Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 19:10:19 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #381 - 16 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Moo Duk Kwan, Soo Bahk Do, Tang Soo Do (sidtkd@aol.com) 2. Re: MDK (Ray) 3. Re: Pavel Tsatsouline (Stovall, Craig) 4. MDK (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 5. Staph (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 6. Second MMA fight this past Saturday (Stovall, Craig) 7. Re: Re: Moo Duk Kwan, Soo Bahk Do, Tang Soo Do (Ray) 8. MRSA (Frank Clay) 9. Re: MDK (Ray) 10. Re: MDK (Vernon Noble) 11. California Junior Taekwondo Chip (Ray Terry) 12. MDK Thanks (Howard Kicks) 13. RE: MDK Thanks (Ray) 14. Fw: [The_Dojang] Re: Pavel Tsatsouline (WTSDA Bruce) 15. another staph story (Don Kirsch) 16. Five years later (The_Dojang) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: sidtkd@aol.com Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 16:33:25 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan, Soo Bahk Do, Tang Soo Do Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I lat trained in Moo Duk kwan in 1964 under Grm. Dr. Richard Chun. I have since changed over to taekwondo where I hold 3rd dan rank. My question is, what are the names of the forms from white belt to black belt under MDK TSD and are they different from those in MDK WTF? Sid --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] MDK To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 13:43:48 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > > ... I remeber you said you visited the HQ in NJ and watched > > HC Hwang KJN teach. Why did you not participate? > > I was asked, but I did not have a dobak with me. I was in the Newark area on > business and did not pack a uniform. But I'm not really sure what your point > is. That I would not be asked? Nope, HC Hwang asked when I told him that > I was MDK. He also introduced me to the class of about 20 and individually > to the two top ranks present. I lied, correction... As I was working out this morning and thinking back to this visit to HC Hwang's studio I remembered exactly how it went. I did not have a dobok with me, but... I had a difficult time locating his class as it was in a racquetball gym. The address matched, (20 something street, as I recall), but I was not expecting to find a racquetball gym there. Anyway I walked in and was directed by the front desk to go downstairs, I think. It was a fair size room with HC Hwang about ready to begin the class. As Master Hwang walked over to me I explained that I was MDK, TKD MDK. That my first TKD instructor was a student of his father in the infamous railroad dojang in Seoul back in the late 1950s or early 60s. He thanked me from coming and said that evening would not be a typical class. The SBD national(?) tourny was coming up in a week or so (in Cherry Hill as I recall) and they were going to do a sparring review. He stated that I would be welcome to join the class, if I wanted, but that I would not get much out of it since they were just going to review point sparring strategy. I explained that I didn't have a dobok with me anyway, so no problem. He then asked one, maybe it was two, of his master ranked students to come over and he introduced me to them. I cannot recall the names. I sat off to one side and watched the class. This was probably about eight or so years ago. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 15:50:15 -0500 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Pavel Tsatsouline Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<< Anyone here familier with Pavel Tsatsouline's workout routines? Anyone have comments regarding them? He has a number of books/DVDs and I'm curious to what he teaches, etc. The Martial Power program looks very interesting, but then it might just be the advertising.... Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks,>>> Alain, I'm not one of these people that thinks everything begins and ends with Pavel (and there are many that do), but I will say that I am a huge fan of his work. I have had several of his books, and I have found them to be useful and informative. Here's a few quick reviews... Power to the People - this was Pavel's first book on strength training. It is a minimalist routine that revolves around the deadlift and the side press. He covers many important strength related concepts...periodization, tension, breathing, the nervous system, different types of muscle growth, etc. PTTP is a good program for the ultra busy person that wants to build total body strength in as little time as possible. It's also good for martial artists since the workouts are very short and non-fatiguing in nature. It's worth a read, and a refreshing insight for most of us that grew up reading "Muscle & Fiction". Naked Warrior - this is Pavel taking the same concepts from PTTP and applying them to bodyweight training. Again, it is a minimalist routine that seeks to build total body strength with as few moves and as little time as possible. The exercises are the one arm pushup and the one-legged squat (pistol). Pavel does a good job of expanding on the ideas from PTTP, and one is left with a program that is ideal for someone that wants to build functional strength and master their own bodyweight. Super Joints - best book on joint mobility that I have ever seen. Essential reading for the aging athlete or martial artist. Simple but incredibly useful information. Bullet Proof Abs - this is my least favorite book. It's basically an infomercial for his "Ab Pavelizer" or whatever he calls it. However, there are other useful exercises and concepts in the book. Recommended if you can get it used. Relax into Stretch - nice flexibility book. Teaches one how to tap into the nervous system's ability to relax the muscle. Good info...good stretching info. I'm not a stretching freak so I never got a lot out of it. The Russian Kettlebell Challenge - this was his first big kettlebell book and video. Good introduction to the history and basic exercises. Better products have been put out on KB's since then by both Pavel and others (Steve Cotter, Mike Mahler, Steve Maxwell, etc). I haven't read 'Enter the Kettlebell' but I hear that it's much more useful than this original book. Beyond Bodybuilding - I haven't seen the whole book since I only ordered the first section in e-book format. What I have is good. Good information...a breath of fresh air compared to what's sold at the local newsstand (which is garbage). Good blend of old school knowledge and cutting edge science. The thing I like about Pavel is that he is very entrenched in the "old school/just do it/be a man" flavor of training, but yet he backs up everything he says with science and research. He's very much out to make a buck, but I think he earns his money the right way and gives people their money's worth (as long as people will apply what he teaches). He's a funny guy and the "Evil Russian" routine is a bit stupid, but one could do far worse than look at this guy's products and start to incorporate his movements and concepts. Pavel's alright in my book. --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 16:01:35 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] MDK Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray I am not really surprised that HC Hwang KJN would invite you to train in a class, however how many classes would he alllow you to train in do you think before asking you to join the Moo Duk Kwan Federation. Second you were not born into the Moo Duk Kwan family. You signed up. Then you left. JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 16:07:44 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Staph Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net At our do-Jang my wife runs a sun tanning salon in the front of the school along with a pro shop/gift shop. We have a girl that works for us mop the mats with the same solution we required by the state of Texas for cleaning tanning beds. It is made by Australian Gold and is called ph Neutral Disinfectant Cleaner. It contains Antibacterial, Antimicrobial Disinfectant cleaner----Sanitizer-Fungicide-mildestat virucide-deodorizer for hospitals. It is a concentrate that is effective in hard water up to 400PPM We have never had a case of any infections JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 16:44:49 -0500 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] Second MMA fight this past Saturday Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I had my second MMA fight this past Saturday night. Interesting to say the least. As usual, I took it on short notice. I got the call on Tuesday night and decided to go ahead and take it. I was at the beginning of a training cycle to get ready for my fight in late October, and I was already feeling very strong and my endurance was better than it's been in months. I was told that the guy was experienced but not that great, and that it would be a good tune up match during my layoff between fights. So, I took it. Last time I gave up 17 lbs to the other guy. This guy was bigger too, but I really don't know by how much (they either didn't announce the weights, or I didn't pay attention). I weighed in at 182. Middleweight feels good for me. I'm much faster and more explosive with my bodyweight being down, but I'm still able to carry a lot of muscle and keep my strength high. The first round went very well. For whatever reason, I couldn't let my hands go (they felt frozen this time) so we quickly clenched and I got a big takedown off of a leg trip and into the mounted position. I had solid control...good head and arm control...used the grapevines to thwart his attempts to bridge and roll. He was stuck hard. He was a bit slippery and game on the bottom so I could never get a valid submission attempt going. Finally, at about 45 seconds left in the round he was able to bridge, and he ended up in my guard. He was gassed bad, so I just waited out the round and let him struggle in my guard. I won the first round easy, and I didn't want to make a stupid mistake. Second round started and AGAIN I just felt scared to let my hands go (everybody wants to see me knock people out, and I think it causes performance anxiety...I've got to figure it out). Anyway, he tries to punch but I shield well and force the clench. He actually catches me with a solid punch to the midsection while we're clenched, and then another one to the chin. My head is full of concrete so it's no problem. I hit him with some good knees, and start using my elbows to block his punches. I force myself closer in the clench and try to take his back from the standing position. During the struggle he loses balance and I pull him to the ground as I take his back. As soon as we hit the mat he turns into me as hard as he can, but I stop his turn by going underneath his right arm with my own right and then catching his head and arm in an arm triangle choke. I make a smart move by going to my right side and putting him in a tight guard position...from here I start to stretch him out and tighten the grip. I can hear him struggling to breathe and get out as I continue to try and get it tighter. For a moment, I thought he would get out, but it was just too much for him. I finally get my grip set like I want it, and stretch his body out with my legs one last time. He finally taps. He was a tough guy, but conditioning makes all the difference in these things. He was done after that first round. It felt good to win again...my friends and training partners were kidding and saying that now I've got a matching set, one KO and one submission. I've got to figure out the puzzle with my strikes. I haven't done any stand-up sparring since my last fight (just shadowboxing and focus mitts), and I think that's a missing piece of the puzzle. My grappling felt strong, and the guy just couldn't do much with me. My technique and composure has come a long way in the last few months (for whatever reason), and I take pride in my level of conditioning. That's my ace in the hole right there. Anyway, just sharing the experience. Thanks for listening. --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan, Soo Bahk Do, Tang Soo Do To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 14:48:13 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I lat trained in Moo Duk kwan in 1964 under Grm. Dr. Richard Chun. Was he teaching TKD at the time? Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Frank Clay" To: Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 18:18:09 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] MRSA Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dakin, As someone in the healthcare industry, our briefings have indicated that MRSA-CA is becoming more prevalent. Gyms are becoming one of the biggest hotbeds of infection. Certain ethnicities are by far more susceptible. I am a native American and have genetic predisposition to catching the stuff. I'm not a carrier but I'll catch it in a NY second. Brian, Great advice except for one thing: 25% of the population are carriers of the stuff and may never have a symptom and may never get it. In the variant I got, it manifested as folliculitis and looked like a standard pimple... cept suddenly they turn into boils and multiply. Common areas are in the arm pits and other areas subject to moisture buildup. Short story is if you have mats,you should be cleaning them with a minimum 1% NaCl solution. If you have any metal that has had contact with that solution, wipe it with a 70% IPA solution to neutralize, otherwise it will oxidize. This is similar to the protocol that we use to clean things for transport into aseptic manufacturing areas. I think autoclaving your mats, might be a bit on the out side :). Hope this helps. f. --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] MDK To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 15:25:50 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I am not really surprised that HC Hwang KJN would invite you to train in a > class, however how many classes would he alllow you to train in do you think > before asking you to join the Moo Duk Kwan Federation. I'm sure Master Hwang would have asked me to pay to learn SBD at some point. He wasn't there teaching for free, to the best of my knowledge. > Second you were not born into the Moo Duk Kwan family. You signed up. Then you > left. Nope, sorry, 33 years ago I did not sign-up for anything. But 30 years ago I became MDK and there is nothing that I or anyone can now do to change that. You can't sign up for it, you have to earn it. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 19:04:49 -0400 From: Vernon Noble To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] MDK Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray wrote: >> I am not really surprised that HC Hwang KJN would invite you to train in a >> class, however how many classes would he alllow you to train in do you think >> before asking you to join the Moo Duk Kwan Federation. >> > > I'm sure Master Hwang would have asked me to pay to learn SBD at some point. > He wasn't there teaching for free, to the best of my knowledge. > > >> Second you were not born into the Moo Duk Kwan family. You signed up. Then you >> left. >> > > Nope, sorry, 33 years ago I did not sign-up for anything. But 30 years ago > I became MDK and there is nothing that I or anyone can now do to change that. > You can't sign up for it, you have to earn it. > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang > > Why don't you gentlemen speak of the matters privately, instead of airing this point out in public?? I think that senior rank should support each other in this fashion. V. Noble TSD MDK or TSD, if you prefer --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 16:13:58 -0700 From: "Ray Terry" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] California Junior Taekwondo Chip Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net California Junior Taekwondo Chip Saturday, September 30 Titan Gym Cal State University 800 N. State College Blvd Fullerton, CA More info: 909.595.9222 --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "Howard Kicks" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 23:18:30 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] MDK Thanks Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net A great big hardkick thank you goes out to Master Terry. Thank you for explaining the true meaning of being a member of a kwan family. HK _________________________________________________________________ Call friends with PC-to-PC calling -- FREE http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=en-us&source=wlmailtagline --__--__-- Message: 13 From: Ray Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] MDK Thanks To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 17:02:40 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Thank you for explaining the true meaning of being a member of a kwan > family. It is just one view, my view (and perhaps that of several others). Doesn't mean it is correct... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 14 From: "WTSDA Bruce" To: Subject: Fw: [The_Dojang] Re: Pavel Tsatsouline Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 19:09:42 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Had a 4 hour training seminar with Pavel a few years ago. Very high speed instructor, with some very good ideas. Uses a medicine ball, with a handle (called a bell ?), for his work outs. I took out of his class a few good points, I apply them to my weight lifting work outs. Breath out while pushing/pulling the weight, grip the bar tight, and flex your lower abdomen during the push/pull. I also apply the lower abdomen flex while doing push ups, adds a few to the total. He spoke a lot about flexibility, as noted below, it is one of his fields of instruction. Very important as we get older to stay flexible. I was impressed with his instruction. He is not as big as Arnold, but I bet he could kick his ...... Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stovall, Craig" To: Sent: Monday, September 11, 2006 3:50 PM Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Pavel Tsatsouline > <<< Anyone here familier with Pavel Tsatsouline's workout routines? > Anyone have comments regarding them? He has a number of books/DVDs and > I'm curious to what he teaches, etc. The Martial Power program looks > very interesting, but then it might just be the advertising.... > > > > Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks,>>> > > > > Alain, > > > > I'm not one of these people that thinks everything begins and ends with > Pavel (and there are many that do), but I will say that I am a huge fan > of his work. I have had several of his books, and I have found them to > be useful and informative. Here's a few quick reviews... > > > > Power to the People - this was Pavel's first book on strength training. > It is a minimalist routine that revolves around the deadlift and the > side press. He covers many important strength related > concepts...periodization, tension, breathing, the nervous system, > different types of muscle growth, etc. PTTP is a good program for the > ultra busy person that wants to build total body strength in as little > time as possible. It's also good for martial artists since the workouts > are very short and non-fatiguing in nature. It's worth a read, and a > refreshing insight for most of us that grew up reading "Muscle & > Fiction". > > > > Naked Warrior - this is Pavel taking the same concepts from PTTP and > applying them to bodyweight training. Again, it is a minimalist routine > that seeks to build total body strength with as few moves and as little > time as possible. The exercises are the one arm pushup and the > one-legged squat (pistol). Pavel does a good job of expanding on the > ideas from PTTP, and one is left with a program that is ideal for > someone that wants to build functional strength and master their own > bodyweight. > > > > Super Joints - best book on joint mobility that I have ever seen. > Essential reading for the aging athlete or martial artist. Simple but > incredibly useful information. > > > > Bullet Proof Abs - this is my least favorite book. It's basically an > infomercial for his "Ab Pavelizer" or whatever he calls it. However, > there are other useful exercises and concepts in the book. Recommended > if you can get it used. > > > > Relax into Stretch - nice flexibility book. Teaches one how to tap into > the nervous system's ability to relax the muscle. Good info...good > stretching info. I'm not a stretching freak so I never got a lot out of > it. > > > > The Russian Kettlebell Challenge - this was his first big kettlebell > book and video. Good introduction to the history and basic exercises. > Better products have been put out on KB's since then by both Pavel and > others (Steve Cotter, Mike Mahler, Steve Maxwell, etc). I haven't read > 'Enter the Kettlebell' but I hear that it's much more useful than this > original book. > > > > Beyond Bodybuilding - I haven't seen the whole book since I only ordered > the first section in e-book format. What I have is good. Good > information...a breath of fresh air compared to what's sold at the local > newsstand (which is garbage). Good blend of old school knowledge and > cutting edge science. > > > > The thing I like about Pavel is that he is very entrenched in the "old > school/just do it/be a man" flavor of training, but yet he backs up > everything he says with science and research. He's very much out to > make a buck, but I think he earns his money the right way and gives > people their money's worth (as long as people will apply what he > teaches). > > > > He's a funny guy and the "Evil Russian" routine is a bit stupid, but one > could do far worse than look at this guy's products and start to > incorporate his movements and concepts. Pavel's alright in my book. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 15 From: "Don Kirsch" To: "the_dojang" Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 19:26:09 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] another staph story Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Burdick I'm glad to hear you are healing from your bout with staph. To make a long story short I have a 22 yr. old son who got shot in the chest with a pellet gun this summer (the long story part). He dug the pellet out of his chest and didn't pay any attention to "sound health and hygiene common sense". About a week later he contracted a form of staph in his chest. With the right medical treatment he was able to stop the infection with no serious consequences. The various forms of staph lurking out there are a definite health concern. I think it's interesting to note the way antibiotics work. The antibiotics only keep the bacterial lode at a manageable level. It's the bodies white cells and natural cellular defense mechanisms that actually destroys the bacterial infection. It helps to have a strong body and "right mind" when dealing with bacterial infections. Regards, Don Kirsch "Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft." Theodore Roosevelt --__--__-- Message: 16 Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 20:06:28 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Five years later Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sandy Berry: Flight attendant earned black belt September 11th / Five years later Monday, September 11, 2006 Pittsburg Post-Gazette Sandy Berry, 59, of Moon, has been a flight attendant for American Airlines since she graduated from its "Stewardess College" in 1969 and has flown international routes since 1988. Having returned from Manchester, England, on Sept. 10, 2001, she was awakened early the next morning by calls from a co-worker who told her, "One of our airplanes just went into the World Trade Center. Go turn on the TV." Here's her story, as told to Post-Gazette reporter Bob Batz Jr. Oh, absolutely it changed me. I was supposed to go to Paris the following Friday. I did not go. The company did not make you go. In my records, the reason for my absence is "Act of God." I finally went back 10 days later. But I was scared. Flying home from my Chicago base, a Middle Eastern-looking guy sat beside me. I felt bad for how everyone stared at him, but I was twitchy, too. When he turned off my reading light, I raised my pen like a knife and said, "That's my light! Leave it alone!" That's when I realized I had to do something. Suddenly we flight attendants were the last line of defense, because that cockpit is never opening again. But we didn't get extra training, not even plastic handcuffs and tape, until later. So in January 2002 I called Master Janet Taylor at Just For Kicks martial arts school in Moon. My fellow flight attendant and friend Dot Sawyer and I took a self-defense class, then started taking tang soo do. We loved it. By that April, I'd learned enough that I could go back to work. I had some control again. It was gnarly, but I have stuck with martial arts, and after four years, this July, I received my first-degree black belt. Me, who only thought of belts as fashionable. Now there's no doubt in my mind that I can defend myself and take someone down. I've stuck with my job, too, but on Dec. 1 I'm retiring at 60. That's early, and definitely because of 9/11 and how it changed the industry and the world and me. I have to be vigilant at all times. It's the fear of terrorism. You don't know how or when. Before 9/11, my job was a fun job that I went to and had a good time. Even the unruly passengers I kind of enjoyed, because I knew they would end up doing it my way. It's not fun anymore. And now the terrorists are going to blow me up with a camera flash and a bottle of Evian water? There was a time I'd lost my sense of humor, but I've found it. I'm very cynically funny. Some people get it and some people don't. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest