Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 14:03:20 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #21 - 16 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Teaching what you can't do (Klaas Barends) 2. Re: elvis and Kempo (Stovall, Craig) 3. Teaching what you can't do (Kevin Janisse) 4. Teaching what you can't do (Bob Banham) 5. Elvis (Dena M) 6. Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete (Amcreva Drogovah) 7. Re: Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete (Tim) 8. Re: Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete (Ray) 9. Re: Elvis (Ray) 10. Re: Elvis (David Zapencki) 11. video clips: wudang (Jye nigma) 12. Re: Re: Teaching what you can't do (Jye nigma) 13. Re: Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete (Jye nigma) 14. Re: Elvis (Ray) 15. teaching what you can't do (Stovall, Craig) 16. RE: Elvis (David P. Zapencki) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Klaas Barends Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 16:58:22 +0100 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Teaching what you can't do Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > How do you teach something that you can't do. For instance, let's > say there > is a technique that you can't do due to physical reasons, like a > jumping split > kick into a forward kick. If you yourself are physically unable to > do it how > do you teach others to do it? I hope I worded this correctly. I > thought of > this question because I was thinking about obese teachers who teach > martial > arts and can't do some things because of their weight problem. But what if you could do the split-kick, and could actually do it very well, when you were in your 20's, 30's But now you are a 60 year old MA teacher. Your split-kick isn't what it used to be, but you have tons of experience and years in the art. My guess would be you can give more than just a few good pointers. -- kind regards, Klaas Barends http://www.hapkido.nl/ Dutch HKD Federation http://www.sangmookwan.com/ SangMooKwan International Training Center Korea --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 09:59:46 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: elvis and Kempo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Yeah, I think you're right, Ray. I've lived an hour's drive from Memphis all my life, and there's some of his "Pasa-ryu" black belts scattered all over the place. I think he still advertises himself as "Elvis's teacher". --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Kevin Janisse" To: Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 08:08:19 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Teaching what you can't do Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello Jye, You Wrote: "example: and please don't take any offense from this anyone....take J.R. West for example...he is might I say just a little older than me....BUT I know where he comes from and what his track record is so he instantly has my attention and respect...now from there he can teach me a lot because I KNOW he has been in the game before. He doesn't need to demonstrate a 540 degree spinning back kick to me to teach me how to do it...I respect and trust his teaching and that is what it really is all about." Excellent response. Master Timmerman had a serious back injury well over 20 years ago when he could take ones head off with a reaching hook kick before you saw his size 13s coming at you. Because he had always been able to do what he expected others to do it was tough for him to get back into teaching. He did realize that his passion for teaching the art far surpassed his injury. It is a good thing he made the decision to stay with it because myself and hundreds of others would not be where they are, in the martial arts world, if he quit. No one is going to see him do a jumping spin kick but when he teaches....everyone listens. Sincerely, Kevin Janisse --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Bob Banham" To: Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 16:13:46 -0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] Teaching what you can't do Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Just a personal perspective on this one. As some of you know, I have multiple sclerosis and have had for 20 years now (that's half my martial arts career). I still teach my black belts although I do it from a chair or seated on the mat. Even when I am in a wheelchair (probably not that far off) I see no reason why I shouldn't still teach. I know the techniques and could do all of them well at one time, I have 40 years experience and I know how to impart knowledge. And if I'm on the floor - you still won't better me. Please don't consider that a challenge though! Bob --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 08:56:20 -0800 (PST) From: Dena M To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Elvis Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi everyone, Leaving lurk mode . . .since this is in my neck of the woods I thought that I would share this link. http://www.elviskarate.com/ "Elvis trained from 1970-1974 under Master Kang Rhee in Memphis, TN. He said master Rhee had a good reputation and had come highly recommended by Ed Parker, his former instructor, of California. During the four year period under Master Rhee, Elvis, like all the other students, selected an animal title by which to be addressed in the training area. After first choosing Mr. Panther, that name was later changed to "Mr. Tiger" because of existing political implications associated with the name "Panther" at that time. Elvis trained with the other students in a regular training session. Classroom discipline was so strict that Elvis was allowed the same freedom of training as the ordinary students without the usual press from adoring fans. Elvis was awarded 7th Degree Black Belt in 1973 by Master Rhee and on occasion had the opportunity, himself, to test and promote students of lower rank." There are actually a few schools around here that you can walk into and they have pictures of Elvis in his karate outfit plastered all over the walls. Dena Martin Message: 12 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: elvis and Kempo To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > ">8. Bad. Elvis Presley. I'm sure everyone remembers those > >horrible martial gyrations that Big E used to do on stage. I guess that > >was kempo dancing. All the kempo people must now do 20 push-ups to > >atone for that travesty." > > The wife and I , on a cross country jaunt a couple of years ago, did the > Graceland Tour and they promote him as being 5th or 6th dan....... > I laughed so hard I crossed a sensor and set off the alarms. I don't think it was Ed Parker, perhaps it was Kang Rhee ?? that promoted Elvis to 8th Dan. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Amcreva Drogovah" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 13:43:47 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello Everyone, Amcreva Here once again. Recently, as perhaps some of you have felt when you over train and work yourself you 'burn out'. I've been warned many times that I'm on the highway to burning out and I have never thought that it would happen. I thought it was something that would happen over a period of time. I've always loved Taekwondo, recently I haven't been enjoying myself as much as I had been. It was scary how this change has happened to me, almost overnight I suddenly had no drive or excitment to go to Class and Help the children, do my forms or kick pads, even spar. I was just looking for any advice on how perhaps I could regain the excitment I once had for Taekwondo, or what you Masters do when one of your students burns out from 'blackbelt politics' or training too much. What would be the best approch into getting back into the groove with this martial art? Thank you Amcreva   ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Open your e-mail without having to worry about viruses with MSN Premium. Join now and get the first two months FREE* --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Tim" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 13:59:14 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I once had a Grandmaster tell me don't come to class more than 2 times a week. Its recommended that you practice at home but twice a week is plenty at the dojang he would say. If I remember from your last post you are a yellow belt? If so that is way to early to burn out. Slow down, take a break. Goodluck, Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amcreva Drogovah" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2006 12:43 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete > Hello Everyone, Amcreva Here once again. > > Recently, as perhaps some of you have felt when you over train and work > yourself you 'burn out'. I've been warned many times that I'm on the > highway to burning out and I have never thought that it would happen. I > thought it was something that would happen over a period of time. I've > always loved Taekwondo, recently I haven't been enjoying myself as much > as I had been. > > It was scary how this change has happened to me, almost overnight I > suddenly had no drive or excitment to go to Class and Help the children, > do my forms or kick pads, even spar. > > I was just looking for any advice on how perhaps I could regain the > excitment I once had for Taekwondo, or what you Masters do when one of > your students burns out from 'blackbelt politics' or training too much. > > What would be the best approch into getting back into the groove > with this martial art? > > Thank you > > Amcreva > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Open your e-mail without having to worry about viruses with MSN Premium. > Join now and get the first two months FREE* > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 11:18:04 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > It was scary how this change has happened to me, almost overnight I > suddenly had no drive or excitment to go to Class and Help the children, > do my forms or kick pads, even spar. How about in other areas of your life? Maybe just feeling a little down about things in general? Or only martial arts??? Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Elvis To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 11:24:28 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > "Elvis trained from 1970-1974 under Master Kang Rhee in Memphis, TN. > He said master Rhee had a good reputation and had come highly recommended > by Ed Parker, his former instructor, of California. Maybe this is it. Parker maybe tried to get Elvis back with a promotion to 8th. ??? "Elvis loved the art, and constantly surrounded himself with martial artist friends. Elvis had trained with Ed Parker regularly, said Waite. In fact he was really quite good. Elvis had one unusual quality: he did not feel physical pain and this made him part of the karate guys so to speak. In Elvis' last days, only his karate friends were present and he really felt close to them. It was they he trusted." Maybe no pain was because of all the drugs he took... :) "In 1974 Parker awarded Elvis an eighth degree black belt in Kenpo karate. Karate also bled over into how Elvis staged his concert presentations. He also demonstrated karate in many of his films. After receiving a number of threats on his life in 1972, Elvis intensified his training and hired one of Parkers black belts as the first of his karate trained bodyguards." Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 13:40:33 -0600 From: David Zapencki To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Elvis Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From white belt to 7th dan in three years?? Wow.......... Dena M wrote: > "Elvis trained from 1970-1974 under Master Kang Rhee in Memphis, TN. He said master Rhee had a good reputation and had come highly recommended by Ed Parker, his former instructor, of California. > > >Elvis was awarded 7th Degree Black Belt in 1973 by Master Rhee and on occasion had the opportunity, himself, to test and promote students of lower rank." --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 11:40:55 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma To: MartialArtsTalk@yahoogroups.com, martialstudies@yahoogroups.com, the_dojang@martialartsresource.net, itf-taekwondo@yahoogroups.com, csemt-serrada_escrima@yahoogroups.com Subject: [The_Dojang] video clips: wudang Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net hope you guys like these clips: http://pigua.evrocom.net/CLIPS/WUDANG/juijian.MPG http://pigua.evrocom.net/CLIPS/WUDANG/wudangtaiji.MPG http://pigua.evrocom.net/CLIPS/WUDANG/wudangtaiji1.mpeg --------------------------------- Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 12:58:20 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Teaching what you can't do To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net your question shows that the teacher at one point had done the technique, so they have a practical knowledge of what it takes to do the technique. but suppose I'm 5'9 300lbs and couldn't get off the ground to save my life. Therefore have never done a jumping technique like a flying sidekick. how would I be able to teach something I couldn't do? I guess one could take a student who could do it and have them demonstrate, but what if your class if all newbies? lol. I guess where there's a will there's a way. jye Klaas Barends wrote: > How do you teach something that you can't do. For instance, let's > say there > is a technique that you can't do due to physical reasons, like a > jumping split > kick into a forward kick. If you yourself are physically unable to > do it how > do you teach others to do it? I hope I worded this correctly. I > thought of > this question because I was thinking about obese teachers who teach > martial > arts and can't do some things because of their weight problem. But what if you could do the split-kick, and could actually do it very well, when you were in your 20's, 30's But now you are a 60 year old MA teacher. Your split-kick isn't what it used to be, but you have tons of experience and years in the art. My guess would be you can give more than just a few good pointers. -- kind regards, Klaas Barends http://www.hapkido.nl/ Dutch HKD Federation http://www.sangmookwan.com/ SangMooKwan International Training Center Korea _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 13:01:30 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net shoot 2 times a week...for the prices some of these schools want, you can best believe they'd be seeing me evERYDay except on the sabbath...but shoot $100/month...they wake up next to me...lol jye Tim wrote: I once had a Grandmaster tell me don't come to class more than 2 times a week. Its recommended that you practice at home but twice a week is plenty at the dojang he would say. If I remember from your last post you are a yellow belt? If so that is way to early to burn out. Slow down, take a break. Goodluck, Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amcreva Drogovah" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2006 12:43 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] Looking For Advice: A Burned Out Athlete > Hello Everyone, Amcreva Here once again. > > Recently, as perhaps some of you have felt when you over train and work > yourself you 'burn out'. I've been warned many times that I'm on the > highway to burning out and I have never thought that it would happen. I > thought it was something that would happen over a period of time. I've > always loved Taekwondo, recently I haven't been enjoying myself as much > as I had been. > > It was scary how this change has happened to me, almost overnight I > suddenly had no drive or excitment to go to Class and Help the children, > do my forms or kick pads, even spar. > > I was just looking for any advice on how perhaps I could regain the > excitment I once had for Taekwondo, or what you Masters do when one of > your students burns out from 'blackbelt politics' or training too much. > > What would be the best approch into getting back into the groove > with this martial art? > > Thank you > > Amcreva > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Open your e-mail without having to worry about viruses with MSN Premium. > Join now and get the first two months FREE* > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. --__--__-- Message: 14 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Elvis To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 13:12:16 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I believe he started when he was in the Army, c1959. But even that is super fast. Ray > From white belt to 7th dan in three years?? Wow.......... > > > Dena M wrote: > > > "Elvis trained from 1970-1974 under Master Kang Rhee in Memphis, TN. He said master Rhee had a good reputation and had come highly recommended by Ed Parker, his former instructor, of California. > > > > > >Elvis was awarded 7th Degree Black Belt in 1973 by Master Rhee and on occasion had the opportunity, himself, to test and promote students of lower rank." --__--__-- Message: 15 Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 15:31:10 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] teaching what you can't do Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hey, I don't have a problem with people teaching things that they cannot do. What irks me are the folks who show things that NOBODY can do. --__--__-- Message: 16 From: "David P. Zapencki" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Elvis Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 15:48:44 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Wow, no kidding super fast! I did some rough (real rough) math in my head, and if a person got promoted each time "when eligible" by time in rank, it should be 32 years to obtain 7th dan. (I know it would be much longer, as no one promotes each time "when due") Dave -----Original Message----- From: Ray [mailto:rterry@idiom.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2006 3:12 PM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Elvis I believe he started when he was in the Army, c1959. But even that is super fast. Ray > From white belt to 7th dan in three years?? Wow.......... > > > Dena M wrote: > > > "Elvis trained from 1970-1974 under Master Kang Rhee in Memphis, TN. He said master Rhee had a good reputation and had come highly recommended by Ed Parker, his former instructor, of California. > > > > > >Elvis was awarded 7th Degree Black Belt in 1973 by Master Rhee and on occasion had the opportunity, himself, to test and promote students of lower rank." _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest