Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2006 15:02:20 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #71 - 13 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Where in the UK ru based? (Dave Marriott) 2. TKD Patterns in XML format (Robert Martin) 3. ITF Forms History Question (Robert Martin) 4. Spandex and beyond (Bruce Sims) 5. ITF forms (Dena M) 6. Sad news from South Dakota (Bruce Sims) 7. Re: ITF Forms History Question (donnef@mts.net) 8. RE: Guy stabbed trying to break up a fight (Stovall, Craig) 9. jacksonfest (J R Hilland) 10. RE: RE: Guy stabbed trying to break up a fight (michael tomlinson) 11. RE: Where in the UK ru based? (PETER.MCDONALDSMITH@london-fire.gov.uk) 12. RE: I.T.F. forms history (C. Bonner) 13. RE: Where in the UK ru based? (Rick Clark) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Dave Marriott" To: Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 12:10:52 -0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] Where in the UK ru based? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi Peter, I am based near Sheffield. One of my classes is in Dinnington and the other in South Anston. If you'd like to join us at any time you'd be very welcome. We are very close to the M1 (J31) so if you do decide to come along just send me an email and I'll meet you there. Regards Dave Web Site: http://www.yakma.co.uk email: dave@dpm.org.uk --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 06:23:06 -0800 (PST) From: Robert Martin To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] TKD Patterns in XML format Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I don't know if they are XML but try www.itf-infomration.com Message: 9 From: "Ed Marino" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 08 Feb 2006 22:16:18 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] TKD Patterns in XML format Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Can someone tell me where I can find all 24 TKD patterns step-by-step published in XML format? Chon-Ji, Dan Gun, Do San, etc... Thank you very much! --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 06:26:16 -0800 (PST) From: Robert Martin To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF Forms History Question Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The 1965 encyclopedia lists 20 patterns. Four more were added by the early 1970's and Juche added in the early 1980's. General Choi talks about other patterns being created in Korea during the 1960's in is autobiography. None of them every made it to the ITF syllabus. Robert Martin Message: 2 From: "Joel McTague" To: Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2006 06:12:05 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF Forms History Question Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Besides Julche replacing Ko-Dang for 2nd Dans, have there been any other ITF forms that have been replaced in the past? I was reading a book that suggested that there were other forms, but I can only find that one as an example. Joel --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 06:57:51 -0800 (PST) From: Bruce Sims To: Ray Terry Subject: [The_Dojang] Spandex and beyond Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Folks: I had hoped that someone would take up my thought earlier. Since noone has I guess its time to (once again) stick my neck out. here are some questions that come to mind regarding MMA. 1.) If one is to consider an activity a true "martial art" there needs to be some modification of the individuals values or thinking as a result of the training. Some arts have philosophies or beliefs that shaped their development. For instance, JMA often draws on Bushido as its root and KMA have Mu-Do, Confucianism and Buddhism. Do the people who guide the development of MMA have a set of principles or beliefs that shape how they choose to accept or reject material? Is there a kind of mind-set that can be identified as the epitome of development which the successful MMA practiioner will exhibit? 2.) The kwan to which I belong has a Kebonsu or set of "core techniques" from which the rest of the art proceeds. With the odd modification, most people who come from the YMK/WHF tradition will know and use those techniques as a foundation. Do the MMA have core set of techniques? I understand that by definition MMA IS "mixed." However I think its fair to assume that a particular approach to conflict from a particular view will tend to favor some techniques over other. Thoughts? 3.) I understand that MMA competitions must have rules that favor the protection of individuals. I also know that not all rules are created equal and that some rules favor/disfavor some approaches. Does anyone want to address what rules are generally considered "good" rules and what rules are generally considered "poor"? Let me also say that I am a Hapkido traditionalist and would rather not see what I do corrupted by sportification. However, that does not mean that I am not intersted in those influences floating around in the community. If someone can speak to these questions, I only have about another 20 or so to ask. Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 07:06:20 -0800 (PST) From: Dena M To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF forms Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Message: 9 From: "Ed Marino" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 08 Feb 2006 22:16:18 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] TKD Patterns in XML format Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Can someone tell me where I can find all 24 TKD patterns step-by-step published in XML format? Chon-Ji, Dan Gun, Do San, etc... Thank you very much! Mr. Marino, I don't know where you can find them in XML format, but you can view the ITF 24 forms step-by-step at: http://www.itf-information.com/patterns.htm Just click on the pattern name. Dena Martin --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 07:25:37 -0800 (PST) From: Bruce Sims To: Ray Terry Subject: [The_Dojang] Sad news from South Dakota Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thanks (I guess) for the news about yet one more person with poor impulse control. I have to tell you though, after hearing about such cases one too many times I am beginning to wonder if there is something about the MA that seems to attract morons like this. I work with a college population and have worked with a High School population as well, and there some things you don't do because you are just asking for trouble when you do. a.) You are never alone with a student--- male or female. b.) You do not provide individual services (rides, over-night stays). If a service is provided it is done for a group and usually in a group setting. c.) There are guidelines for appropriate touching which, essentially, is across the back of the upper torso and either arm. d.) There is material in Hapkido that requires intimate contact between partners (ie. groundwork). Its done in the school, in class--- no after-class or before class coaching. Now nothing I have said is probably foreign to people reading this and most of it is just good common sense. Thats why I am beginning to wonder if MA tends to attact people who are either consciously or unconsciously predators. Thoughts? Comments? Best Wishes, Bruce __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: To: Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 10:36:54 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: ITF Forms History Question Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > -- __--__-- > > Message: 2 > From: "Joel McTague" > To: > Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2006 06:12:05 -0600 > Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF Forms History Question > Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > > Besides Julche replacing Ko-Dang for 2nd Dans, have there been any other > ITF > forms that have been replaced in the past? I was reading a book that > suggested that there were other forms, but I can only find that one as an > example. > > Joel > Others on this list know ITF history better than me, but I believe I've read that before the 24 forms were fully developed and set, that other forms such as Bassai (which I think is a Karate form) were taught well into the 1960s. This is a little off your question, but in the Global Taekwon-do Federation, founded by former ITF vice president GM Park Jung Tae in the early 1990s, several forms have been added: Jee-Sang and Dhan-Goon (colour belt-level patterns), as well as the senior level patterns of Jee-Goo, Juk-Am, Pyong-Hwa and Sun-Duk. Juk-Am (95 movements) is performed in place of Juche and Ko-Dang is also part of the curriculum. --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 10:38:09 -0600 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Guy stabbed trying to break up a fight Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<<4. the guy with the knife got a dislocated elbow and seperated shoulder and a severely broken cheekbone, 5. the guy punching me got a compound concussion and was unconscious,>>> Damn, son!!! We gonna start calling you the "Taco Bell Wreckin' Machine". Mess with Tomlinson's bean burrito and ya gonna git yo ass WRECKED!!! --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 10:51:02 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] jacksonfest Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Just a quick reminder that pre-registration ends February 15th for the 24th International Hapkido Seminar held this month from the 24th-26th in Jackson, Mississippi. More information is available at www.hapkido.com. Jere R. Hilland www.rrhapkido.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] RE: Guy stabbed trying to break up a fight Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2006 18:21:32 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dude I was scared as crap that night, I've replayed that night over in my head many times and I was just plain lucky...the guy punching me never even tryed to grab me or hold me...if he had I would probably be dead now..he just kept teeing off on my head..which by the way is pretty hard with a lot of blank space in it... it happened so fast I didn't have time to even think about it beforehand...those guys were wired and just looking to hurt some people...no logic at all....I remember low side kicking the guy punching me in the head to try and keep him from drilling me and then just twisting the dudes arm with the knife until I couldn't get it to twist anymore,,, and I was twisting as hard as I could,,and then back to the other guy...after it was all over and I was being driven to the hospital I remember being friggin tired as crap...it was like I ran 15 miles or something...never did eat my food...as a matter of fact I guess I dropped the bag when I was attacked and ended up stomping all over it during the fight...luckily I didn't have to go to court...the guys that attacked us had drugs in their van (pcp and reefer), and they ended up plea bargainning before it got to court...just as well..I didn't want to see them again...ever...I tell you though I always look at whats around me when I pull in somewhere since then... that Taco Bell must of had some weird mojo over me...probably 6 months later I am pulling out of the same Taco Bell in my same truck with my same girlfriend and get slammed by a 1970 something Ford Pinto station wagon...took the whole front end of my Chevy LUV truck off..remember those..totalled it...I have never been back in that Taco Bell EVER since that wreck...sh--t I'm afraid I'd get hit by a meteor or something if I ever went back there!! Michael Tomlinson >From: "Stovall, Craig" >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: >Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Guy stabbed trying to break up a fight >Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 10:38:09 -0600 > ><<<4. the guy with the knife got a dislocated elbow and seperated > >shoulder and a severely broken cheekbone, 5. the guy punching me got a > >compound concussion and was unconscious,>>> > > > >Damn, son!!! We gonna start calling you the "Taco Bell Wreckin' >Machine". > > > >Mess with Tomlinson's bean burrito and ya gonna git yo ass WRECKED!!! >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 11 Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Where in the UK ru based? Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2006 21:15:11 -0000 From: To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ooh- er... Sheffield that's a bit far I live in Kent. But if I am ever in that part of the world ii will be sure to look you guys up. Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: Dave Marriott [mailto:dave@dpm.org.uk] Sent: 09 February 2006 12:11 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Where in the UK ru based? Hi Peter, I am based near Sheffield. One of my classes is in Dinnington and the other in South Anston. If you'd like to join us at any time you'd be very welcome. We are very close to the M1 (J31) so if you do decide to come along just send me an email and I'll meet you there. Regards Dave Web Site: http://www.yakma.co.uk email: dave@dpm.org.uk _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang **************************************************************************** SMOKE ALARMS SAVE LIVES Go to London Fire at www.london-fire.gov.uk/firesafety This email is confidential to the addressee only. If you do not believe that you are the intended addressee, do not use, pass on or copy it in any way. If you have received it in error, please delete it immediately and telephone the supplied number, reversing the charges if necessary. --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "C. Bonner" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2006 16:08:41 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: I.T.F. forms history Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net -------------------------------------------------------------------- Juche replaced Kodang, but no other one's were. In the late 60's, early 70's there were 4 new forms added, and some of the order, as far as what level they were practiced at, changed some at the black belt levels in the I.T.F(Chang Hun) forms system. Before the I.T.F. Chang Hun forms, Tae Kwon-Do used the Okinawan kata's(pinan's, etc.) They were basicly replaced by the Chang Hun forms. a few kwon's kept the Okinawan forms though. Hope this helps. Clint >Message: 2 >From: "Joel McTague" >To: >Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2006 06:12:05 -0600 >Subject: [The_Dojang] ITF Forms History Question >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > >Besides Julche replacing Ko-Dang for 2nd Dans, have there been any other ITF >forms that have been replaced in the past?  I was reading a book that >suggested that there were other forms, but I can only find that one as an >example. > >Joel --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2006 17:48:40 -0500 From: "Rick Clark" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Where in the UK ru based? To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi guys, >[mailto:PETER.MCDONALDSMITH@london-fire.gov.uk] >Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Where in the UK ru based? > > >Ooh- er... Sheffield that's a bit far I live in Kent. But if >I am ever >in that part of the world ii will be sure to look you guys up. Oh come on guys, M20 to the M25 and then up the M1, 3hrs (+ or - 15 or 20 min) and either one of you are there. Its not across the world, just a hop, skip, and a jump! It is funny we in the US and you in the UK see things different. For me a 3 hr drive is not a big deal, I'll drive that to visit my sister in law, eat and talk then drive home. Think nothing of it. We just don't see distance in the same way. But I was in Brighton and was walking through the Pavilion there - it was built by King George. For us that's a long time ago, for you guys that's a new building :-) I start out in Indiana and then go to Cork, off to Edinburgh, Hull, to Brighton to Cardiff and points in between to teach. Its not that big of a deal to drive :-) Rick Clark www.ao-denkou-kai.org --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest