Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 13:57:28 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #487 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2000 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. RE: New ATA credit card (Rick Clark) 2. Re: New ATA credit card (Dave Zapencki) 3. Sparring (Stovall, Craig) 4. New ATA credit card (Stovall, Craig) 5. Professional martial artists (Burdick, Dakin Robert) 6. Re: New ATA credit card (Dante) 7. Re:Crisis in Taekwondo (Tkdsid@aol.com) 8. Re: Sparring (Trenton Carmon) 9. RE: New ATA credit card (Thomas Gordon) 10. MASS (Thomas Gordon) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 07:27:07 -0500 From: "Rick Clark" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Good lord - you have to give ATA credit - or (forgive me) they are making sure people get credit - somebody in that organization is making a TON of money. I did notice one thing when I was looking at the web site for the ATA, and it talked about its history. It did not have anything about H Lee being a member of Son Duk Son's group (World Tae Kwon Do Association) back in the 60's nor that before founding the ATA he had a group out of Iowa called the MTA - Mid-West Tae Kwon Do Association. The patch for the MTA looked exactly the same as the current ATA patch. The only difference was an "M" for an "A". Rick Clark www.ao-denkou-kai.org >-----Original Message----- >From: Ray [mailto:rterry@idiom.com] >Subject: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card > >New Support Kicks in for American Taekwondo Association with >New Credit Card from U.S. Bank > >MINNEAPOLIS & LITTLE ROCK, Ark.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Dec. 14, >2005--Students of American Taekwondo will get a boost with the >introduction of the new American Taekwondo Association Visa(R) credit >card from U.S. Bank. --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Dave Zapencki" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 07:07:49 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net And you can max your new card out with all your ATA fees... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray" To: "The_Dojang" Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 10:09 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card > New Support Kicks in for American Taekwondo Association with > New Credit Card from U.S. Bank > > MINNEAPOLIS & LITTLE ROCK, Ark.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Dec. 14, > 2005--Students of American Taekwondo will get a boost with the > introduction of the new American Taekwondo Association Visa(R) credit > card from U.S. Bank. The card generates support for the association > each time a new card is activated and repeatedly thereafter each time > the card is used. > > "Our mission is to provide students with the highest quality martial > arts instruction available in a safe and positive learning environment > that people of all ages can enjoy," said Jim Wolff, chief executive > officer of the American Taekwondo Association. "The support generated > through this card will help us provide an even greater learning > environment for all who participate." > > The American Taekwondo Association credit card depicts the colors of > the ATA and a taekwondo silhouette. The card features no annual fee, a > low introductory rate (APR) and a choice of rewards including cash back > or points redeemable for merchandise, travel, gift certificates or > virtually any reward with the Choose Your Own Reward option. > > "We are thrilled to issue the only credit card that supports the sport > of taekwondo, and we look forward to a long relationship with this > highly respected organization," said Tanya Turner, senior vice > president of affinity products at U.S. Bank. > > More information on the American Taekwondo Association visit > www.ataonline.com. > > The American Taekwondo Association (ATA) is the premier North American > organization dedicated to the martial arts discipline of taekwondo, and > is the founding organization of other international affiliates that > include the World Traditional Taekwondo Union (WTTU) and the Songahm > Taekwondo Federation (STF). Counting both the United States and > worldwide, ATA organizations have more than 1,500 licensed schools and > clubs, and is beginning to register more than 300,000 members. The ATA > has been changing lives through Songahm Taekwondo since the first > student walked into an ATA classroom in 1969. Now, the ATA is close to > reaching the unthinkable, "Changing One Million Lives!" > > U.S. Bancorp (NYSE:USB), with $207 billion in assets, is the 6th > largest financial holding company in the United States. The company > operates 2,411 banking offices and 4,999 ATMs in 24 states, and > provides a comprehensive line of banking, brokerage, insurance, > investment, mortgage, trust and payment services products to consumers, > businesses and institutions. U.S. Bancorp is home of the Five Star > Service Guarantee in which the company pays customers if certain key > banking benefits and services are not met. U.S. Bancorp is the parent > company of U.S. Bank. Visit U.S. Bancorp on the web at www.usbank.com. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2000 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:16:16 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Sparring Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Ummmmm, I didn't think that they sparred in Aikido. And even if they did spar what large crowds are going to be watching? <<>> Yes, buy a Bowflex. When the Bowflex arrives don't take it out of the box. Just pick up the box and walk around your block with it as many times as you can. You'll get the best workout of your life. Also, you can tie a rope to the box and drag it like a weighted sled. Bowflex rules!!! Craig187 --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:20:57 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Ok, I have a serious question. Here goes. HAVE THESE PEOPLE LOST THEIR FRIGGING MINDS!?!?!?!!? That is all. Craig "Bringing Joy and Levity to Your Holiday Season" Stovall --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 09:40:56 -0500 From: "Burdick, Dakin Robert" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Professional martial artists Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Chuck wrote: "I fully and completely agree with the concept that a professional martial artist should be able to make a comfortable living by teaching." I've actually come to the belief that very few professional martial artists can actually make a comfortable living by teaching. My favorite schools are almost all run as a sideline -- the instructor has a real job (fireman, professor, construction business, engineer, etc.) and teaches for the love of the art. Professional instructors, unless they have a fantastic personal reputation they can trade upon, or an affiliation with a large organization or corporation, have to bite the bullet and do the McDojang thing. They have to bring in money, they have to prepare for retirement, and they have to reduce liability considerably. Over half of their money will come from kids, and that raises new issues. 1. Most of those kids will be there because of their parents (ie. "teach little Jimmy some discipline, would you?"), not because the martial arts will be their life. 2. Often the kids will be put at risk because most instructors do not take good enough care of them. That is: a. Too much breaking: Bones keep growing until 16 or so, and you can stunt your kid's growth by compressing the ends of the bone with too much breaking. And if you get some of the instructors I've seen, your kid will also break a couple bones trying to break four boards when they only weigh 90 pounds. b. Contraindicated exercises: A lot of people teach the "traditional" warm-ups and exercises, a lot of which have been superceded by modern methodologies. c. Emphasis on cool moves leads to higher injury rate: In TKD for example, people are going a lot of high air kicks. That will turn the cartilage in their knees to mush, wear holes in their hips, and wear out their lower backs. Too many high amplitude falls as a kid isn't going to help anyone either. d. Moral training & role modeling: A lot of people advertise it, but I set pretty high standards for my kids and most instructors do not have the background to teach history and philosophy of the arts beyond the most surface level. When setting a role model for my kids, I want them to associate with people who are successes outside the martial arts as well as in it. e. Possibility of abuse: We see these notices all the time in the news and in the Dojang_Digest. Professional martial arts instructors frequently have only a high school education, don't make much money, and when they are placed in a position of great authority as the "master," respected and feared by all their students, it can easily go to their heads. It is not a very healthy teacher-student relationship. It is very easy for an instructor to get way in over their heads, go too far, and end up with a ruined career or jail sentence. I'm not just talking about sexual abuse, although of course that is out there and we all know it, but also the various head games that sufferers of blackbeltitis or masteritis play with their students. I should, by the way, mention that I'm a pretty big nerd, and that my standards for educators is pretty high (I'm an instructional consultant by trade). I have both of my kids take piano, and my son takes swimming and my daughter does ballet and skating. My kids take piano with doctoral candidates at IU's School of Music, and their instructors have all had piano pedagogy training at the university level. The ballet is taught by ballet faculty at the School of Music, so ditto. The training at the YMCA is not nearly as good, but my kids love it, so we do it anyways. My son (now 9) trains with me occasionally in either wrestling or sticking hands, and we'll probably start fencing together in a few years. So we just keep it fun, and don't do the whole belt thing. Since I jumped up on the soapbox too, I should make some suggestions as to how professional martial artists could improve their situation: 1. Learn about current sports pedagogical theory, and current training methods, either through a local college or university, or by bringing in consultants and/or master instructors for a day or two. 2. If you use mass marketing techniques, perhaps include scholarships for needy students as well. 3. Instead of a black belt program, have an instructor training program for your most promising and/or dedicated students (once per month perhaps), and don't charge for it. If they teach at your school, either pay them or let them train for free. If they want to open their own school, set up a franchise system. 4. Establish a closed-door class where instructors at your school train with you to improve their skills and yours at the highest level. Do this once per week so you can heal the rest of the week. :) Take care, Dakin Burdick dakinburdick@yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:59:34 -0700 (GMT-07:00) From: Dante To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Now that's just funny!!. Thanx for starting my day off with a laugh Dante -----Original Message----- From: Dave Zapencki Sent: Dec 15, 2005 6:07 AM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card And you can max your new card out with all your ATA fees... Dante J. James, Esq. Project Director AA-VIP 303-830-1105 www.aavip.org Change is Inevitable, Growth is Optional VOTE - Your future depends on it! --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Tkdsid@aol.com Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 13:02:37 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re:Crisis in Taekwondo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Please read this January's edition of Taekweondo Times. Page 54-Crisis in Taekwondo. I'd love some feedback. Sid --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 11:59:06 -0800 (PST) From: Trenton Carmon Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Sparring To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net It's markell013 again. This is to Craig187.With no disrespect it seems like your tesing me, and i'm only 14. So I don't think that I can buy a bowflex. But thanks for the tip anyway!! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:23:57 -0600 (CST) Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] New ATA credit card From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ATA came out with credit cards in the mid 90's through MBNA. Our company was approached about offering the same cards. We could charge up to 4-5% over what the person was actually approved for. I think it was 4-5%, it's been a long time now. In other words, you get approved for 11.9%. We tell the credit card company we want 5% of the monthly balance. So they issue your credit card at 16.9%. Something like that. A real money maker. Funny thing about the ATA card, a lot of our little guys got letters in the mail being preapproved for up to $XXXX. A six year old with preapproved credit.... LOL! Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:24:56 -0600 (CST) From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] MASS Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net One thing that seems to keep coming up is the apparent dirtiness of making a living doing martial arts. There is nothing wrong with making an honest living. Selling a $6-12K Leadership Program to a six year old by a professional salesperson who isn’t even a martial artist is certainly stretching the “honest living” part of the equation. When I questioned this, I was told the six year old showed an interest in being an instructor. LOL! Yeah, at six I wanted to be an astronaut....or was it Superman....? This was in one of Master Bill Clark’s schools who were trying to enroll me in MASS training so I could sell Leadership Programs....I suppose to six year olds. MASS has a bad reputation and in my opinion, earned every bit of it. Right behind him are other martial artists selling seminars in the ATA on the premise of “how to ask for big money” http://www.ataonline.com/schools/eventdetails.asp?ID=503 When this is brought up, the people using MASS often counter it by giving their training. So what? Bill Clark was a kickboxing champion at one time. The instructors training and/or ability to train has nothing to do with their business practices in regards to MASS. And with all of this said, using MASS doesn’t make a person dishonest or a sell out. I’m sure there are parts of MASS that can be very beneficial if correctly implemented. And frankly, as I’ve said many times, as a professional, I have an obligation to earn the best living I can for me and my family. Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest