Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2006 03:01:57 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #136 - 13 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. 27 dahn (Rudy Timmerman) 2. RE: Three (michael tomlinson) 3. Re: Choson period official dress (Joseph Cheavens) 4. RE: 27 dahn (Erik Brann) 5. Kukkiwon Records (Calvin Berlin) 6. KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 (Curt McCauley) 7. Re: Kukkiwon Records (Ray) 8. RE: KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 (Joseph Cheavens) 9. Re: KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 (Ray) 10. From an email: the Sul Sa Do guy (Jye nigma) 11. Real Ultimate Power!! (Brooke Thomas) 12. Rudford Hamon Replaces Injured Steven Lopez (Ray Terry) 13. billy blanks getting KO (Jye nigma) --__--__-- Message: 1 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: Rudy Timmerman Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 11:21:32 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] 27 dahn Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray writes: > A blast from the past, see below... > > As Rudy mentions, the number three holds, or has held, a special > significance in a great many of the world's cultures over the ages. > > I always liked the 3x3 reason, too. But as a former math person it > would > seem that 3x3x3 would hold the greatest significance in a culture > impressed > with threes. > > Ray "27th Dan" Terry Holy cow Ray... you know that there aren't enough fingers and toes to go that high lol. All kidding aside, I am sure that more than one Korean Master would cast aside any tradition in order to equal or out "number" a Japanese Master and go to 10 (or higher). Rudy --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Three Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 16:29:37 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net yep the number three is important to Buddhists also...1. the buddha 2. the priesthood 3. the teaching....that is why you always light three sticks of incense to give an offering,,, why you clap your hands three times...etc... Michael Tomlinson >From: Rudy Timmerman >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >Subject: [The_Dojang] Three >Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 09:32:48 -0500 > >Rick writes: >>Ah.....I had a Korean tell me that the reason they only went to 9 was >>that that was the last number that was a single digit. > >Many years ago, I was told that the number three is a "special" number in >the Orient. We find this not only in Oriental places, but we also have >the trinity philosophy in the Western world. The number nine, being three >times three, would then be the highest of this special number; hence, this >was the number of dahns adopted. Rudy >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Joseph Cheavens" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Choson period official dress Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 11:32:36 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Holy cow! Next you'll be telling me that it snowed in Seoul in August. [IMAGE] Joe -------------------------------------------------------------------- From:  Ray Reply-To:  the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To:  the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject:  Re: [The_Dojang] Choson period official dress Date:  Fri, 17 Mar 2006 06:53:47 -0800 (PST) > > I always thought that there were no 10th dans in TKD because that would > > necessitate agreement between all of the 9th dans on who was deserving of > > 10th dan and that given the somewhat volatile nature of Korean politics > > in general and TKD politics in particular, such an agreement is about as > > likely snow in Seoul in August. > >Within the last few years there are now a handful or two of TKD 10th Dans. > >Ray Terry >rterry@idiom.com >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Erik Brann" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] 27 dahn Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 12:47:34 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I hear that 81 and 108 are pretty significant numbers too. - Erik Brann 108th Dan Supreme Ultimate Greatest Gra -----Original Message----- From: Rudy Timmerman [mailto:kwanjang@sympatico.ca] Sent: Friday, March 17, 2006 11:22 AM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] 27 dahn Ray writes: > A blast from the past, see below... > > As Rudy mentions, the number three holds, or has held, a special > significance in a great many of the world's cultures over the ages. > > I always liked the 3x3 reason, too. But as a former math person it > would seem that 3x3x3 would hold the greatest significance in a > culture impressed with threes. > > Ray "27th Dan" Terry Holy cow Ray... you know that there aren't enough fingers and toes to go that high lol. All kidding aside, I am sure that more than one Korean Master would cast aside any tradition in order to equal or out "number" a Japanese Master and go to 10 (or higher). Rudy _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 11:25:44 -0600 From: "Calvin Berlin" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Kukkiwon Records Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Has anyone heard it reported that some or many of the records showing an individual's rank had been destroyed by the past President of the Kukkiwon to cover up the embezzlement? Pil Seung Cal Berlin ----------------------------------------------------- This electronic mail transmission contains information from P&H Mining Equipment which is confidential, and is intended only for the use of the proper Addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us immediately at the return address on this transmission, or by telephone at (414) 671-4400, and delete this message and any attachments from your system. Unauthorized use, copying, disclosing, distributing, or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this transmission is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. ----------------------------------------------------- <> --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Curt McCauley" To: Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 10:36:03 -0800 Subject: [The_Dojang] KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I am fortunate enough to have a copy of the Vol 1 book as published in Korea (Original text in Han gul) The title is "Soo Bahk Do Dae Kahm" I cannot find a date on the book ( not Han Gul literate enough) how ever it would stand to reason that it is post 1960, when he first started using the Soo Bahk Do (tm) name. The book has many more pages than the English Translation. Sincerely, Curt McCauley I have in my possession TANG SOO DO (SOO BAHK DO) by Hwang Kee. > (can't seem to locate an ISBN). > The title page indicates that it is copyrighted in 1992. The same page > also says that it was "first printed in English, February, 1978". When I > was first seeking this book I ran across a number of books, some of which > were keyed into specific ranks (gueps) and were identified with particular > colored belts. That is the second printing of Hwang Kee's first book, aka volume 1. A first edition does not have the name Soo Bahk Do in the title. The others you mention are the SBD instructional booklets. --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Kukkiwon Records To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 10:08:02 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Has anyone heard it reported that some or many of the records showing an > individual's rank had been destroyed by the past President of the Kukkiwon > to cover up the embezzlement? No reports of that, as of yet. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Joseph Cheavens" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 12:56:46 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I'm pretty sure the term Soo Bak Do was being used as far back as the 1940s. -------------------------------------------------------------------- From:  "Curt McCauley" Reply-To:  the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To:   Subject:  [The_Dojang] KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 Date:  Fri, 17 Mar 2006 10:36:03 -0800 >I am fortunate enough to have a copy of the Vol 1 book as published in Korea >(Original text in Han gul)  The title is "Soo Bahk Do Dae Kahm"  I cannot find >a date on the book ( not Han Gul literate enough) how ever it would stand to >reason that it is post 1960, when he first started using the Soo Bahk Do (tm) >name. > >The book has many more pages than the English Translation. > >Sincerely, > >Curt McCauley > > >I have in my possession TANG SOO DO (SOO BAHK DO) by Hwang Kee. > >   (can't seem to locate an ISBN). > >   The title page indicates that it is copyrighted in 1992. The same page > > also says that it was "first printed in English, February, 1978". When I > > was first seeking this book I ran across a number of books, some of which > > were keyed into specific ranks (gueps) and were identified with particular > > colored belts. > >That is the second printing of Hwang Kee's first book, aka volume 1.  A >first edition does not have the name Soo Bahk Do in the title.  The others >you mention are the SBD instructional booklets. >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] KJN Hwan Kee's Vol 1 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 11:44:37 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I'm pretty sure the term Soo Bak Do was being used as far back as the > 1940s. June 1960 was when the Korea SBD Association was formed out of the Korea TSD Asociation. You may be thinking of Subak, which is the lost art that Hwang Kee named Soo Bahk Do after. The name subak well preceeds even the 1900s. But there is no real relationship between Soo Bahk Do and soobahk/subak/subakki other in that the names are similar. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 12:46:13 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] From an email: the Sul Sa Do guy Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net ok so I got this email from the sul sa do guy ( http://www.sulsado.it/indiceEng.htm ). I find it down right funny that on his page he claims sulsado is a complete martial art and that unlike japanese ninjutsu being imported from china, sulsado was homegrown meaning made in korea, yet in the title of his name he uses a japanese term associated with ninjutsu- Master Orlando Shinobi. ...lol. Then on top of of that, he calls it korean ninjutsu which implies that sulsado is the korean version of ninjutsu...lol. but anyhow, I wrote him saying I liked his HAPKIDO clips and was wondering when he was going to share some SUL SA DO clips...lol and this is what he wrote back: Who taught you sulsa techniques? Secondly their are new videos,but their is not many at the moment cause we are constructing the web site. I demonstrated Sul Sa techniques so far,but if your asking special techniques of Sul Sa I do not see how I am going to demonstrate secret techniques on wide world web. I have web site to notify people of our existance but am not really intrested to much about publicty as it is more for my students. I teach a very hard training style of martial arts and this method could not be stressed on a website. If I do a presentation video,then I will contact you ,if your intrested in viewing real SulSaDo. If you are with the Hwarang Sulsa people in the states,well we had a the cheif Instructor of Hwarang Italy at our school 2 weeks ago,and with little he saw,he remained impressed at the high standards of our Sulsado Academy.He repeatedly gave us credits and said he never saw a school with high standards like ours worldwide. I hope this helps, My Grandmaster does not even let people watch lessons,and it was hard to get permission to do this web site,so until now hope you enjoy. Best regards. Orlando Shinobi Sul Sa Do 6°Dan Ok now that you've read that email let me point out some things....lol. 1)he claims what he demonstrated was sulsa techniques- then hell sulsa is hapkido and TKD stuff with acrobatics...lol. 2)he said the special techniques of sulsa are secret ...lol. there are no secrets in the martial art. 3) he says the website is to let people know the school exists and he's not interested in publicity, yet on his website it states he has his own tv show, and it flashes across the top that sul sa do has been on tv and the news, and that he's performed at martial art events etc...lol. 4)he says he teaches a very hard training style of MA...hey no doubt, I know HAPKIDO has got to be hard to train in...lol. 5)he says he's gonna share a video of REAL sulsado with me....well what is fake sulsado...lol. 6)now this is the kicker...he says the hwarang guys (dr joo bang lee guys) gave him positive feedback on his sulsado training standards...ummm...is it me or didn't dr joo bang lee say that sulsa are skills and NOT a complete martial art? if so then how is it one of His folks goes to a place in which dr lee states (in oh so many words) is a fake and gives any type of positive feedback? lol...wow now that guy sure made a loooong stretch on that story...lol. 7)last but not least he claims his grandmaster (Grandmaster Tiger Kim 39th generation lineage holder, nephew of General jin tae-kim 38th generation lineage holder) doesn't allow anyone to view training....hmmmm I wonder why? maybe he is afraid that if anyone saw the training, they'd spot the SECRET of sulsado techniques.....which is HAPKIDO...lol. That is if this grandmaster tiger kim even exists...lol. Jye --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 13:27:20 -0800 (PST) From: Brooke Thomas To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Real Ultimate Power!! Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Come on guys, this site is where the real ultimate power is! http://www.realultimatepower.net/ Check out how to commit Seppuku. Buy yourself some ninja t-shirts! BTW, on the Celestial-Do BS, I would LOVE to spare with those guys. Just the look on their faces when they repeatedly smack into the floor or when their energy transfer doesn't knock me out would be priceless!!! -Brooke Hapkido Blend --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 18:17:58 -0800 From: "Ray Terry" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Rudford Hamon Replaces Injured Steven Lopez Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Rudford Hamon Replaces Injured Steven Lopez At Dutch Open Event March 17, 2006 USA Taekwondo has announced that Rudford Hamon (Miami, Fla.) will replace Steven Lopez (Sugar Land, Texas) in the men's welterweight division of the Dutch Open this weekend. Lopez withdrew from the competition on Friday due to an injury. Hamon was the runner-up to Lopez at the 2006 Senior National Team Trials and was a member of the 2005 World University Games Team. The 16-member USA Taekwondo Senior National Team is participating in this weekend's Dutch Open in Eindhoven, Netherlands, March 18-19. The event features over 1,200 competitors from 50 countries, including 35 national teams from the likes of Azerbaijan, Croatia, Denmark, Egypt, France, Germany, Netherlands, Spain and Turkey. --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 21:11:56 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net, itf-taekwondo@yahoogroups.com, martialstudies@yahoogroups.com Subject: [The_Dojang] billy blanks getting KO Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8208358487313783640&q=mma --------------------------------- Brings words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest