Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 10:10:28 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #60 - 12 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Uniform (Gordon) 2. Family Clarification (Stovall, Craig) 3. GM Bong Soo Han (JR West) 4. Writing names in Korean (JR West) 5. More Lineage Research (Erik Brann) 6. cheesy Chuck (J R Hilland) 7. Re: Fighters V. Martial Artist (Thomas Gordon) 8. ITF Tuls & Knife Seminar in CT (Thomas Gordon) 9. Reply to Frank (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 10. RE: Chuck Norris....... (Martin Diggins) 11. Re: Reply to Frank (Ray) 12. (No subject header) (rwood) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Gordon" To: Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:02:56 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Uniform Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net We had our names in Korean down the left lapel because we had five schools and the Master Instructor couldn't know everyone. This way, at testing, he and all the guest judges could call everyone by name and know to whom they were speaking. We also had the school logo on the back of the jacket, the WTF patch on the right chest and the school patch over the heart. Gordon Okerstrom --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:39:55 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Family Clarification Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Not to pick nits, but Carlson had three children...Rosane, Karen, and Carlson Jr. Renzo, Ralph, Ryan, etc are actually the children of Robson Gracie. Then again, it's not hard to get confused with that family...they are absolutely huge. RIP to a great fighter and innovator. His death is a great loss to the martial arts community. --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "JR West" To: Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:48:37 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] GM Bong Soo Han Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Has he recovered yet? The latest word is that he is improving following radiation and chemotherapy and several other more traditional healing methods. He has not lost his hair and has not shown some of the other side effects of these treatments, but, in his words, he is extremely tired. I personally believe his prognosis is a good one. I will pass on any other news as I hear it from him.....J. R. West www.hapkido.com --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "JR West" To: Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:54:19 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Writing names in Korean Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I always thought that was sort of cool, until someone from one of these schools told me that this was done because the head instructor didn't even know the lower rank students' names. Dr. Kimm told me that when he first came to the USA in 1963 and taught Judo and Hapkido at SE MO State, he would write the students first name on the lapel of their uniform in Korean so that he could familiarize himself with such odd sounds while getting to know his students.....Seems like a pretty good idea to me....J. R. West www.hapkido.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Erik Brann" To: Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 11:53:56 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] More Lineage Research Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Greetings Dojang Digest members, Thank you for your assistance so far, I am still tracing my school's lineage, and have found a new connection. My teacher's teacher's teacher's information is Mr Pack Loung U 5th dan kta pyong taek moo duk kwan camp humphrey gym He taught in korea in the late 1950's early 1960's. I would be eternally grateful for any and all information anyone could share, with 2100 members, we should be able to find someone who's in a different branch of Mr Pack's line. Thank you in advance, Erik Brann --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:55:00 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] cheesy Chuck Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Poor young Joel is obviously suffering from delusions caused by cabin fever or snow blindness here in Fargo at NDSU, but a trip to the south for a few days would cure him. :) JRH <<>> <<>> --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:57:16 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Fighters V. Martial Artist From: "Thomas Gordon" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The comparison of MMA competition (UFC, Pride, etc) to martial artists to professional wrestling (WWE, TNA, etc) is interesting. The difference to MMA competition and professional wrestling is the winner isn’t predetermined in MMA. The struggle for a win is real. Not a "real world setting" with the rules, gloves, nice floor to roll on, and a ref. But conditioning wise, a professional wrestler may be in as good of shape as a MMA fighter. Think about it, I’m not real keen about doing a back fall from 6+ feet in the air. Nor am I real interested in putting on a high energy show (a demonstration if you will) for 20-60 minutes. Professional wrestlers are true athletes...the winner is predetermined and the soap opera is geared to draw a certain crowd. I see UFC going the same direction but without the predetermined endings. Hopefully not "sold out" as much as WWE/TNA...I don't care for those shows. But how many of us get caught up in the program that shows the seasonal runoff for a UFC contract? I enjoy watching it. What’s real interesting to me is how many UFC fights AREN’T going to the ground now. The grappler clinches and the striker knows enough to get them off of em so they can stand up. 10 years ago most everyone wanted to learn how to "fight from the ground" even though the practicality of "wanting" to roll on a gravel parking lot isn’t very enticing. Yeah, we should learn how to grapple, but in my estimation, we should learn enough grappling so we can get back on our feet. Just my thoughts. Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:58:31 -0600 (CST) From: "Thomas Gordon" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF Tuls & Knife Seminar in CT Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Well, I’m finally getting everything back in order after new computer, new ISP, websites going down, and email servers totally messed up. Wanted to thank the Unified ITF guys for a great time in Connecticut this past weekend. Fellow DD member, Mr. Metzger was my partner for the knife defense course. Always nice to work with someone you correspond with via email or mailing lists. Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 11:01:10 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] Reply to Frank Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Master Clay I agree that if someone came to my school and said they learned all the Moo Duk Kwan forms from a book or a video it would put several red flags. The only legitamate way to learn the required marterial for any system is from a legitamate instructor, if you what to learn it correctly. I know you are educated in the Historical records of the time we are talking about. From 1921 when Grandmaster Hwang Kee first is said to have began training at age 7, to 1945 when he formed the Moo Duk Kwan. Martial Arts training was for the most part banded by the Japanese. At least for Koreans, without some sort of political connection with the Japanese. Grandmaster Hwang Kee come not go down to his local Karate school and enroll for classes. Although he was able to train formally under at least one instructor for a short time. What would you have suggested he done to feed his appitite for knowledge? As for the Moo Duk Kwan TM-- As a member I don't know what will happen in the end with all this either, I too am interested to see. I can tell you that I talked with some senior leadership at the Moo Duk Kwan headquarters yesterday, and was told that if I tell them the web sites, magazines, or etc. that the federation atty. will send out a seise and desist letter. When I see a school using the Moo Duk Kwan name, MDK Patch, and issueing MDK certificates, none of which with the permission of the founder, I feel like you do about this Hackworth guy. Respectfully: What would you do if your student left your school on bad terms, began teaching his own schools, and claiming affiliation with you, competing with you, using your logos, etc. As for TM on a name. I would bet if I opened a store in my local community and put a big isgn on the front that said "Walmart" I would get a call from an atty by the end of the day. I don;t see much difference. Just my thoughts JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Martin Diggins" To: Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 16:59:45 -0000 Organization: Codico Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Chuck Norris....... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Chuck Norris does not hunt because the word hunting infers the probability of failure. Chuck Norris goes killing. To prove it isn't that big of a deal to beat cancer. Chuck Norris smoked 15 cartons of cigarettes a day for 2 years and acquired 7different Kinds of cancer only to rid them from his body by flexing for 30 minutes. Beat that, Lance Armstrong. Chuck Norris counted to infinity - twice. When the Boogeyman goes to sleep every night he checks his closet for Chuck Norris. A blind man once stepped on Chuck Norris' shoe. Chuck replied, "Don't you know who I am? I'm Chuck Norris!" The mere mention of his namecured this man blindness. Sadly the first, last, and only thing this man ever saw, was a fatal roundhouse delivered by Chuck Norris. Chuck Norris ordered a Big Mac at Burger King, and got one. When Chuck Norris sends in his taxes, he sends blank forms and Includes only a picture of himself, crouched and ready to attack. Chuck Norris has not had to pay taxes ever. Chuck Norris can touch MC Hammer. Chuck Norris once ate three 72 oz. steaks in one hour. He spent the first 45 minutes having s*x with his waitress. Chuck Norris always has sex on the first date. Always. Chuck Norris sleeps with a night light. Not because Chuck Norris is afraid of the dark, but the dark is afraid of Chuck Norris. A Handicap parking sign does not signify that this spot is for handicapped people. It is actually in fact a warning, that the spot belongs to Chuck Norris and that you will be handicapped if you park there. Chuck Norris is 1/8th Cherokee. This has nothing to do with ancestry, the man ate a f**king Indian. Someone once tried to tell Chuck Norris that roundhouse kicks aren't the best way to kick someone. This has been recorded by historians as the worst mistake anyone has ever made. If Chuck Norris is late, time better slow the f**k down. Chuck Norris lost his virginity before his dad did. Chuck Norris died ten years ago, but the Grim Reaper can't get up the courage to tell him. At birth, Chuck Norris came out feet first so he could roundhouse kick the doctor in the face. Nobody delivers Chuck Norris but Chuck Norris. Chuck Norris's tears cure cancer. Too bad he's never cried. Chuck Norris does not sleep, he waits. Chuck Norris sold his soul to the devil for his rugged good looks and unparalleled martial arts skill. Shortly after the deal was finalized Chuck roundhouse kicked the devil in the face and took his soul back. The devil who appreciates irony couldn't stay mad and admitted he should have seen it coming. They now play poker every 2nd Wed of the month. Chuck Norris is currently suing NBC, claiming Law and Order are trademark names for his left and right legs. The chief export of Chuck Norris is pain. Chuck Norris built a time machine and went back in time to stop the JFK assassination. As Oswald shot Chuck met the bullet with his beard deflecting it, JFK's head exploded in sheer amazement. Chuck Norris doesn't read books. He stares them down until they give him the information the wants. Chuck Norris owns the worlds greatest poker face, it helped him win the 1983 world series of poker despite him holding just a joker, a get out of jail free card, a 2 of clubs, a 7 of spades and an uno card. Once while filming on location for Walker, Chuck Norris brought a still born lamb back to life by giving it a prolonged beard rub. Shortly after the lamb had sprung back to life and a crowd had gathered Chuck Norris roundhouse kicked the animal breaking its neck killing it instantly, to remind the crew once more that Chuck Norris giveth and the good Chuck Norris taketh away. Chuck Norris appeared in the street fighter 2 video game but was removed by beta testers because every button pressed caused Chuck Norris to perform a fight ending roundhouse kick. When asked about the "glitch" Chuck Norris replied "that wasn't a glitch that is life" The quickest way to a man's heart is with Chuck Norris's fist. Chuck Norris is not hung like a horse. Horse's are hung like Chuck Norris. Chuck Norris wasn't born he punched his way out of the womb, then grew a full beard that very day. Chuck Norris frequently donates blood to the red cross, just never his own. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.14.23/243 - Release Date: 27/01/2006 --__--__-- Message: 11 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Reply to Frank To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 09:52:38 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > When I see a school using the Moo Duk Kwan name, MDK Patch, and issueing MDK > certificates, none of which with the permission of the founder, I feel like > you do about this Hackworth guy. Not really close to the same. Use of the phrase MDK in another org name is not use of the the SBD MDK name. Use of the unique TKD MDK patch is not using the SBD MDK patch or the TSD MDK patch. Certificates from the Korea TKD MDK Assoc with the signature of that org's president is not the same as selling certs from the US SBD MDK Fed with HC Hwang's signature on them. This latter point would correspond to what you saw on Julian's webpage of fake/forged documents. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "rwood" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 12:02:42 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] (No subject header) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Tomlinson wrote; that is a very good point, how do you balance out the concepts of fairplay, honor, respect, humility, and manners when we are constantly bombarded with quite the opposite on a daily basis? I am a high school teacher and this is a problem I contend with everyday. I kind of take the idea of practicing what I preach... young ones are very observant, that is their main mode of learning so before you can preach it to them you best be trying to live it or they will disregard the message because of the messenger...after that what do you do??? I know what I do but I would love to hear what some of you all do about this quandry with today's youth???? What's up ya'll?? Mr. Tomlinson, I am also a school teacher. I am the teacher for the Outside School Suspension Program in my district. The program allows for students, whose behavior warrants removal from school to still keep current with assignments and we also have a community service part to the program. I see students’ everyday that have fought, stole, been insubordinate, etc. Lack of self disciple is rampant. The lack of self disciple is learned behavior from home and entertainment. The real concerns I have is the lack of drive or goal setting and lack of remorse toward their misbehavior evident in most of the students I deal with. They no longer believe the “I am ok you’re ok” idea, they now live by “I will do what I want no matter who gets hurt.” How does this relate to Martial Arts? Well we talk a lot about disciple and perseverance which seems to have gone missing from society. America seems to have adopted a “fast food” outlook on life; fast, cheap, and easy. If it takes effort, it must be minimal. If it takes time, it must short. If it involves sacrifice, it is left for someone else to do. As Martial Artist we sweat, hurt, and bled for our art. No one else can earn our promotions or gain our skills for us. The effort, time, and sacrifice are given daily. This dedication to the art is even given cheerfully, by student and teacher alike. I believe that at the end we will be held accountable for how we have lived. Hum…accountability could that be what is lacking? IHS, Rob Wood He who ignores disciple comes to poverty and shame, but whoever heeds correction is honored. Proverbs 13:18 --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest