Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 16:06:16 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #382 - 13 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2000 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. The Point Sparring Training Problem (Dunn, Danny J GARRISON) 2. Last Chance for GM Ji Seminar (mccarty@hapkidojang.com) 3. Re: Padding and Pulling Punches (dean_lopez@houston-f-body.org) 4. Grandmaster Bok Man Kim (Master Lugo) 5. Trying to contact Mike Duffy (Jesse Segovia) 6. Grandmaster Bok Man Kim (Master Lugo) 7. Tae Kwon Do History (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 8. Bok Man Kim (J R Hilland) 9. Training Clarification (Bruce Sims) 10. What system? (Jye nigma) 11. Pro Hapkido Federation (Patrick L) 12. Re: Grandmaster Bok Man Kim (Christopher Spiller) 13. Re: Padding and Pulling Punches (Jye nigma) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 07:40:39 -0500 From: "Dunn, Danny J GARRISON" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] The Point Sparring Training Problem Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray and Craig, I agree that consistently training for point sparring is a bad thing. I have seen this happen as well. But point sparring is not the problem. IMO, instructors focusing their training on a game is the problem. Goes back to our often discussed reason for studying a martial art, self defense, sport, fitness, ect. Unfortunately, by the time a student realizes the difference it is too late. Danny Dunn >>>>>>>>> ... Unfortunately, many striking arts have been tainted by the "point > fighting" mentality and it shows in their training methods of choice. Ditto that. I spent years doing point style in Tang Soo Do. Then it took more years to break the bad habits that were developed. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com<<<<<<<<<<<< --__--__-- Message: 2 From: To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:14:32 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Last Chance for GM Ji Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net He was reluctant to schedule this seminar and explained that he would not guaruntee any seminar for next year. My feeling is that he will retire from doing the open Seminars and only teach his top students in an invitation only format. His students would then be responsible for furthering the art through open seminars. This is just my impression based on my discussions with GM Ji. I hope he continues because it would be a huge void in the Martial Arts world and more importantly Hapkido. > Message: 4 >From: "Sharon Tkach" > To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 15:33:30 -0700 > Subject: [The_Dojang] GM Ji seminar > Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > >>This could be one of the last opportunities to train with > Grandmaster Ji, Han Jae in an open forum with some of >his > top Sin Moo Hapkido Masters. < > > Why? Is he retiring or ? > > ~Sharon --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:35:31 -0500 From: dean_lopez@houston-f-body.org To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Padding and Pulling Punches Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Quoting Jye nigma : > But still, hitting hard isn't the same as following through. > Sometimes hitting hard isn't enough and you have to have that follow > through force. > > Jye Perhaps not, but I did accidently break one of my classmate's jaw during sparring... It was a freak accident where I was aiming for his chest, and he ducked at the same time when I connected. The point is, I wasn't trying to hit hard, but it was still hard enough to break a jaw? Lucky for me, my classmate realized I wasn't trying to hurt him, and we are still on great terms, and have even sparred again since. I am sure now that the fear of injuring a friend is what makes me concentrate extra hard on my control to the point where I **DON'T** spar like I would fight. In a real fight, I have no worries that I would hit hard enough and follow through. Fortunately, I've not even been close to being in a real fight to find out. But, like I said, that's just my experience. JKN Dean --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: 19 Sep 2005 15:37:30 -0000 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: "Master Lugo" Subject: [The_Dojang] Grandmaster Bok Man Kim Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Gm Bok Man Kim stated to me that he is not a member of Jidokwan, yet I saw tons of pictures with him involved in Jidokwan events. He might be the same person but he will never state that, I do not know why. As for him not being mentioned in the modern history of Taekwondo I have no idea why either, but I can tell you that if you purchase his book CHUN KUHN DO you will see picture proof of his involvement in the early stage of Taekwondo from 1950's to 1970's. You can view pictures of him with General Choi in 1959, at the CID 1966, Hong Kong 1967, Nationa Armed Force Taekwondo training 1957, the ROK 1956, Jidokwan events and tons more! If you go to his website CHUNKUHNDO.COM you can view a video from 1970. Message: 5 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Grandmaster Bok Man Kim To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 19:31:01 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I find mention of a KIM Bok Nam, an early graduate of the Ji Do Kwan. But no mention of a KIM Bok Man in the Modern History of Taekwondo. Could they perhaps be one in the same with a slight name change once arriving in the US? Just curious... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:34:25 -0400 From: Jesse Segovia To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Trying to contact Mike Duffy Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Apologies in advance, but I'm trying to reach Mike Duffy, a Hanmudo Blackbelt most recently based in New Hampshire. He lived (and trained in Taekwondo) in the Boston area in the '90s, then moved out to Colorado for a couple of years where I believe he began Hanmudo training, and then returned to NH a couple of years ago. The email addresses I have for him, the most recent one which includes the word jiabsul, don't seem to work. Feel free to send any responses directly to me at jsegovia@mindspring.com. Thanks in advance. Jesse --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: 19 Sep 2005 15:40:27 -0000 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: "Master Lugo" Subject: [The_Dojang] Grandmaster Bok Man Kim Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have no idea who wrote that, my guess it was one of his students. If you like go to his website CHUNKUHNDO.COM and email him. He might be able to address any corrections that need to be done. Lugo Message: 4 Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 19:36:04 -0500 From: Dennis McHenry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Grandmaster Bok Man Kim Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "Tae Kwon Do is considered one of the oldest martial arts in the world estimated at over 2,000 years old. ?.. the efforts of Bok Man Kim, a 10th Degree black belt who has pioneered the international development of traditional Tae Kwon Do. ?. Black Belt magazine once called him the "father" of Tae Kwon Do In 1941, at age 7, Bok Man Kim was introduced to the ancient Korean foot- fighting techniques of To-San, forerunner of Tae Kwon Do." OK, so if TKD is over 2000 years old, and GM Bok Man Kim was called the "father" of TKD, has pioneered the development of TKD, and he was training in techniques that were the forerunner of TKD, that makes GM Bok Man Kim over 2000 years old, doesn't it? --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 12:09:15 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Tae Kwon Do History Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Can anyone refer me to the mention of the name Tae Kwon Do older than 50 years or so. I single legitamate history book, or historical document. JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 13:26:58 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Bok Man Kim Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Yes there were many errors in that article from Florida about Master Kim Bok Man, but as taekwondo was founded the decade you and I were born by General Choi, I don't feel a year over 1000! :) <<>> JRH www.rrhapkido.com www.hapkidoselfdefense.com --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 12:45:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Bruce Sims To: Ray Terry Subject: [The_Dojang] Training Clarification Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Lorne et al: Thanks to you and everyone for the responses to my suggestion. Just one small clarification so that people understand what I am advocating. In training my students, I, too, use target mitts and kicking shields for accuracy and power respectively. What I was advocating with the hogu and headgear was the chance to adapt to a target with more Human contours and mobility. I am not saying that I would suit-up and then duck/bob/weave all over the mat. Rather, I would move about the mat at a slow or medium speed that would require the student to acquire his targets and re-focus on a moment-by-moment basis, thus narrowing the window of opportunity for any given technique significantly. If people had already guessed at this goal, please excuse my belaboring the point. Thoughts? Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 13:01:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net, itf-taekwondo@yahoogroups.com Subject: [The_Dojang] What system? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ok party people hears a question even the lurkers can answer.... what system of martial art have you not sparred against yet that you would like to? Jye --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Patrick L" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:01:31 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Pro Hapkido Federation Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Mr. Scianna, If this is the group that is headed by Whong In-Sik, then I have a nodding aquaintence with them. They are serious MA - but include/prefer? ground grappling in their Hapkido. GM Whong In-Sik is a very tough MA, and has a long career in HKD. I know nothing of the politics, format, or agenda of the organization. Sincerely, Patrick >From: mark scianna To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: The_Dojang digest, the Pro Hapkido Federation Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Have any of you Hapkido guys heard of the Pro Hapkido Federation? Is it a recomendible org? Mark S WKSW< --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 15:31:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Spiller To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Grandmaster Bok Man Kim Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >>I find mention of a KIM Bok Nam, an early graduate of the Ji Do Kwan. But no mention of a KIM Bok Man in the Modern History of Taekwondo. Could they perhaps be one in the same with a slight name change once arriving in the US? Just curious... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com<< Who knows. COuld be something as simple as a typo. Kim, Bok Man was an early pioneer of Taekwon-Do with the ITF. He also published a book called _Practical Taekwon-Do_ which I saw some years ago. I think it's out of print now, but from what I remember it was a very good text. Taekwon, Chris __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 16:11:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Padding and Pulling Punches To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Not taking anything away from you....sure using just basic motions can cause damage to a weak area but the difference is he wasn't coming at you with the intent to kill you. What that means is sometimes pure adrenanline (sp?) could make your attacker still continue to try and kill you and then you have shear will. If you are determined to kill the person next to you, believe it or not that intense concentration will carry you through pain. prime example a guy in the UFC got his arm broken and still continued to fight and win...I always give this example of power.... Think of a water hose spitting out a stream of water against a board. when the water hits the board it stops and splatters. Now think of a stream of water that hits the board and goes straight threw it. Now substitute the stream of water with energy. One is what I refer to as a shocking energy which shocks the target, and the other is penetrating which penetrates the target. there are times when a strike that shocks is all you need and there are times when penetration is needed. Now what's the realistic application of a shocking strike (one that disperses on the surface)? a speed break. have a board dangling from a string and you hit it quick enough to break it. The energy hits the surface and stops at the surface. Now a penetrating strike (one that penetrates either with follow through or chi)a multiple board break where the energy continues going and the tool goes through the target. Can you stop someone in their tracks with a shock strike? yep...but it depends on a lot of variables. I used a shocking strike to strike the chest with an open palm, and it most definitely stopped the brother in his tracks...penetrating strike may have killed him. The best way to see the difference in striking is to cross hands with other systems. Have a bout with a thai boxer and that will tell the tail. Jye dean_lopez@houston-f-body.org wrote: Perhaps not, but I did accidently break one of my classmate's jaw during sparring... It was a freak accident where I was aiming for his chest, and he ducked at the same time when I connected. The point is, I wasn't trying to hit hard, but it was still hard enough to break a jaw? Lucky for me, my classmate realized I wasn't trying to hurt him, and we are still on great terms, and have even sparred again since. I am sure now that the fear of injuring a friend is what makes me concentrate extra hard on my control to the point where I **DON'T** spar like I would fight. In a real fight, I have no worries that I would hit hard enough and follow through. Fortunately, I've not even been close to being in a real fight to find out. But, like I said, that's just my experience. JKN Dean __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest