Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 03:05:26 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #56 - 6 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on behemoth2.host4u.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 1900 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Mixing Martial arts (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 2. RE: hapkido ground techniques (CStovall@nucorar.com) 3. More Ground Questions (Brooke Thomas) 4. goals (J R Hilland) 5. Re: groundwork (Bruce Sims) 6. Happy New Year (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:11:36 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Mixing Martial arts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have just been lurking around and reading the post since my return from the Ko Dan Ja Shim Sa, but I had to respond to this. "9th dan TKD, 8th dan hapkido, 6th dan Judo" IMHO this is ridicules. For a person to mix martial arts styles has been going on for many years prior to the UFC. Bruce Lee did it in the 60's and 70's but he was not the first. Here is where I have a problem. To legitimately earn 8th dan can take a life time, to earn this high rank in 3 or more styles is impossible. I can understand a person who has earned a 5th or 6th dan to add to his technical ability by cross training. I do not believe cross training in a style earns you the right to adopt a rank. To earn a legitimate rank you have to humbly start as a beginner with a legitimate instructor and work very hard for years allowing yourself to adopt the philosophies, history, traditions, as well as learn the techniques. Differences in these areas is why there are different styles to begin with. Cross training is good, I myself do it. But legitimate rank in multiple systems (at least at 5th dan and higher is IMHO a play to impress new potential students, and shows a lack of humility) Don't be fooled. just because a person from TKD, Hapkido, Soo Bahk Do, or any other style can teach a few grappling techniques does not mean they are a Jujitsu 7th dan. JC --__--__-- Message: 2 From: CStovall@nucorar.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:53:10 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: hapkido ground techniques Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Mr. Hilland, I almost always like your posts and I tend to respect your views because I think they've been formed from years of experience and reflect some hard-won wisdom. But, in this case I think you're a tad off-base. If we can extend the term "fights" to include any and all physical assaults, then I would offer up the fact that the vast majority of the world's rape victims (mostly women) have been sexually assaulted after having been knocked down or forced to a prone/supine position on the ground. For this reason alone, I think we can put to bed the idea that fights only go to the ground when 10-year-old Judoka cage fighters are involved. Struggling on the ground is a common occurence during inter-personal combat...that's just the way it is. It's not something that came along with the invention of the UFC. I understand the hesitation to actively take a fight to the ground for a variety of reasons. Multiple opponent scenarios being the most glaring example. However, it seems a bit much to just dismiss ground fighting as something that "doesn't have to happen if you know what you're doing". I've been in and seen enough fights to know the folly of that mindset. Gravity has a way of disturbing the best laid plans. Just a modest sampling of my own hard-won wisdom. CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This email transmission contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the individual or entities named above. If this email was received in error or if read by a party which is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error or are unsure whether it contains confidential or privileged information, please immediately notify us by email or telephone. You are instructed to destroy any and all copies, electronic, paper or otherwise, which you may have of this communication if you are not the intended recipient. Receipt of this communication by any party shall not be deemed a waiver of any legal privilege of any type whatsoever as such privilege may relate to the sender. --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:59:18 -0800 (PST) From: Brooke Thomas To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] More Ground Questions Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. hilland- I'm directing this question to you as you has been kind enough to answer my posts. I certainly understand and agree that cage fighting isn't something that the average person takes self-defense classes for :-) I heard recently of a BJJ-style accomplished martial artist who got into a fight recently in a Santa Monica parking garage with 3 guys that beat him to a pulp... I am still curious about some of your ground techniques and I certainly am not asking you to name all of them...but I was wondering if you teach escapes from the mount such as bridge escapes or hip escapes...or escapes from side control or front control? I personally view these as useful techniques for smaller individuals needing ways to get larger individuals off of them? Do you teach any of these types of "defensive" ground techniques? Do you see any value in these techniques or have I failed as a Hapkidoist to find myself with some big dude on top of me? Thank you in advance for your reply. Brooke Thomas Hapkido Blend --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:22:25 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] goals Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I don't think it is not an issue of which side your one, it is more of - what are your goals? Some folks want to practice a little of everything, others really want to put all their energy into an art or two and really learn the whole art. Nothing wrong with either of these. But time will also change your goals. When I was younger, I cross-trained in everything I could get my hands on. In a University environment that was easy to do and I had the time. It was also great fun. But I also found out that I still preferred hapkido over everything else and that hapkido is a truly effective and comprehensive martial art. Jere R. Hilland, Fargo, ND www.HapkidoSelfDefense.com <<>> --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:32:33 -0800 (PST) From: Bruce Sims To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: groundwork Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "....When does ground fighting get taught in hapkido? It depends on the teacher. Students in hapkido traditional start out with zwaki and waki (defense from sitting, defense from lying down). Many of the chokes, locking and pining techniques, etc. are the same if the attacker is vertical or horizontal....." For us there is no "magic time" when some bit of information starts or stops. rather I have yellow belts in my sword class even though it is technically fourth dan material, so to speak. The point of assigning a rank is to say that one is accontable for knowing a body of information "by" a particular time. For instance, ground work is what is called "positions of disadvantage". Not only do we do things on the ground be we focus on grabs from all around, and the weapon that goes with this material is the cane. FWIW. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:28:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] Happy New Year Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Happy Lunar New Year! The year of the Rooster. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest