Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 15:23:56 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #176 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2000 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Technique retention through generations (James E. McHie Jr.) 2. Re: Trying this again.... (Bruce Sims) 3. reading at Barnard College, Tuesday April 26 (Ray) 4. Re: GreatGrandMaster Brenda Sells (tim walker) 5. Korean units of measure (Ray) 6. Extreme Martial Arts (Craig Zeigler) 7. health question (cha6671447@aol.com) 8. Re: Extreme Martial Arts (jakskru) 9. Austin Seminar (Braeswood Martial Arts) 10. Austin Seminar (Lloyd Martin) 11. Foreigner in CT (Chris LaCava) 12. Master West in Austin... (Jason Thomas (Y!)) 13. 3rd Annual NKMAA Hapkido Seminar (Christy Cory) 14. Teaching as you were taught (brent b) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 11:34:00 -0500 From: "James E. McHie Jr." To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Technique retention through generations Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Just a question out of curiosity for whoever wants to answer-- Is there any point at which there is a technique where you say "This is junk, just junk, and it doesn't work and it's not going to work and by teaching it to my students who might try to use it I am only going to get them hurt because they might try to defend themselves with it and they will get killed." In other words, is there *any* point at which you would consider dropping, or adding, a technique to your curriculum based on your perception of its efficiency? Perhaps you have seen many different types of students try to learn it without success in efficiency. Would you take the issue up with your own instructor? How tight is your teacher about the variances that appear in your learning to your teaching (because that occurs 100% of the time, you cannot avoid it)? I guess a purist would say "study harder, study longer" or perhaps look for a better instructor yourself if you can't seem to teach a technique in a way that any of your students seem to be able to use effectively, but I can't help but wonder if that is the right approach for everyone. I'm certainly not claiming any answers, just building off Ray's post about stuff that "works". Jim --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:59:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Bruce Sims To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Trying this again.... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Folks: The Hapkido arts have a history of employing Taoist breathing techniques as part and parcel of the development program. Among the various approaches there are rough and general similarities including the traditions of Myung, Ji, Suh and Kimm. What we don't have is background information about the sources of this material, objectives, either physical, psychological or spiritual and a definitive approach to execution across the arts. For instance we know some names of the sources but no in depth biographies. We know general guidelines for execution but not if there is an optimal method of execution. We know that the material is Taoist but not how it relates to the greater body of Taoist practices. here is some of the information I have culled from various places. 1.) There are development goals associated with the five methods of the KSW. These methods are published by Joo Bang Lee in his HWARANGDO (Vol 1) books. 2.) The traditions of KSW, HRD and HMD are roughly the same. The Ji/Myung traditon is a bit abbreviated in execution but the vectors for execution are vaguely the same. 3.) I have "Taoist Lee" as the source for Ji's material, and Monk Hae Dong for In Hyuk Suh. There is also the matter of Wang Tae Eui who apparently was not only a teacher of Praying Mantic but also a practitioner of Ship Pal Gi, so there is the possibility of Taoist traditions being introduced there. There are occasional comments about Choi Yong Sul teaching breathing but there are no breathing techniques espoused by DRAJJ--- though the Aikido folks have somethings that have come down to them through Shinto and Omote traditions. Anyone else? Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 11:29:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] reading at Barnard College, Tuesday April 26 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Forwarrding... For those of you who live in or near NYC, there is an upcoming reading that may be of interest: THE FORGOTTEN WAR'S NEWEST GENERATION: A READING and DISCUSSION SUSAN CHOI, author of The Foreign Student and American Woman and SUJI KWOCK KIM, author of Notes from the Divided Country TUESDAY, APRIL 26, 2004, 7pm Barnard College, Columbia University Barnard Hall, W. 117th/Broadway Sulzberger Parlor, 3rd Floor free admission Barnard College Forum on Migration, curated by Caryl Phillips Two Noted Korean Writers to Explore "The Forgotten War's Newest Generation" Novelist Susan Choi and poet Suji Kwock Kim, two members of the newest generation of Korean-American writers, will read and discuss selections from their work as part of Barnard's Forum on Migration. The event will take place on Tuesday, April 26 th at 7 p.m. in the Sulzberger Parlor on the 3 rd floor of Barnard Hall (W. 117th Street and Broadway), and is free and open to the public. Much of Choi's and Kim's work relates to their parents' experiences during the Korean War, the "Forgotten War" in which perhaps as many as four million Koreans died. For writers of their generation, coming to terms with this terrible past shapes their work; as Kim puts it in a recent poem: "what survives cannot survive unscathed, not fallen/ burr or shoot,/ not fists of spore or snarled taproot." SUSAN CHOI is the daughter of a Korean immigrant father whose life history inspired her first novel, THE FOREIGN STUDENT , which won the Asian-American Literary Award and the Steven Turner Award for a First Book of Fiction. Her second novel, AMERICAN WOMAN , was published by HarperCollins and was a finalist for the 2004 Pulitzer Prize. SUJI KWOCK's first book, NOTES FROM THE DIVIDED COUNTRY , won the NATION/ Discvoery Award, the Walt Whitman Award from the Academy of American Poets, and the Bay Area Book Reviewers Award, and was a finalist for the 2004 PEN Center USA Award and the Griffin International Poetry Prize. Her recent poems have appeared in The New York Times, The Los Angeles Times, Slate, The Nation, The New Republic, and National Public Radio. The Barnard Forum on Migration is a series of seminars, lectures, and readings that explore issues connected to the movement of people from one part of the world to another. The Forum on Migration is curated by Caryl Phillips, the Henry R. Luce Professor of Migration and Social Order. For more information, please contact Petra Tuomi, Barnard College Office of Public Affairs, (212) 854-7907. --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "tim walker" To: Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 14:33:05 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: GreatGrandMaster Brenda Sells Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net If Park, Hae Man is the one doing the recommending, then you can be sure that Ms. Sells has met the only qualification that counts to him...the application fee. My two cents. Tim Walker "Carpe Lucre" --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 11:44:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean units of measure Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net This means that I am 6.12 chok tall, by 20th Century standards. Ray FWIW... chok: In Korea, 20th century, a unit of length, standardized at = 10/33 meter. At approximately 11.930 inches, this is very close to a foot. In the 19th century, the chok was 7 3/4 inches, while that for building was 12 1/8 inches. ------------------------------------ pyong: Korea, 20th century, various units. Also romanized as pyung. 1 - A unit of volume used for firewood, 2 chok x 6 chok x 6 chok, (approximately 2.0035 cubic meters). 2 - A unit of volume used for gravel, 6 cubic chok (approximately 6.01 cubic meters). 3 - A unit of area used for tiles, approximately 3.3058 square meters (3.954 square yards). Sizes of apartments may be given in pyong. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 14:50:52 -0400 From: Craig Zeigler To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Extreme Martial Arts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Yesterday on the discovery channel, I noticed a program called Extreme Martial Arts in which they were showing a lot of detail on several aspects. I was just wondering if anyone else happened to see it, and if so, what were the impressions? I found the katana display, and description to be nicely detailed (for a TV show) and pretty well done. The katana has always been of particular interest to me. -Craig --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 15:17:09 -0400 From: cha6671447@aol.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] health question Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Does anyone out there know of anyone that has continued martial arts training (hapkido) with renal problems, f.s.g.s. to be specific. if so, how and what did they do to continue there training? how did the training affect them physically? Any suggestions and advice accepted. Thanks in advance. Chris tong jun mu sul --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "jakskru" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Extreme Martial Arts Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 16:04:01 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net yes, i saw it....it actually came out last year or the year before...for the most part i found it to be interesting, but that "XMA" stuff looks like a bunch of showy crap...gymnastics with some yelling and strikes, seems to be impractical for reality...thats why the 16 yr. old kid got 4th place and the other guy trying to "regain" his "sparring form" lost...did the show mention what competition that was? looked like it took place in a hotel lobby. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Zeigler" To: Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 2:50 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] Extreme Martial Arts > Yesterday on the discovery channel, I noticed a program called Extreme > Martial Arts in which they were showing a lot of detail on several --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 15:10:59 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Austin Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net THANK YOU MASTER WEST AND ALL THE MISSISSIPPI MUTANTS what a great weekend it was. Master Thomas as always was an exceptional host and the seminar was a huge success. Maybe next year the pool will be open of an after seminar swim:) Thanks to Tom Stanfield for being my partner and the shot to the ribs and the picture squeeze... I owe you one! Or maybe Don will take care of it for me in Korea :) hehe I wish all the USKMAF Black Belts headed to Korea in the next few weeks a safe and fun trip. Wish I could be with you, sounds like a great time will be had by all. Master West as always it was great to see you and Wayne... as well as reacquaint with one of your 2nd dahns and meet a new one (up close and personal). Kat --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 13:14:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Lloyd Martin To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Austin Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I too would like to thank Master West and his folks for a really painful day of twisting and choking. You continue to remind us all why step on the mat. I hope I can continue to get on the mat 15 or 20 years from now. Those of us at HKMA see and know every day what you and Master Hodder mean to us and this organization. Its OK for you two to keep training your replacements, but not time to go for a long while. For what thats worth. I would also like to thank Master Thomas for putting together a fantastic event. Looks to be a new annual thing for me. Tuan, I know you don't remember much of the ride home, but my favorite statement is " extra cheese?" If you can read this, good job. Oh, and there is no train in the car. Lloyd Martin --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Chris LaCava" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 16:16:46 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Foreigner in CT Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello everybody. I know I haven't posted a lot lately, but we just had a music thread and I could use help from anybody able to. The band that I am in is opening for the 70's-80's band Foreigner in Hartford, CT on June 3rd. I was a HUGE Foreigner fan and when I got this news I nearly fell off my chair. This is where the help comes in... There are two stages at this venue, the main stage (with Foreigner) and the second stage. In order to play on the main stage we have to sell tickets and the band who sells the most gets the Main stage with Foreigner. If anyone here is able to make the show or knows of anyone that might, I would highly appreciate if they could make it. If anyone can help, tickets are $27.50 each, but if you can help out I will give them to you for $20 each. Please contact me ASAP and we will work out the arrangements. Thanks Chris "from CT" P.S. I hate to beg, but Ray, PLEASE let this go through. Help a boy’s dream come true. :) My band's website - http://www.xitmusic.com/ LaCava's Martial Arts Westport, CT. http://lmaa.bravepages.com Online Store- http://www.cafepress.com/hapkidogear --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "Jason Thomas \(Y!\)" To: Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 15:20:21 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Master West in Austin... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I'd like to thank Master West and his team for coming out to Austin. We had some 45-50 participants who all had a great time. The stealth van crew did a great job, everyone got quality and personal instruction. This was easily the smoothest and easiest seminar we've ever hosted from an administrative perspective. Master West and his team are easy to work with; I'd highly recommend them to anyone looking to host a seminar in their area. Of course the Seminar would have been nothing with out the great support and participation by the attendees of the event. I'd like to thank everyone who traveled from the surrounding Texas Area's of Houston, San Antonio, and Dallas to support the event as well as our local Austinites. Everyone at the seminar was courteous, enthusiastic and willing to share and learn. It was a great experience. Until next time, Jason --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Christy Cory" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 20:50:24 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] 3rd Annual NKMAA Hapkido Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Huge thanks go to Grandmaster Rudy Timmerman and all of his students/associates for, as usual, they have delivered a very informative, interesting and entertaining seminar here in Brainerd, MN at DeWitt Martial Arts!  We were packed with students from our DoJang as well as DoJangs and "clubs" from all accross the North American continent!  I feel it is also important to mention the incredible welcome put out by Master Garrett DeWitt and all of the black belts and students of DeWitt Martial Arts.  I am so proud to be a member of this DoJang/family! We all had great fun learning new (and refining old) technique.  Weapons forms, and for the younger folks (in years, not in heart :-) Nak Bup.  We had folks from Canada, Tennessee, and different parts of Minnesota and Michigan. It was great fun to reconnect with old friends and make new ones! It is always a wonderful experience be around this bunch!  And we had the added benefit of 3 new instructors comming along with GrandMaster Timmerman this trip.  I feel they all deserve great praise as they are truly an asset!  I look forward to the next opportunity to train with you all!! Yours in pain, Christy :-) --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 13:59:15 -0700 (PDT) From: brent b To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Teaching as you were taught Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net George, I have a question - what happens when 'all the knowledge as it was taught' changes. I've seen this discussed on many forums and I do not fully understand it. The knowledge that your instructor has changes over time - period. This is a given. So someone taught when the master first started out is going to be taught completely differently than someone who starts out 10 years later, which will be different that the instruction someone receives 20 years later. I have friends who believe that they are being taught exactly what their instructors were taught. It's not happening. Two people can be shown the same technique the same day and 7 days later teach it completely differently. I've taught twins and had them then teach the technique to others. Completely different results. Martial arts are an individual experience. Once you've done them long enough you may be doing a style but if done correctly, it's your style. It may look like someone elses, but it's yours. Brent Balfanz From: "George Peters" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 00:14:39 -0400 Good Sir, In the org I belong to, one is obligated to transfer all knowledge as it was taught, it is one of the most sacred tasks of an instructor. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest