Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 03:01:46 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #462 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2000 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. The Role of Pain in Hapkido (Timmy Sr. Kearney) 2. RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido (Chris LaCava) 3. Re: The Role of Pain in the Hapkido Arts (jakskru) 4. Dept of Butt-whoopin' (Ray Terry) 5. http://ustu.org/86.htm (Ray Terry) 6. 5th International Friendship Taekwondo Chip (Ray Terry) 7. http://www.acuxo.com/meridians.asp (Ray Terry) 8. RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido (michael tomlinson) 9. RE: RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido (michael tomlinson) 10. Re: RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido (Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Timmy Sr. Kearney" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 09:13:20 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] The Role of Pain in Hapkido Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I explain to my students that when doing wrist techniques,if no pain is felt,the technique isn't being done properly.I also explain the idea of controlled pain,where you can control the amount of pain you want your partner to feel. As soon as the person doing the technique yells,their apponent goes with the technique and does the breakfall.The differences between doing techniques in the dojang,and doing them in real life on the street is also explained. Master Tim Kearney --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Chris LaCava" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 08:15:02 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce: <> I agree with Bruce in that we all must learn to deal with some pain and discomfort when we train in Hapkido or any other art. This is no different than life itself. Bruce:<< My partner and I learn to tolerate a certain level of discomfort. Each of us has an "ace-in-the-hole" which is, at the last minute, jumping with the technique to alleviate the pain. But this is a last resort. My partner is not "throwing" me, and I don't want to get in the habit of just jumping each time he does the technique. I should feel "compelled" to jump, right? If we are working together well, my partner ought to be able to really whip the technique on me as hard as he wants to and I, if needing to, can jump with the technique at the last second to save my joint.>> I don’t necessarily agree here though. The partner’s body should already be in a position for the takedown without having to jump. What I mean by that is… At our dojang, “the entry” is the most important aspect of any technique. It is this entry that will deal with, 1) a resistant partner and 2) a partner who has no clue what is coming at them. The entry uses body movement and positioning to take advantage of the limitations of the human body. Please note that approx 90% these entries are not done with strikes. So in practice, all techniques are done with resistance to some degree depending on the student’s skill level. The performance of the entry will decide whether or not you can even get to the technique intended while also putting your partner’s body into an off balanced position. …so when the technique is applied no one jumps with it, they will be ¾ of the way there already. People find it fascinating to do this on a resistant opponent. Just my $.02 Happy Thanksgiving Chris “from CT” LaCava's Martial Arts Westport, CT. http://lmaa.bravepages.com Online Store- http://www.cafepress.com/hapkidogear --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "jakskru" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] The Role of Pain in the Hapkido Arts Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 11:44:16 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net couldn't agree more...both partners take something away from ths, the uke learns to go with technique, learns what the action feels like, and gets his/her body resistant/toughened to deal with pain. the torre learns the technique and the proper execution, and should be learning control in the dojang, but occasionally it is good to get the full go of a technique so he/she can see it really work. if we are too soft on each other, then as bruce said, we perform soft when it is for real. i kind of recall a story of someone that was in a fight with a BJJ guy (it was on the ground), the BJJ man started to apply an armbar when the other combatant just tapped him like in the dojang....needless to say, the BJJ guy let go and the fight ended up continuing when it should have been over....don't know who won though.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce Sims" To: "Ray Terry" Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 9:25 AM Subject: [The_Dojang] The Role of Pain in the Hapkido Arts > Dear Folks: > > I guess this is another of those area where people are going to have to agree to disagree. However I do think that there is a misunderstanding about the role of Pain in the Hapkido Arts--- or maybe I should call it "pain management", yes? --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 11:56:47 -0800 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Dept of Butt-whoopin' Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Putting the 'liberal' in liberal arts JoongAng Daily November 25, 2005 ¤Ñ If majoring in philosophy gives a student all the skills he needs to cope with his impending poverty, what kind of skills does a student majoring in pure love learn? How about a major in magic? Mixed martial arts? Motor sports, health diets, "make-up coordinator" or barrista sciences? College is indeed getting weird, and for good reason: weird majors attract students. Unconventional departments not only allow schools to offer their students more choices, but also enable the schools to build reputations for themselves in educational niches. Doing so might attract criticism ¡ª students do, after all, face a tough job market ¡ª but Lee Seung-ju, the spokesman of the Korean Council for College Education, said that majors that appear frivolous might be needed sooner than people realize. It might be that the tough job market is encouraging students to look into more eccentric professions. The youth unemployment rate stood at 7.2 percent as of last month, and the Federation of Korean Industries has issued statements decrying the difficulty of finding talented college graduates who can immediately enter the workforce. But if there's a pure love industry, it must be ecstatic. [snip] Department of Butt-whoopin' Kyungbuk College of Science is also offering a major in a sport that's rapidly becoming popular in Korea: mixed martial arts, better known as K-1 in Japan. The school's Division of Leisure Sports and Recreation started offering the major this year. Eighty student have so far signed up. "Mixed martial arts, including K-1 and PRIDE Fighting Championships, have been popular in other countries like Japan, the States and Russia for the last 10 years," said Hong Young-kyu, professor of the department. "Korea is a bit behind." "Noting that K-1 is a mixture of various martial arts, the school thought that it would be good to have such a major," Mr. Hong added. The problem is that there are not many experts in K-1. Mr. Hong is just one of a small number of professors who can teach martial arts, having studied it for about 15 years. He teaches Brazilian jiujitsu and Russia's combat sambo style. The school also teaches Thai and Japanese kick-boxing in addition to taekwondo and hapkido, both of which are Korean martial arts. [snip] --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 15:41:12 -0800 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] http://ustu.org/86.htm Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net USA Taekwondo 2006 memberships online now at: http://ustu.org/86.htm --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 15:48:04 -0800 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] 5th International Friendship Taekwondo Chip Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net 5th International Friendship Taekwondo Championship Oregon Convention Center 777 NE Martin Luther King Jr. Blvd Portland, OR 97232 April 21-22, 2006 Contact: Scott Stickle, 1.503.820.2234 http://www.IOFTC.org --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 16:03:34 -0800 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] http://www.acuxo.com/meridians.asp Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Good resource. http://www.acuxo.com/meridians.asp --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] The Role of Pain in Hapkido Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 02:39:10 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net sounds good to me Tim...bottom line IMHO is that you have to train much in the way you will fight...or in other words, you will automatically fight the way you train...so train hard, smart, and things will be good... Michael Tomlinson >From: "Timmy Sr. Kearney" >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >Subject: [The_Dojang] The Role of Pain in Hapkido >Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 09:13:20 -0400 > >I explain to my students that when doing wrist techniques,if no pain is >felt,the technique isn't being done properly.I also explain the idea of >controlled pain,where you can control the amount of pain you want your >partner to feel. As soon as the person doing the technique yells,their >apponent goes with the technique and does the breakfall.The differences >between doing techniques in the dojang,and doing them in real life on the >street is also explained. > > > >Master Tim Kearney >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2000 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 02:59:39 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Chris writes: The entry uses body movement and positioning to take advantage of the limitations of the human body. Please note that approx 90% these entries are not done with strikes. So in practice, all techniques are done with resistance to some degree depending on the student’s skill level. The performance of the entry will decide whether or not you can even get to the technique intended while also putting your partner’s body into an off balanced position. …so when the technique is applied no one jumps with it, they will be ¾ of the way there already. People find it fascinating to do this on a resistant opponent.----- Agreed Chris, the entry is the thing...good entry with proper body position and technique and you nulifythe bail outs as we call them...no time or opportunity to "pull the ripcord" as we also say..your oponents body is in a positon to not be able to compensate in time for the techniques that are already coming....I also like the part that Doju Nim Ji teaches and I'm pretty sure you have felt it...where you do the joint lock in close and very low and tight to the body....he demonstrated this on me once with an outward wrist break or a koto gaeshi...I think that is how you spell it in the aikido speak, if not I apologize to my aikido friends... Doju Nim Ji throws me with a big circle keeping my hand up high and says no pain right...and I'm all proud of myself for the big aerial I pulled off and say no pain...then he tells everyone "wrong way to do technique", and then he says I'm gonna do it right way...no fall....I'm thinking in my head...get ready...here it comes and I'm gonna do the big demo jump circle fall....wrong!! He walks through the technique as he keeps my wrist in tight and close to his body, my wrist didn't even go above my belt level as he did the technique...as I crumple to the ground my back made a big woof noise when it hit the mat and he eased up on my wrist right before it broke..when I looked up he was right over me very low in his stance..he smiled at me and said..."do you understand, no fall,, very painful".. dude it was like a shot going through my head...I totally understood what he meant...then I start thinking DAMN...the falling is really not in Hapkido at all...if you know the next level of Hapkido like he does...then the techniques don't allow for a fall at all...if the body position and small circles and arcs are there you just crumple....BUT...if you practice like this all the time..no one would be healthy enough to come back....so I explain it and do it,, but not 100 percent of the time because as Doju Nim Ji said to me...very painful!! Shoot...too painfu, but it is awesome! Michael Tomlinson --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] RE: The Role of Pain in Hapkido To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 19:45:55 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > circles and arcs are there you just crumple....BUT...if you practice like > this all the time..no one would be healthy enough to come back....so I > explain it and do it,, but not 100 percent of the time because as Doju Nim > Ji said to me...very painful!! Shoot...too painfu, but it is awesome! As he would frequently say with a big smile... "Hurt?!? Hurt!?!?!? This... Hapkido." Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest