Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2004 03:04:19 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 11 #517 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1800 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: [Eskrima] rotator cuff injuries (fwd) (jakskru@sbcglobal.net) 2. Re: Chinese Koguryo?? (Bruce Sims) 3. Re: Hapkido Discrepancy (Bruce Sims) 4. Everybody's Teaching the same different thing! (Dunn, Danny J GARRISON) 5. KJN Shin, Dan Bon, and Master Rank (Dunn, Danny J GARRISON) 6. Re: [Eskrima] rotator cuff injuries (fwd) (Ray Terry) 7. DoJang Facilites and Locations (Jared Circle) 8. Rotator Cuff Injuries (Rudy Timmerman) 9. Re: DoJang Facilites and Locations (Martin Von Cannon) 10. (no subject) (DAVID WHEELER) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] [Eskrima] rotator cuff injuries (fwd) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 00:10:34 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net i dont know if the "Ray" in this article was you Mr. Terry, but here is a link to an article that i pretty much owe my complete recovery from a partial tear of my rotator cuff as well as a tear of one of the other muscles involved ( the infraspinatus ). i elected not to have surgery, and after intensive rehab going on for about 5 months i was able to get back to about 75% usage in my shoulder. after following the regime outlined in this article i was able to get back to about 95% effectiveness after 1 month of following the articles recommendations ( as well as researching my injury at a link within the article itself ). the rehab is very intense, but i would recommend it to anyone and i gave it two extremely erect thumbs up..... http://www.dolfzine.com/page391.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Terry" To: "The_Dojang" Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 8:39 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] [Eskrima] rotator cuff injuries (fwd) > Lots of good info, so I thought you folks would enjoy seeing it. > > Ray > > ============================================= > > Subject: [Eskrima] rotator cuff injuries --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 04:56:30 -0800 (PST) From: Bruce Sims To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Chinese Koguryo?? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ".....Chinese sources for claims on Koguryo....." I was surprised at how readily I found material on the two Chinese provinces north of the Yalu river. I say surprised because what quickly came out was that area had been, for centuries a location tantamont to a "no mans' land" between the Han south of "the Wall" and the more nomadic raiding peoples north of "the Wall". >From what I can tell the late Ching and early Republic administrations had projects to encourage emmigration into that area by Northen Chinese (Han) in an attempt to build an arguement for solidifying their hold. Speaking ethnically, it seems that the population is a pretty even mix of Korean, Manchu, Hui (Muslim) and Han none of which is anything as it probably was during Koguryo, FWIW. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 05:07:41 -0800 (PST) From: Bruce Sims To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Hapkido Discrepancy Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "......I think Occam's Razor applies here...." If I were viewing this as an inconsistency to be reconciled I think you are right on the money. The issue that I was raising was a challenge of sorts to the forces that work against a common set of terminology. By this I mean that it might be worthwhile to take a look at the validity of why we have multiple terms in the first place. We have a common ethnicity (or source language if you will) We have (by most authorities) a common source for the art. We have many of the same techniques albeit with variation in execution. We have multiple authorities stating that they are teaching what their teacher taught them. For all intents and purposes we should have everyone doing the same thing and calling what they do the same thing, and we don't. Nor do I see much movement by high-placed leaders to reconcile these differences. So far the only clear reason for this that I can find is that human beings are exercizing their right to make Korean martial arts a unique expression of their own personalities or to define their individual commercial turf. FWIW. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 07:38:39 -0600 From: "Dunn, Danny J GARRISON" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Everybody's Teaching the same different thing! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce, I think you may be looking a little to hard here. I think everyone makes some changes or adds or subtracts some things based on their personal philosophy and experiences as they mature as a martial artist. I know I do and I will bet based just on what you have written here over time you have too. Yet I claim my KJN's Tang Soo Do, and rightfully so I believe, even though I do some things a little different than he, and I've also added some things to my curriculum. I think it is just part of maturing as a martial artist, and it is the basis for the evolution of our arts. Danny Dunn <<>> --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 08:06:22 -0600 From: "Dunn, Danny J GARRISON" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] KJN Shin, Dan Bon, and Master Rank Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net MC asked me to chime in on several issues related to WTSDA and KJN Shin, Jae Chul. I've been very busy lately, so I am running a little late. As for Master Rank, so far as my experience goes, everyone in Tang Soo Do that traces their lineage to the Moo Duk Kwan it is at 4th dan. WTSDA is set up a little differently than some, in that all 4th dans are not given the opportunity to test for Master Rank, which has separate requirements and a separate test. MC was correct for the most part, up to 3rd dan. The current minimum time in rank progression goes like this: cho dan 3.5 years, e dan 2 yrs, sam dan 3 yrs, sah dan 5 yrs. All testing for sah dan go through a 2 or more year candidate program at the annual Master Clinic, though many take longer. Those who pass the written and physical tests and have their thesis accepted are awarded sah dan, which is a black belt with 4 stripes on one end. Those who meet the additional requirements for Master Rank, that is those who are passing on the art and are actively supporting the organization are given the opportunity to test with the senior Masters for Master Rank. No it is not about another testing fee to bring in more money, in fact there is no fee for initially testing for Master Rank. KJN Shin's belief is that Master Rank should be reserved for those who are passing on the art, dedicated to humanitarianism and supporting the organization. Now having talked about the minimum times, I believe that when I started into the sah dan candidate program, there were about 30 in my group and there is only one person I can remember that had less than 15 years experience and the majority had around 25 years experience. MC you are also correct about KJN Shin, Jae Chul's (dan bon #698) history. Incidentally, I have seen it listed in a couple of published books wrong. Born 1936 and began training at 12, which would have been 1948. Apparently, for at least the first few years he was not allowed to train at all. Just watch and do some chores. I do not know the year he was awarded dan, maybe around 1956. I will try to ask when I see him in person again. As for the Dan numbering system in WTSDA. The numbering began at 10000. All of the charter members kept their MDK Dan Bon in the WTSDA Dan numbering system. Then numbers were assigned based on testing. However, there are some free numbers reserved for people transferring into the WTSDA. This allows a higher ranking transfers to be given a number close to other members of their rank. Also, new transfers are expected to go through regular dan testing to set their appropriate rank in WTSDA. I do know that I have wondered for a long time if the Moo Duk Kwan Dan Bon record was truly sequential as some people seem to believe. I suspect it is very much like the WTSDA Dan Numbering. And lately there has been some discussion on Warrior Scholar Forum that would support this and more. Danny Dunn --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] [Eskrima] rotator cuff injuries (fwd) To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 08:28:24 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > i dont know if the "Ray" in this article was you Mr. Terry, but here is a > link to an article that i pretty much owe my complete recovery from a > partial tear of my rotator cuff as well as a tear of one of the other > muscles involved ( the infraspinatus ). i elected not to have surgery, and > after intensive rehab going on for about 5 months i was able to get back to > about 75% usage in my shoulder. Yep, it was me. Did lots of PT before and after the surgery. But... significant rotator cuff tears will not heal w/o surgery of some sort. I have significantly torn tendons in both shoulders. Surgery did the trick and I currently notice no problems. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Jared Circle" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 13:59:16 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] DoJang Facilites and Locations Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I am planning on opening a Dojang in the coming months. What type of facilities do the current school holders on this list reccomend? I am considering either a strip mall location or a free standing concrete construction facility. What other options for a school location have I missed? What are the pros and cons of the different types of facilities out there? What factors have proven to be the most beneficial of any location or type of facility? I know these are weighted questions, with various probable answers dependant upon what my aspirations are as a school owner. With this in mind, I would appreciate any amount of feedback on any of the questions I posed. My Thanks to Those of You Who Offer Your Advice J. Circle --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 15:24:21 -0500 From: Rudy Timmerman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Rotator Cuff Injuries Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Brian writes: > Inflammation > of muscles other than rotator cuff muscles can also mimic the symptoms > (although treatment probably won't vary that much from the rest/anti- > inflammatory stuff) Hello Brian: I had a shoulder injury some time ago, and I assumed it was the Rotator Cuff. I was wrong, and the rest/anti-inflammatory stuff I did actually caused my shoulder to "freeze". After a few weeks of this, it had gotten bad enough that I had trouble moving my arm to do simple stuff like combing hair and tucking my shirt in my pants. In other words, my arm was pretty much useless. It took a Physician to actually rip the "frozen" arm in order to get mobility back, and it took extensive rehab work to keep it from doing the same thing. Rest is often good, but sometimes it can cause more problems than you had to begin with. Bottom line is see a qualified Physician. Sincerely, Rudy --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:49:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] DoJang Facilites and Locations From: "Martin Von Cannon" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Let's see.... Have you considered using a local recreation center. If they have a big enough room, they work great. Some have mats, mirrors, and storage facialities for you. Students will have to register at the front desk and then you have an instant receptionist. If you work it right, you may even get them to pick up insurance. Just my opinion. -- Martin Von Cannon Instructor Tacoma, WA. Dojang A Black Belt is more than something you wear. It's more than something you earn. A Black Belt is something you become. > I am planning on opening a Dojang in the coming months. What type of > facilities do the current school holders on this list reccomend? I am > considering either a strip mall location or a free standing concrete > construction facility. What other options for a school location have I > missed? What are the pros and cons of the different types of facilities > out > there? What factors have proven to be the most beneficial of any location > or type of facility? > I know these are weighted questions, with various probable answers > dependant > upon what my aspirations are as a school owner. With this in mind, I > would > appreciate any amount of feedback on any of the questions I posed. > > My Thanks to Those of You Who Offer Your Advice > > J. Circle --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "DAVID WHEELER" To: Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 15:33:01 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Klaas Do you have a source for your cutting materials? David Wheeler --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest