Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 03:01:08 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #15 - 8 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Boat Promotions? (Manuel Maldonado) 2. Promotions (Rudy Timmerman) 3. clock watchers (Braeswood Martial Arts) 4. Re: clock watchers (ChunjiDo@aol.com) 5. Re: Tae Kwon Dance ? (ChunjiDo@aol.com) 6. Re: Promotions (Ray) 7. RE: Promotions (Rick Clark) 8. Songahm students (C.Sears) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Manuel Maldonado" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2006 13:19:52 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Boat Promotions? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Im a Retired US ARMY Staff NCO AND NO PVT SID WHAT MAKES YOU THINK I WANT TO BE AN LT? IM A TRAINER OF MEN I'LL RIP UR HEAD OFF AND $&!@ DOWN YOUR THROUGHT. Naw man just playing but one thing my friend I'd like to add to your comment even if anyone has had a "Dan Skip" Im sure they wont admit it besides like you said B4 ask a SGT if he wants to be an LT. I remember when I was comming up in Taekwon-do all I ever worried about was how in the world am I gonna pass my next exam? Seemed to me the next level was always much harder than the previous. To be quite honest I never thought I'd ever be a Black Belt (took me 7 years to attain) No I'll put on any belt its not the belt its the know how; and you know what come to think of it I feel ripped off my belt color hasent changed since 1981 lol... But Sid my man I couldnt of put it any other way... Oh as far as this Master Sell is concerned I dont care for him he was very very rude to my wife one day he called me and she answered the phone he was mad because she dosnt speak good enough English so I asked him what was it to him he's not married to her I am and I understand her quite well so I broke off relations with him besides he mixes MA with Religion as far as Im concerned it should be like Church and state, water and oil..ect. my 10 cents worth Manuel Maldonado --__--__-- Message: 2 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Rudy Timmerman Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 18:49:16 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Promotions Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Jeff writes: > The way I heard it, "back in the day" rank was more loose, didn't > happen as often and certainly not important for any specific > reason. Somebody could be a 2nd or 3rd dan for "a long time". > They would come to the states to teach or open a school and they > would be promoted to 5th Dan or something of the like. Something > that would have fallen in line with a "time in grade" type of > thought process. Hello Jeff: Back in the 60's it was not uncommon in some kwans to delay promotions for students who did not "need" higher rank. The idea was that there was no need for a higher rank unless you had a school. As recent as the mid 80s, one of my Instructors refused to promote a fellow martial artist I knew well to Master level. When I recommended the man to Master level (because he had time in rank AND skill), the GM told me face to face that this person did not "need" a Master Degree because he did not run a full time school. Unfortunately, because I was in charge of this area, this person thought it was ME who held him back, and it caused some stress between us for no reason. For Korean immigrating to North America, there might have been a sudden "need" to have higher rank. This need may have been due to immigration policies where one needs to prove extraordinary skill or status to be admitted into the country. It would most definitely be prudent for newly arriving Koreans to have higher rank to open a school here. Back home they may not have had that opportunity, so there was no "need" for higher rank until they got on the plane. This policy might indicate that high rank was not all that important until more recently when rank became a "commodity for sale" in some places. In some schools, particularly in geup ranks, a student might be promoted on the spot without a test at all. This may be for winning a tournament, or for some other reason that showed worthiness. My first Hap Ki Do Master held regular tests, and his philosophy was that tests were more for "checking" progress than anything else. He believed that people who were not pushed a bit might become lazy, and that just would not do in his classes. I guess I basically carried on his ways, as I too like to make sure no one falls through the cracks by testing them regularly. FWIW, a student who ASKED to be promoted might not see a promotion for a looooong time lol. Rudy --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Braeswood Martial Arts" To: Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 18:02:26 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] clock watchers Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net greetings sir, I do have a great solution for you in regards to these two boys, but as you asked for only the "gentlemen's" advise, I will happily share my opinion if you ask me privately as I do not mean to offend on this forum. Kat --__--__-- Message: 4 From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 19:47:16 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: clock watchers Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net occasionally, we'll get this. we usually tell them class will be over after x, y, and z drills. or simply "soon" and redirect them back to whatever the class is working on. if they keep bugging me about when class is over i simply say "for you? now. go sit out" and i take them to the side and sit them down. stern looks, and "i know you can behave much better than this. i hope you'll show me next class" lets them know they are in trouble. everyone else shapes up pronto. usually thats enough to have them sit still on the edge of class and not behave that way again. mel Chajonshim Martial Arts Academy _www.cjmaa.com_ (http://www.cjmaa.com/) 1.573.673.2769 Chajonshim Martial Arts Supply _www.cjmas.com_ (http://www.cjmas.com/) 1.877.847.4072 --__--__-- Message: 5 From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 19:55:33 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Tae Kwon Dance ? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net _http://shop.mooto.com/english/shop_ItemDetail.asp?group_no=4601_ (http://shop.mooto.com/english/shop_ItemDetail.asp?group_no=4601) the above link should take you to the dvd set. mms://211.55.33.159/asfroot/powerTKDdanceCD.wma this one might take you to the video link. taekwon dance and MMA are very popular in korea right now. have fun :) melinda Chajonshim Martial Arts Academy _www.cjmaa.com_ (http://www.cjmaa.com/) 1.573.673.2769 Chajonshim Martial Arts Supply _www.cjmas.com_ (http://www.cjmas.com/) 1.877.847.4072 --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Promotions To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 18:15:06 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > For Korean immigrating to North America, there might have been a > sudden "need" to have higher rank. This need may have been due to > immigration policies where one needs to prove extraordinary skill or > status to be admitted into the country. It would most definitely be > prudent for newly arriving Koreans to have higher rank to open a > school here. Back home they may not have had that opportunity, so > there was no "need" for higher rank until they got on the plane. > This policy might indicate that high rank was not all that important > until more recently when rank became a "commodity for sale" in some > places. Wasn't there something about only (or mostly only) professionals being permitted to immigrate to the US back in the day, and that 6th Dan was the rank at which one was considered a professional. Seems like I recall Grandmaster West saying something like that... I've also heard that those running a dojang in Korea are 7th Dan or better, so anyone in Korea that takes the chance of opening a dojang/business there automatically becomes a 7th Dan. "Old wives" tale??? Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 00:27:07 -0500 From: "Rick Clark" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Promotions To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray, As I remember, and it's been a few years ago, in 1969 and 1970 the head instructor at the Osan Air force Base (Chung Do Kwan) was a 5th dan and the assistant was a 4th dan. So unless it has changed . . . . . It's always been my understanding that 5th dan was the minimum rank for a teacher both in Korea and Japan. I have been told by a Japanese black belt in Judo that if a high school gym teacher with no black belt was told to teach a Judo class in the school the Kodokan would issue them a 5th dan to teach. Don't know for a 100% if that is correct but I have no reason to doubt him. Rick Clark "I am not young enough to know everything." - Oscar Wilde www.ao-denkou-kai.org >From: Ray [mailto:rterry@idiom.com] >I've also heard that those running a dojang in Korea are 7th Dan or better, so anyone in Korea that takes the chance of opening a >dojang/business there automatically becomes a 7th Dan. "Old wives" tale??? > >Ray Terry --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 00:17:17 -0600 From: "C.Sears" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Songahm students Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I'm a 5th Degree in Houston, TX. >Message: 4 >From: "Hugo Fradique" >To: >Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Clock Watchers >Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 10:53:31 -0000 >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > >Songahm! >This is my first post so, let me present myself. > >My name is Hugo Casimiro, I'm a 1st Dan Black Belt student of Taekwondo >Songahm, in Portugal. >I've just finished my instructor course and I´m eager to start teaching on >my own. >...snip... >PS: Any Songahm students out there? --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. 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