Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 10:16:22 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #54 - 11 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Tiger Meditation (Don Kirsch) 2. Jungki Kwan Seminar in Houston Texas. (Todd Miller) 3. Hapkido Seminar (Lloyd Martin) 4. RE: Spandex? (Stovall, Craig) 5. Santa Fe Hapkido Seminar (Tom Stanfield) 6. jackson (ChunjiDo@aol.com) 7. Moo Duk Kwan Patch (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 8. Hanja on Patches (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 9. Re: Moo Duk Kwan Patch (Ray) 10. Re: Hanja on Patches (Ray) 11. RE: Moo Duk Kwan Patch (Erik Brann) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Don Kirsch" To: "the_dojang" Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2006 22:23:50 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Tiger Meditation Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dr. Kimm does teach a series of Ki exercise where one lies on their back with the feet and hands in the air. There are numerous postures in these exercises which are used for Ki accumulation. Regards, Don Kirsch --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Todd Miller" To: Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 08:40:11 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Jungki Kwan Seminar in Houston Texas. Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master Jason White will be hosting Master Todd Miller of the Jungki Kwan for a series of Hapkido & Kuhapdo seninars at his Houston Texas Iron Dragon Dojangon Febuary 24th and 25th. All are welcome to join us for some great Hapkido & Korean Sword training. For those who are interested in some Jungki training please contact Master Todd Miller @ hkdtodd@ttlc.net or Master Jason White @ 505 Maxey Rd Ste C,D,E Houston TX 77504 713-450-2555 Master Jason White Iron Dragon Martial Arts --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 04:45:26 -0800 (PST) From: Lloyd Martin To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Hapkido Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Just wanted to thank Master Don Kirsch for the great seminar down in Santa Fe, TX this past weekend. Thanks also to Master Rich Hodder, Master Carolyn Moser, Master Instructors Peacock, Preutz and all that participated. It was an outstanding time. Now to get ready for the weekend bash in Jackson. Lloyd --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 09:29:21 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Spandex? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> I guess my post didn't count. <<>> You're playing fast and loose with the term "practicioner". I was once a strong and loyal member of "The Underground" forum (I think it's now MMA.tv or something). First started posting there around 1998, and quit around 2002. Nowadays, I'll stop over at Sherdog's every once in a while to see what that asylum is up to. I stay away from Bullshido like the plague...it's one of the worst troll sites on the web. The point is this...in all of my travels amongst the so-called "MMA community" I can honestly say that about 5% of those people on the boards actually train in some sort of martial art. So, from those people you can actually expect some sort of worthwhile discussion (maybe). The other 95% is going to give you the flatulence and the Dirty Sanchez jokes. It's unfortunate, but it's true. MMA is like a magnet to this strange breed of internet troll out there. For the life of me I can't explain it, and I'd be the first to run them all off if I could. If you really want to have a tactical discussion about clothing I'd be more than happy to join in. Otherwise, I suspect you're just using MMA folks as a strawman to make yourself feel better much in the same way that the Bullshido trolls rag on the TMA community in order to prop up their own fragile egos. Thoughts? --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 09:52:07 -0600 From: "Tom Stanfield" To: Organization: Home Subject: [The_Dojang] Santa Fe Hapkido Seminar Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I want to echo GM Hodders comments about the testing & afternoon seminar hosted by Master Moser & Mr Nguyen, it was great. Tuan, your students did great. I know I would not have want to see that many blackbelts at my gup tests. But, your guys handled it great. Thanks Master Kirsch for a equally great afternoon. As any student who is separated from there instructor can tells you....it is so great to be able to get back out on the mat with them, even if just as a "Demo-Dummy". And to that I also want to thank Master Instructor Peacock (of the Jackson Clan) for partnering with me & continuing the discomfort (learning) opportunities. I believe I got your finger prints on my left wrist, Sir.... Respectfully Tom "Big Galoot" Stanfield ----- Original Message ----- From: "rich hodder" To: Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2006 3:16 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] Hapkido Seminar > Hey all, > > I just wanted to thank Master Moser and Mr. Tuan Nygeun (sp?) of Santa Fe, > TX for having Master Don Kirsch down to Houston from Dallas for a > wonderful Hapkido Seminar and testing. As always, Master Kirsch gave a > very detailed and understandable explaination of techniques, not to > mention demonstrating them. I would be remiss if I didn't mention Mr. Tom > Stanfield (the big galoot to those of you that know him) who took the > brunt of the demos. I look forward to seeing everyone in Jackson, MS for > Master West's Seminar and Goat Roping toward the end of February. > Cong-Rats to those that tested, you all did very well. > > Rich > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! > http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ --__--__-- Message: 6 From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 10:53:56 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] jackson Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ok, folks... five of us, including myself, are coming down this year. looking forward to seeing you there :) melinda Chajonshim Martial Arts Academy _www.cjmaa.com_ (http://www.cjmaa.com/) 1.573.673.2769 Chajonshim Martial Arts Supply _www.cjmas.com_ (http://www.cjmas.com/) 1.877.847.4072 --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 10:44:09 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Moo Duk Kwan Patch Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr Brann The Moo Duk Kwan patch was developed by Grandmaster Hwang Kee. Many people have tried to hold on to their Moo Duk Kwan connection by using the Moo Duk Kwan patch, logo, flag etc. The Moo Duk Kwan organization recongnized by the founder, and current Grandmaster HC Hwang is trademarked in the US, but like Ray said I don't know what effect it will have out side the country. The link you sent of the Black Moo Duk Kwan Patch with Gold logo, kind of sickens me. Not becasue of anything you personally have done, but the website in general. The fist never stood for TKD, The character in the center of the scrole is Moo not Moo Duk Kwan, and the character to the left and right of that patch is Tang and Soo, not Tae and Kwon. I share the feelings of many, in the founders Moo Duk Kwan. That although, many have left the original school of Moo Duk Kwan for many different reason, they can and should be proud of the history they shared with the founder and the Moo Duk Kwan. However, once they leave the Moo Duk Kwan they shoud create, use, or find another logo to train under. They only serve to delute the founders style of Moo Duk Kwan by telling those that are nieve about Martial arts history that they are Moo Duk Kwan affiliated. I can tell you that the US Soo Bahk Do (Tang Soo Do) Moo Duk Kwan Federation Inc. is actively looking for those using the Moo Duk Kwan logo in violation of trademarked material. JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:03:22 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Hanja on Patches Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray I agree that the patches read differently. The current SBK MDK patch reads "Soo"--"Moo"--"Bahk" It is interesting to note that the writing is in old Chinese due to the age of the terms used. Soo Bahk in modern Korean means watermelon. The patch refered to in the link for the Moo Duk Kwan society (Not recognozed by the founders Moo Duk Kwan School) It reads "Tang"--"Moo"--"Soo" however the website is produced by a TKD organization. The other link you gave was interesting to me. You suggested it read "Tae"--"Moo"--"Kwon" Does this apear to be written in Chinese or Han Gul. To me it does not apear to be HanJa. Which if it says Tae Kwon in Chinese, my question is why? I know why Soo Bahk or Tang Soo might sometimes appear in Chinese but TKD should not. Thoughts JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Moo Duk Kwan Patch To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 09:20:41 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > The link you sent of the Black Moo Duk Kwan Patch with Gold logo, kind of > sickens me. Not becasue of anything you personally have done, but the website > in general. The fist never stood for TKD, Sure it does. Once it was updated, then that was the meaning of the newly created logo. > The character in the center of the > scrole is Moo not Moo Duk Kwan, and the character to the left and right of > that patch is Tang and Soo, not Tae and Kwon. Actually the fist logo was 'borrowed' by Hwang Kee. He was not the first to use the fist logo. He simply borrowed it and then changed it for his own purposes. The same as those that have now adapted his logo as a starting point for the purpose, creating their own logo. Use of this similar logo as a starting point does nothing but show respect for their lineage. > the Moo Duk Kwan. However, once they leave the Moo Duk Kwan they shoud > create, use, or find another logo to train under. The new logo -is- different. The Hanja is different. For those that change the colors, the color scheme is different. > I can tell you that the US Soo Bahk Do (Tang Soo Do) Moo Duk Kwan Federation > Inc. is actively looking for those using the Moo Duk Kwan logo in violation of > trademarked material. A search of the US Trademark Office shows no such logo trademark currently in place. Can you point me to it? The "United States Soo Bahk Do Moo Duk Kwan Federation" is not even a trademarked name, only applied for (#78510481). Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Hanja on Patches To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 09:35:52 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > ... The patch refered to in the link for the Moo Duk Kwan society (Not > recognozed by the founders Moo Duk Kwan School)... Recognized by the Korea Tae Kwon Do Moo Duk Kwan Association in Seoul. > It reads "Tang"--"Moo"--"Soo" > however the website is produced by a TKD organization. Just my screw-up. I helped do the website for them. Now I gotta find the right graphic file to use... :( Anyone have one handy? Gold lettering, blue background, Tae Moo Kwon on the scroll... > The other link you > gave was interesting to me. You suggested it read "Tae"--"Moo"--"Kwon" Does > this apear to be written in Chinese or Han Gul. To me it does not apear to be > HanJa. Which if it says Tae Kwon in Chinese, my question is why? It is in hanja (hanmun), or Sino-Korean characters, aka Chinese characters. >From Wilipedia... "More precisely, the name refers to those characters borrowed by Koreans and incorporated into the Korean language with the pronunciation adjusted to fit Korean phonetics. Unlike the Japanese kanji, which has altered and simplified many characters, hanja are almost entirely identical to modern traditional Chinese hanzi, although a minority of the standard characters of hanja are variant hanzi also used in standard kanji." See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanja for more info. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Erik Brann" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Moo Duk Kwan Patch Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 12:50:34 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net A couple of thoughts and questions. First, if the Black with Gold patch violates the trademark, which I am fairly sure it does, but I am not a trademark attorney, why can one purchase this patch from nearly any martial arts supply company, including Century, Asian World of Martial Arts and others? lo Second, I am sharing handed down to me from my teachers and texts they specifically cite. I would be glad to use accurate information, in fact I would prefer to disseminate correct, accurate and authentic information. Third, I am on a search for knowledge here, not to parade around any personal preference. I am researching the background of what I study, in order to find out where our school fit in with the whole scheme of the Moo Duk Kwan family of martial arts, of which I can identify five separate main curricula: Hwa Soo Do, Tang Soo Do, Tae Kwon Do (pre-WTF), Tae Kwon Do (WTF) and Soo Bahk Do. Lastly, if I am so wrong about using the Moo Duk Kwan school name, wasn't Kwanjangnim Hwang wrong to teach Shotokan patterns as his own? As far as I can tell, he gives appropriate credit to the Shotokan, and I give appropriate credit to Kwangjangnim Hwang as founder of the school to whose lineage I belong, albeit I can't solidify the complete linkage chain. Thank you for your time. -----Original Message----- From: Gladewater SooBahkDo [mailto:gladewatersoobahkdo@msn.com] Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:44 PM To: the_dojang Subject: [The_Dojang] Moo Duk Kwan Patch Mr Brann The Moo Duk Kwan patch was developed by Grandmaster Hwang Kee. Many people have tried to hold on to their Moo Duk Kwan connection by using the Moo Duk Kwan patch, logo, flag etc. The Moo Duk Kwan organization recongnized by the founder, and current Grandmaster HC Hwang is trademarked in the US, but like Ray said I don't know what effect it will have out side the country. The link you sent of the Black Moo Duk Kwan Patch with Gold logo, kind of sickens me. Not becasue of anything you personally have done, but the website in general. The fist never stood for TKD, The character in the center of the scrole is Moo not Moo Duk Kwan, and the character to the left and right of that patch is Tang and Soo, not Tae and Kwon. I share the feelings of many, in the founders Moo Duk Kwan. That although, many have left the original school of Moo Duk Kwan for many different reason, they can and should be proud of the history they shared with the founder and the Moo Duk Kwan. However, once they leave the Moo Duk Kwan they shoud create, use, or find another logo to train under. They only serve to delute the founders style of Moo Duk Kwan by telling those that are nieve about Martial arts history that they are Moo Duk Kwan affiliated. I can tell you that the US Soo Bahk Do (Tang Soo Do) Moo Duk Kwan Federation Inc. is actively looking for those using the Moo Duk Kwan logo in violation of trademarked material. JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest