Date: Sun, 25 Dec 2005 03:01:52 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 12 #500 - 8 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on plus11.host4u.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=LINES_OF_YELLING,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2000 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Re: Liability (WTSDA Bruce) 2. Merry Christmas (FRANK CLAY) 3. RE: Liability waivers (Howard Spivey) 4. HoHoHo (Ray) 5. RE: Merry Christmas (PETER.MCDONALDSMITH@london-fire.gov.uk) 6. Re: Merry Christmas (Edward Peters, III) 7. Martial way (Ray) 8. Malaysia ITF Chip (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "WTSDA Bruce" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Liability Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 07:06:44 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Erik hit it on the head. You need to show the injured party knew the dangers of the event. My experience in the legal system is, if there is no documentation that there was previous knowledge, (wavier signed by injured party) no warning was ever given. You cannot assume just because it is a Martial Arts event, it is inherently dangerous. If a warning cannot be documented, it never was given. We normally included a waiver as a part of the registration form. Take care, Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Erik Kluzek" To: Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:26 AM Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Liability >> From: "Boit Clinton Capt AF/DPMP" >> >> Why is it that everyone always states that liability waivers never >> protect >> you, and then they tell you to have everyone sign them anyways?! What's >> the >> point to using them if they don't do anything? >> > > A liability waiver doesn't mean someone can't sue you. If you are > negligent -- they can sue no matter what they signed beforehand. And to be > found negligent you have to be tried in court. > > What liability waivers do is two-fold: > > 1.) Make you less likely to be sued... > > The liability waiver points out to people from the get go that there is > potential for injury that they take on themselves. Knowing that they are > less likely to sue, since it was brought to their attention, and they > signed it. Someone already pointed this aspect out. It's a good one. > > But the second is the main one... > > 2.) Limits what the prosecution can say in court. > > Here's the main reason for their use. By signing a liability waiver -- > if you are sued the prosecution CAN NOT claim they DIDN'T KNOW THEY COULD > GET HURT. That counts for a lot. Without the liability waiver, they can > claim that they didn't know there was any possibility for injury. If the > prosecution can establish that they didn't know there was any possibility > for injury -- your goose is cooked! the liability waiver helps limit that, > and ensures that the liability for the injury will be shared by the > student and instructor. That can either limit damages or make the jury > side with your side and let the student be liable for their own injury. > > Liability insurance-- > > Someone asked about liability insurance for an event. I think most > insurance will cover a seminar if you already have insurance through them. > Martial Arts Group insurance will cover seminars for something like $1.20 > per person per day. But, I think you may already have to have a policy > with them as a school. We have insurance through Westpoint and they cover > us for seminars as long as we don't exceed the number of students our > coverage provides. At this point there are several different providers for > martial arts liability insurance. Look through some martial arts > magazines for some, most have web-pages as well. Martial Arts Group and > Westpoint are two off the top of my head. .. > > > Erik Kluzek > Colorado > !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2000 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "FRANK CLAY" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 09:24:54 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Merry Christmas Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To my Mudo Brothers and Sisters, I sincerely wish you and yours a very Merry Christmas. Frank --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Howard Spivey" To: Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 11:53:06 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Liability waivers Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Regarding the waiving of liability for injury in seminsrs, etc... here's a quote from a law textbook: "CONSENT If one consents to conduct resulting in damage or harm done to his own person or property, no liability will generally attach to the intentional infliction of injury. This fundamental principle of the common law finds expression in the phrase "violenti non fit injuria" - to one who is willing, no wrong is done. Consent to an act is the willingness that it shall occur." (Smith and Roberson's Business Law, West Publishing Co., 1982, p. 67) As long as you're not negligent in any way when you hold a seminar (negligence cannot be disclaimed under tort law), and provided that everybody that signs a waiver has the mental capacity to know what he or she is signing and agreeing to, a waiver should have some legal weight in the event that you're sued. Does anybody have any actual examples of people suing them successfully for injury suffered in a seminar or in regular training that did not involve claims of negligence? --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 09:24:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] HoHoHo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net That time of year again. Wishing all you good folks out there the best this holiday season. And thanks for helping to make this forum the premier KMA forum on the net for yet another year. Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, Happy Holidays! Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Merry Christmas Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 21:30:08 -0000 From: To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have been reading the tkd times here in the UK. The term mudo has come up. What does it mean? -----Original Message----- From: FRANK CLAY [mailto:frankclay@msn.com] Sent: 24 December 2005 15:25 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Merry Christmas To my Mudo Brothers and Sisters, I sincerely wish you and yours a very Merry Christmas. Frank _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2000 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang **************************************************************************** SMOKE ALARMS SAVE LIVES Go to London Fire at www.london-fire.gov.uk/firesafety This email is confidential to the addressee only. If you do not believe that you are the intended addressee, do not use, pass on or copy it in any way. If you have received it in error, please delete it immediately and telephone the supplied number, reversing the charges if necessary. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 18:08:51 -0600 From: "Edward Peters, III" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Merry Christmas Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net If I am not mistaken, Mudo is the korean term for "Martial way" or "Martial Person" If this were a Japanese Martial Arts forum you might see the term "Budo". Happy Holidays from Texas Y'all Edward PETER.MCDONALDSMITH@london-fire.gov.uk wrote: >I have been reading the tkd times here in the UK. The term mudo has >come up. What does it mean? > > > > >To my Mudo Brothers and Sisters, > >I sincerely wish you and yours a very Merry Christmas. > >Frank >_______________________________________________ > > \ --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 17:40:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [The_Dojang] Martial way Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I have been reading the tkd times here in the UK. The term mudo has > come up. What does it mean? Mu/Moo, as in Moo Duk Kwan. Moo = martial. Do, as in Taekwondo. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 17:46:57 -0800 From: Ray Terry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Malaysia ITF Chip Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Saturday December 24, 2005 A sport that draws the old and young The Star Online - Malayasia By NG WEI LOON OLDEST exponent Wong Kong Mee Lin from Hong Kong may be 50 but she showed she could compete just as well as other exponents younger than her in the third Malaysia International Taekwon-Do Federation (ITF) Championships at the Genting Highlands Arena of Stars. Wong, a red black tip belt holder, said her grown-up children were amused when they found out three years ago that she had taken up the sport "Besides learning self-defence, the art has kept me mentally and physically fit. Even at my age, I am able to execute the moves that I could not do before I took up taekwondo," Wong added. ITF Japan secretary-general Lee Jong Mok, who witnessed the event, said he was impressed that the event had attracted people of all ages including children as young as seven years old. "It is good that they start young. The talents that I have seen have shown great potential. "Taekwondo has also offered people an opportunity to build bridges judging by the participation of foreign countries," said Lee. The three-day event, filled with action-packed kicks and punches, was officiated by Deputy Finance Minister Datuk Dr Ng Yen Yen. The St John's Ambulance crew and 37 tournament umpires and judges were kept busy during the championships. A total of 547 exponents including 26 foreign participants from Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore and India, took part in the individual, team pattern and sparring competitions. Except for Terengganu, Kelantan, Perlis and Sabah, all the other states took part in the championships. "It is great to see this event grow over the years," said Malaysia ITF representative Chew Teck Seong. At the Malaysian ITF championships, Penang's Quay Jin Ci, making her final appearance, won two gold medals in the girls' Under-17 black belt first dan category. The 17-year-old SMK Air Hitam student retained her title in the "tul" (pattern) event and won the below 60kg sparring event. Her "sine-wave" demonstration in the pattern event impressed the judges. Last year, Quay was awarded the Timur Laut District ITF Association student of the year for her commitment towards the art. Next year, Quay is looking forward to making her debut in the World Junior Championships. "She has mastered this new move very well. She has good techniques," said Timur Laut District ITF Association coach Michael Ch'ng The event was organised by the Gombak District ITF Association with the co-operation of the Youth and Sports Ministry through its Rakan Muda and Belia Benci Dadah (Youth Hate Drugs) programmes. Genting City of Entertainment was the venue sponsor. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest