Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2005 03:01:42 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #456 - 13 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2000 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: nkmaa promotions (Thomas Gordon) 2. Re: Hapkiyusool? (aburrese@aol.com) 3. Re: Pre-war Aikido? (aburrese@aol.com) 4. Garrison's Hapkido (firstpe315@aol.com) 5. NKMAA Promotions (Kevin Janisse) 6. Re: Re: Pre-war Aikido? (Ray) 7. Re: NKMAA Promotions (Thomas Gordon) 8. Re: Re: Pre-war Aikido? (Thomas Gordon) 9. Pre-war Aikido? (Hapkidoman5@wmconnect.com) 10. Re: Garrison's Hapkido (Kevin F. Donohue) 11. site (jakskru) 12. Re: Garrison's Hapkido (Ray) 13. Re: NKMAA Promotions (Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 11:50:41 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] nkmaa promotions From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master Miner, Interesting about the reasons you joined NKMAA. I started looking for a different organization when the one I belonged to decided to tie upper dahn advancement in with annual head count of students testing. I was told that I would need 1200 students testing per year to in order to be granted permission to test for fourth degree. To be clear, my students students counted. So if I had a student who opened a school and tested 100 people every other month and I tested a 100 people every other month, then I’d meet the minimum head count for testing. For further clarification, I was later told that I was mistaken or misinformed; it was testing for fifth degree with that requirement. LOL! Okay, whatever…still a head count and the accounting department is authorizing testing before the “real” testing board ever gets to see us. Sajanim Timmerman has never demanded anything of the nature. Warm regards, Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 11:13:09 -0500 From: aburrese@aol.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Hapkiyusool? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ".....http://www.hapkiyoosool.com/video/hapkido_demo.wmv...." I am not commenting on the effectiveness of the art or the skill of the practioner in the demo. I did note that the attacker always appear to use the same attack (single reverse lunge punch), is this normal in demos? Kindest Regards Slane ************************************** I don't want to get into the "is it hapkiyoosool or not" debate, however, I will comment that it was different from the Hapkido that I do. But then, I do Hapkido, not hapkiyoosul. One thing I did not like was how the person would go down on both knees quite often, and his feet were flat as he was down there. It is very, very rare that I ever have both knees down, and with each example where he did have both knees on the ground, I would never have been like that, but would have had one knee down and one up. (and a knee pinning some part of your opponents body to the ground is considered down, so the other should be up.) I also always have what we call live toes. I never have the top of my foot flat on the mat like in this clip. I know GM West teaches this same way, because we discussed it one time in Jackson and he went over to a person who had his foot flat on the floor and step on it. And I'm not saying my way is better, just different. Maybe there are reasons to drop to both knees like that, and to not have live toes, but the way my instructors taught me, and the way I teach, we do not do that. One of the primary reasons is you can get back up so much faster if you only have one knee down and have live toes. Your mobility, etc. is so much faster this way. Just my two cents on the clip. BTW - I've enjoyed watching the clips that were posted. Thanks! Yours in Training, Alain www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 11:15:50 -0500 From: aburrese@aol.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Pre-war Aikido? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Pre-war Aikido? There is no such thing. Yes? Ray Terry ****************************** Wouldn't pre-war Aikido actually be Takeda Sensei's Aikijujitsu? The art named Aikido was not named till later, correct? Alain www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 12:36:19 -0500 From: firstpe315@aol.com To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Garrison's Hapkido Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray wrote: (Pre-war Aikido...there is no such thing. Yes?) No. Jeff Alright, I'll stop being a smart-ass. The idea is very simple. Ueshiba's Aikido changed dramatically after his infusion of spirituality which was very much influenced by his exposure to the Omoto-Kyo religion. His style of Budo and Aikido was much more akin to DRAJJ. This harder-style form of Aikido was made most popular by Gozo Shioda and is called Yoshinkan Aikido. There are several other practitioners of a harder style of Aikido however than just this line. However, take it form a ranked Aikido man, and somebody who has done a lot of Aikido with others, you will understand the difference when you see it and feel it. J --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Kevin Janisse" To: Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 09:44:12 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] NKMAA Promotions Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master's Gordon and Miner, I am glad you enjoyed this past weekend with us. Yes it was a great time. It is great to see people of low and high ranks testing together and earning their advancement. It is great to see Martial Artists of various styles coming together in a non-political enviroment to better their skills and understanding. There is one example I need to mention and that is of Frank KSN who tested and passed to Secong Degree. This man again executed the challenge course which included scaling the 12 ft wall after performing his test the day before. To some this may not sound difficult but at 69 years old my deepest respect goes out to this man. Sincerely, Kevin Janisse NKMAA --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pre-war Aikido? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 12:32:45 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Pre-war Aikido? There is no such thing. Yes? > > Ray Terry > ****************************** > > Wouldn't pre-war Aikido actually be Takeda Sensei's Aikijujitsu? The art > named Aikido was not named till later, correct? Right. Aikido was born c1943. As I recall, prior to that Ueshiba called what he taught Aikibudo. Film footage of him during these years shows a very different looking and acting (and much younger) martial artist. He is build like a fireplug, very powerful. And doesn't use any of the "I wave my hand and fourteen people fall down" techniques. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:13:52 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] NKMAA Promotions From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master Janisse, That 12' wall is no joke! I took a good look at it while visiting with you and Sajanim at his home. No ladders in eyesight either! Mr. Frank did well with what I saw him do around the dojang. Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:14:40 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pre-war Aikido? From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net "He is build like a fireplug, very powerful. And doesn't use any of the 'I wave my hand and fourteen people fall down' techniques." Well.....do you think he was ever able to overcome this shortcoming and develop that part... LOL! Joking....juusssst joking. Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Hapkidoman5@wmconnect.com Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:07:51 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Pre-war Aikido? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sirs aikido did change from its origin and had atleast three different names before aikido.I have footage of early aikido and it was more DRAJJ ,Ueshiba did everthing he could do to get into the war as it was his duty because of his lineage being ,warrior class.Later he he had a revalation where he described his garden splitting open and golden beams of light from heaven ,during this experience is when he claims to have come to realize budo was a vehicle for peace and love to spread throughout the world through martial arts,and of course this was after the war when japan was occupied ans war torn and trying to rebuild out of the ruble. carter --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2005 00:39:46 -0500 From: "Kevin F. Donohue" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Garrison's Hapkido Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net O-Sensei claims to have taught Aikido at Japan's Naval Accademy as early as 1927 or 1928. So Aikido did exist as an art before WWII. Kevin F. Donohue firstpe315@aol.com wrote: >Ray wrote: > >(Pre-war Aikido...there is no such thing. Yes?) > >No. > >Jeff > > >Alright, I'll stop being a smart-ass. The idea is very simple. Ueshiba's Aikido changed dramatically after his infusion of spirituality which was very much influenced by his exposure to the Omoto-Kyo religion. His style of Budo and Aikido was much more akin to DRAJJ. This harder-style form of Aikido was made most popular by Gozo Shioda and is called Yoshinkan Aikido. There are several other practitioners of a harder style of Aikido however than just this line. However, take it form a ranked Aikido man, and somebody who has done a lot of Aikido with others, you will understand the difference when you see it and feel it. > >J >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2000 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "jakskru" To: Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2005 01:18:12 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] site Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net i came across this site today-----pretty interesting and detailed...i recommend all to visit it, but it takes some time to navigate the site as there is alot of material presented there... http://www.gthapkido.org/ --__--__-- Message: 12 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Garrison's Hapkido To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 22:19:34 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > O-Sensei claims to have taught Aikido at Japan's Naval Accademy as early > as 1927 or 1928. So Aikido did exist as an art before WWII. I'm sure that Ueshiba taught his martial art there and else where, but he was not calling it Aikido prior to 1942 (or 1943). Prior to that he used the terms Aikibudo or Aikinomichi. But then a rose by any other name... Lots of good info @ aikidofaq.com and also aikidojournal.com. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 13 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] NKMAA Promotions To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 23:15:49 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > That 12' wall is no joke! I took a good look at it while visiting with > you and Sajanim at his home. No ladders in eyesight either! Mr. Frank > did well with what I saw him do around the dojang. Wall climbing is also something that Gm Ji has as part of Sin Moo. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest