Actually I believe there are now more than three HKD orgs recognized by the Koeran gov. With perhaps more to come. > Ours, Myong Jae-Nam (that website link) and Bong-Soo Han. I do not believe that Gm Han's IHF is recognized by the Korean government, nor is it interested in that. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1600 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Master Allen" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: IHF Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 17:05:14 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To Klaas, "I thought the master Jang mentioned on the website had left the IHF a couple of years ago. (after Myung Jae Nam's death?)" On which website and where? I am confused......Not on our website that I recall. "Furthermore there is no such thing as 'The International HKD Federation American Headquarters'. Or there are several of them. (again politics, politics, politics) " We are a completely different IHF and we do have an American HQ in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. "At this moment there are few schools in the U.S. who have a close relationship with the IHF here in Korea. Most Korean teachers in the US came there long before Myung Jae Nam had institutionalized his hankido curriculum." We DO NOT teach Hankido. We are in direct chain of command to Grandmaster Jang, Young-Shil in Korea of his International Hapkido Federation HQ in Pyongtaek, South Korea. I know this is going to come up, We use do the same patch because there is no copyright on it and we have been using it long before Myong Jae-Nam died with his permission. Grandmaster Jang was a close FRIEND of GM Myong. Master Jeff Allen Chief Instructor President-American Headquarters www.hapkiyoosool.com www.intlhapkido.com International Hapkido Federation ----- Original Message ----- From: Klaas Barends To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 7:09 AM Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: IHF > Jeff, > > Is this the same International Hapkido Federation in Korea that does Hankido > as well as Hapkido? > > It appears to be different, yet the above IHF site claims to be the only > Korean goverment recognized IHF. > > The IHF at www.hapkido.or.kr is also recognized by the Korean goverment. I thought the master Jang mentioned on the website had left the IHF a couple of years ago. (after Myung Jae Nam's death?) Furthermore there is no such thing as 'The International HKD Federation American Headquarters'. Or there are several of them. (again politics, politics, politics) At this moment there are few schools in the U.S. who have a close relationship with the IHF here in Korea. Most Korean teachers in the US came there long before Myung Jae Nam had institionalized his hankido curriculum. -- mvg. Klaas Barends http://www.hapkido.nl/ _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 1600 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Kip McCormick" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Public Perception of Hapkido Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2004 14:19:26 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "A lot of wrist and elbow action..." Sounds like the way I dance! Ah, how I miss the 70s...Where's my leisure suit?! Kip Kip McCormick Warrior Hapkido USKMAF Seoul, Korea >From: Bert Edens >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >Subject: [The_Dojang] Public Perception of Hapkido >Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 12:50:51 -0700 (PDT) > >Greetings, all... > As part of the discussion about Hapkido being a >"complete art" or just a "tag-along" art, I submit the >following... Part of the problem is certainly public >perception. This article at: > >http://www.starnewspapers.com/star/spsports/smix/082sx1.htm > > doesn't help... It includes the blurb, when >describing various arts: > >"Hapkido — This particular format is actually a >blending of Judo and Tae Kwon Do. Movements >incorporate a lot of wrist and elbow action." > > I'll leave it to the crowd here to comment on that >definition... :) > ><> > >- Bert Edens > Springdale, Arkansas > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway >http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/ >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 1600 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _________________________________________________________________ Tax headache? MSN Money provides relief with tax tips, tools, IRS forms and more! http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/workshop/welcome.asp --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: IHF To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 16:17:35 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > In Korea, the lineages are listed like this. Let's say I directly taught "tom" > and "peter". Peter started before tom and received his teaching certificate > before tom did. Tom would be listed as Peter's student even though Tom studied > directly under me. It is how it goes. > > Look at the WHOLE name. Is is Jang, Young-Shil?? Not sure if that is true or not... But the question is was your Master Jang a student under the IHF's Master Myung Jae-nam? Thanks. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Which IHF ? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 16:20:20 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > "I do not believe that Gm Han's IHF is recognized by the Korean government, > nor is it interested in that." > > I will call Grandmaster Han and make sure. I am glad you can speak for him > though. He knows me pretty well. He and my instructor used to teach together > back in Korea (1950's and 60's) on the military bases. Not sure anyone other than Gm Han speaks for Gm Han. :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 6 From: DrgnSlyr5@aol.com Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 20:09:29 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Linda wrote: << Many have mentioned how tough and mean the women are that they know in martial arts. I think the reason female martial artists tend to be so mean is that we are tired of being looked down upon, talked down to, or altogether dismissed. We are tired of having to prove and reprove ourselves and our abilities, although it is kind of fun sometimes to beat up a man who thinks you are a weak and demur little girl. :-) No where else is my daily socializations with human beings, including the workplace, have I felt more discriminated against for being a woman than in martial arts. This includes attitudes from both martial artists and non-martial artists or wannabe-martial artists alike. I guess the only answer is to keep beating up those who doubt us. >> Linda, I'm sorry this has been your experience in MA. Perhaps my association is outside the "norm," but I haven't had a problem with that kind of attitude. My instructor expects the same of me as he does the male students and gives the same respect regardless of gender. His actions set the tone for the school. Outside my own school, the respect given has a lot to do with the fact that my instructor's standards are very high and he doesn't give any rank that is not earned. Being tough is a good thing. Whether male or female, toughness is necessary for perseverance in training and for being able to function under pressure. As for mean, recognizing that we may be defining terms differently, a need to be "mean," is not a positive quality in my book. "Mean," to me, is deliberately inflicting a disproportionate amount of pain on one's partner, often to show that one can. To me, part of being a competent martial artist is knowing where the edge is, being able to achieve and maintain control of the technique, and still protect your partner. Do we sometimes hurt each other? Of course. Studying is an ongoing learning process. Some arts are rougher on partners than others. We study Hapkido which is not on the kind and gentle side of the spectrum. When my instructor is teaching or I'm teaching private lessons, sometimes I get hurt as a partner. The student always feels bad and apologizes, but I tell them, don't worry about it; this is what we do for each other so that we can learn. There are times the person I'm partnered with will deliberately try to prevent me from completing the technique. I don't mind -- it's good training for me, although I do wonder why they wish the ensuing pain upon themselves. ;-) Some of it is human nature; the student testing the teacher's ability. However, this is not uncommon regardless of whether a male or female is teaching. Sometimes it is the student wanting the assurance that the technique works, and totally gender unrelated. As for attitude from others off the mat, just let it roll off your back. Others being unaware of your actual abilities is an advantage should you ever have a confrontation with them. Be happy in your training, but most of all, do it for yourself, not to prove anything to anyone else. Sharon --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 17:28:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Spiller To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] The same WHA? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >>An interesting analysis. In some cases this may be true. However, definitely not in all. In my system of Hapkido and the WHA more specifically, grappling is a significant component. ... Jeff,<< Is the WHA you mention the World Hapkido Association headed by Master Jung, Tae? He's based out of California. I just took a seminar with him last weekend (April 3rd) in Pennsylvania. Quite impressive, I have to say. And boy, Master Jung WAS into grappling, that's for sure! Taekwon, Chris __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/ --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2004 08:28:55 +0800 From: Klaas Barends To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: IHF (confused) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > In Korea, the lineages are listed like this. Let's say I directly taught "tom" > and "peter". Peter started before tom and received his teaching certificate > before tom did. Tom would be listed as Peter's student even though Tom studied > directly under me. It is how it goes. Never heard of this before. Never noticed it here in Korea either. In that case all of Myung Jae Nam students would say they are students of Han SiHwan. And all students of Choi Young Sool would say they are students of Suh Bok Sub. Right? >From what I gathered, your master Jang Young Shil was related to the IHF (the one founded by master Myung Jae Nam) but after his death he found his own federation (the reasons are unknown to me) and also called it IHF (maybe the Korean name is different? ie. not: Kuk Jae Yon Maeng Hapki Hwe). It is also possible that the federation was allready some time around, but before never stood on his own (something you see in Korea, where some schools within a federation work closely together (http://www.ihkd.co.kr/)). Althought the current organization of the IHF wasn't founded until the 80's, master Myung had allready found his own organization on november 11, 1969 (which was then called Korean Hapkido Association). The mark on your webpage (inthapkido.com) has a striking resemblance with some of the marks used by the IHF (founded by master Myung Jae Nam), which got me confused at first. -- mvg. Klaas Barends http://www.hapkido.nl/ --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "Kevin Janisse" To: Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 17:47:03 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Dojunim Ji Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello All, I would share my first experience with Dojunim Ji a couple of weekends ago at the HapKiDo Master/Instructor 3 day seminar in Seattle, WA. It was great. Non stop from start to finish. Friday - Techniques for 8 hours. (Yes my wrists/arms were sore, bruised, scratched, cut and inflamed). Saturday - Kicking for 6 hours and knife defense for 2 hours. (Techniques didn't seem so bad). Sunday - 6 hours of Weapons= Handkerchief, Staff, Sword, Dahn Bong. (no one died). We wrapped up the day with revival techniques. (used on those who passed out during the kicking). Of course we had an hour of Ki training each morning. He focused mainly on power Ki training which I found quite interesting. I was able to meet some very talented HKD people who did not mind hitting the mat over and over and over.... Dojunim used me a few times so I got to experience him firsthand. He even did his forward roll trapping the heel and kicking to the face. (This surprised me considering he is 63 years old and had gall bladder surgery a week earlier). One partner got whacked a good one and Dojunim was genuinely concerned about it. Even though he gets in your face and pushes you hard, he is nice about it in the end. I found that his selection of kicks that he teaches are different from ones I have been used to. He focused on using the supporting hand on the floor (like many of you have mentioned) when doing a spin kick, round house, or side kick. His purpose for this was to remove the stress created in the lower back area. He commented that many TKD kickers have back problems due to this. It was also great to see a Korean Grandmaster holding targets for you, staying on the mat with you, and being interested in your full understanding of what he is trying to teach. All in all....I would do it again and recommend this type of seminar to all MA. Sincerely, Kevin Janisse NKMAA --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 17:04:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] Good Friday Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hope everyone had a good Good Friday and has a great Easter. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "gerrald" To: Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 20:12:53 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Can anyone tell me what keeps them motivated to train in there respective arts. What can I do as a student in a dojang. Thank you in advance Gerrald Yaremko --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest