Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 16:26:28 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 13 #386 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Use of name Taekwondo (Dana Vaillancourt) 2. MDK 1964 (Johnnie Rouse) 3. immue v resistent (Frank Clay) 4. Past MDK practitioners (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 5. Yudo in New York? (Master Lugo) 6. Re: Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 (Joseph Cheavens) 7. I guess I should be dead... (The_Dojang) 8. Re: Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 (John Chambers) 9. RE: immue v resistant (David P. Zapencki) 10. Gumdo (The_Dojang) 11. Re: Pavel Tsatsouline (aburrese@aol.com) 12. Re: Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 (steven riggs) 13. Re: Past MDK practitioners (steven riggs) 14. Re: Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 (steven riggs) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Dana Vaillancourt" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 11:33:08 +0000 Subject: [The_Dojang] Use of name Taekwondo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net It was with some interest that I read the earlier debate on the early use of the name Taekwondo. In checking back in some of the history references, the first appearance of the name seems clear, but not necessarily its common usage. Although the term Taekwondo seems to have been used as early as 1955, primarily by the Chung Do Kwan and Oh Do Kwan, the first Korea Taekwondo Association was not formed until 1959. This shortly dissolved after the military coup in 1961 and the Korea Taesoodo Association was formed. At the time it appears what we refer to as Taekwondo was still using different names such as Kong Soo Do, Tang Soo Do, Soo Bahk Do, and Taekwondo. In 1965, there was a Unification Declaration Ceremony, and General CHOI, Hong Hi used his clout to change the name of the art from Taesoodo to Taekwondo (back to Korea Taekwondo Association). His dictatorial methods were not appreciated and he was forced to resign. CHOI then turned around and formed the ITF in March 1966. The Kukkiwon opened in 1972 and to assist in unification and in 1976, the Korea Taekwondo Association eliminated the names of the Kwans and replaced them with numbers. Of course, we know the kwans are around and not just numbers. So, depending upon your Kwan, the name Taekwondo could have been used as early as 1955 or c. 1965. Thanks for that debate as the answer really was not as clear cut as I thought. Sorry for the duplication of any material in previous posts. Dana --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Johnnie Rouse" To: Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 08:48:49 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] MDK 1964 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Joe wrote, >Very interesting article about the politics behind >unification/standardization of Taekwondo. >Personally, I believe that unification of the kwan was an overall >negative >thing, especially after reading about the way the younger generation >cut out >the older generation. So much for "respect your elders." Hi Joe I can see where your coming from on the respect issue, however there were issues at stake that were bigger than one or two people. Some of these folks were in the most untenable possession imaginable at the time. I'm just glad it wasn't me. I personal know that any hard feeling between Kwang Kee, and Hong, Chong Soo were reconciled between them later on. I know this may really start a fire storm, and that is not my intention here, but I'm not convinced that the MDK split wasn't Kwang Kee's way of having his cake and eating too. I mean that in a good way, but I'm sure I'll probably get plastered for saying it. I personally support the unification effort then and now. I think TKD has benefited greatly as a result. Yes, of course there or pro's and con's associated, but IMO more pro's. The debate over TKD unification will go on and out last us all. I think a good healthy debate keeps you on your toe's. Johnnie Rouse --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Frank Clay" To: Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 07:23:55 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] immue v resistent Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dave, You said <> You mean resistant not immune. It still works, its just much harder and this is a trend they are worried about. The clinical study I was a part of is for a new more powerful antibiotic. Gets injected through a chest pick line and is no fun. If you ask me, that level of treatment is almost as bad as the illness. Hygiene will definitely help but some people will just catch it no matter what you do. Most dojangs I have been in are very clean and I think unlikely places for CA-MRSA to reside but that doesn't mean we need to drop our vigilance. I think though that the schools at risk are more along the Hapkido/Yudo genre because doboks have a tendency to be displaced and flesh on flesh is where its most likely to be transmitted though it can be picked up from surfaces. No matter how you slice it, its scary stuff. f. --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: "the_dojang" Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 09:34:09 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Past MDK practitioners Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Riggs The man you are looking for Master Conde. Do you know if he was ever issued a Dan Bon By Hwang Kee KJN. I may be able to track him if he has a dan number, or who was his instructor. JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: 14 Sep 2006 14:51:36 -0000 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net From: "Master Lugo" Subject: [The_Dojang] Yudo in New York? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Your welcome to come by my school, we do teach Hapkido, JuJutsu and Judo tecniques..... Lugo Blackbeltfitnesscenter.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Yudo in New York? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello: I posted this about a week ago when I signed on to this mailing list but haven't yet seen the post. My apologies for the repetition, if any. I was wondering if anyone knows of any Korean Yudo schools in Manhattan or Flushing, NY. Any leads would be appreciated, as I am interested in learning the art. Thank you! --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Joseph Cheavens" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 10:02:56 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Steven, when did you move out of Lancaster? I had a friend in college in the '80s, Chris Doane, who was a MDK black belt from Lancaster. Joe Cheavens --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 12:00:56 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] I guess I should be dead... Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Do Electric Fans Cause Death? By Kang Shin-who Staff Reporter The Korea Times When he studied in Hong Kong, Chang Hyukmin, 29, often quarreled with his Japanese roommate over the running of electric fans at night. Chang believed that an electric fan left on through the night in a closed room could result in death. But his roommate had never heard anything like it. Korean news sources regularly report on cases of "fan death" every summer and this year several incidents have reportedly occurred. Fan death accidents on news reports are categorized into two areas _ one with regard to fire from a fan overheating and the other, suffocation or hypothermia. Many Korean medical professionals accept the explanation of suffocation or hypothermia caused by a fan. "Excessive exposure to electric fan breezes for long hours in an enclosed rooms lowers people's temperature and hinders blood circulation. And it could lead to the paralysis of heart and lungs," said Hyun Hye-yun, a doctor. "To prevent this, one should keep the windows open and not expose oneself directly to air from the fan," she added. However, foreigners pour scorn on this. "It is very funny that electric fans cause death. I turn on an electric fan or airconditioner all the time when I sleep, and I am still alive. That is a local legend found only in South Korea," said Chong Yak from Singapore. Since Singapore is subtropical, Singaporeans use fans and air conditioners all the year round. There are three theories believed about fan death. The first one is that fans cause hypothermia: As the metabolism slows at night, the body becomes more sensitive to temperature, and supposedly more prone to hypothermia. If a fan is left on all night in a sealed and enclosed room, it will lower the temperature of the room to the point that it can cause hypothermia. The second theory is suffocation. It is believed that if the fan is put directly in front of a sleeping person's face, it will create a vacuum preventing the person from breathing properly. The third one is that fans use up oxygen creating fatal levels of carbon dioxide in the room. While many people in Korea have believed these theories for a long time, some are beginning to refute them. Regarding the hypothermia theory, they explain that this only occurs when the body's core temperature drops below normal, and will not be caused simply by decreasing the body's surface temperature. With the suffocation matter, they ask those who believe in fan death why skydivers or people who stick their head out of moving car's windows don't die from the "vacuum effect." For the last theory they note that regular fans don't create or cause chemical reactions. Experts blame the media for spreading lies and misleading the public. "Korean reporters are constantly writing inaccurate articles about 'death by fan,' describing these deaths as being caused by the fan. That's why it seems that fan deaths only happen in Korea, when in reality these types of deaths are quite rare. They should have reported the victim's original problems such as heart or lung disease, which are the main cause of death in these cases," said Lee Yoon-song, a professor at Seoul National University's medical school. "If a Western doctor investigated these deaths, he would say what really caused the death, and say that the fan was merely beside the victim," he added. --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "John Chambers" To: Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 15:08:46 -0400 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Steven: There are 69 Francisco Conde listed in the U.S. Was his middle initial "T"? If so, he lives in Lawrence, MA. Go to internet (White Pages) and type in his name at Baltimore, MA. They will ALL pop up. One has to be him. Would he be about 57 years of age? If so, that is the one in Lawrence, MA. Hope this helps. John Chambers ----- Original Message ----- From: "steven riggs" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 10:38 PM Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 >I would like to ask if anyone knows the location of an old instructor of >mine. Grandmaster Francisco Conde taught me in the Lancaster PA area in the >1970's and I moved out of state and lost contact. At one time he was in the >Baltimore area but I was told he had moved. While some consider him a >controversial figure he was my teacher and I learned a great deal from him. >Steven > > Ray wrote: > I never wrote before, but I seen a sort > of family air around, I'm From >> Venezuela, My master's school name is Moo Duk Kwan, it was a legacy from >> his >> master Mr. Lee Chon Koo, (8 dan) who actually lives in New York If any of >> you know something about him (Mr. Lee Chon Koo) or the history of the >> school >> (Moo Duk Kwan), please let me know, I want know about the roots and >> history >> of it. > > For MDK info see Chapter 1, Section 3 of: > > http://martialartsresource.com/anonftp/pub/the_dojang/digests/history.html > > Also search the document at that URL for other references to Hwang Kee. > Excellent info. > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang > > > > Sensei Steven Riggs > Senior Instructor > American Defensive Arts > stevencriggs@yahoo.com > www.americandefensivearts.org > 828-322-6904 > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "David P. Zapencki" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] immue v resistant Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 15:25:40 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Semantics aside, it is a very scary proposition. Also, I don't know if the average person is aware of the fact that, once acquired, these infections are never "cured". The person who has been successfully treated will always be a reservoir for the pathogen, although they do not have a current infection, the bug still resides on and in their persons... One more thing to worry about... Dave -----Original Message----- From: Frank Clay [mailto:frankclay@msn.com] Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 6:24 AM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] immue v resistent Dave, You said <> You mean resistant not immune. It still works, its just much harder and this is a trend they are worried about. The clinical study I was a part of is for a new more powerful antibiotic. Gets injected through a chest pick line and is no fun. If you ask me, that level of treatment is almost as bad as the illness. Hygiene will definitely help but some people will just catch it no matter what you do. Most dojangs I have been in are very clean and I think unlikely places for CA-MRSA to reside but that doesn't mean we need to drop our vigilance. I think though that the schools at risk are more along the Hapkido/Yudo genre because doboks have a tendency to be displaced and flesh on flesh is where its most likely to be transmitted though it can be picked up from surfaces. No matter how you slice it, its scary stuff. f. _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 13:38:05 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Gumdo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Swords draw kids to Gumdo By Matt Thurber The Salt Lake Tribune For many kids enrolled in the ancient martial art form of Gumdo, it's the ninja-like appeal luring them to the sport. From middle school to college-age students, Utah is well represented in the Gumdo world. Earlier this summer, five local students traveled to Pyeongchang, South Korea, to compete in the Gumdo World Championships. Unlike traditional martial arts like Karate or Tae Kwon Do, Gumdo's entire focus is the sword. From cutting bamboo to agility drills measuring speed and grace, the art form is growing in popularity in studios along the Wasatch Front. While the five students and their master instructor, Marshall Parnell, anticipated strong competition at the Gumdo event hosting 20,000 international participants, none of them could have predicted the political and geographical unrest upon their arrival. Whether it was North Korea missile threats or a tsunami that claimed more than 100 lives just a week before the championships, the group learned about adversity well beyond their experiences on the mat. Having spent six years in the Marines and also learning under a grandmaster in South Korea, Parnell feels teaching Gumdo to help students excel in life has been one of his greatest rewards. "In this discipline, ultimately it's the sword that shapes the kind of person you want to become. I think these students are generally a little more open-minded because they learn in traditional and philosophical ways," said Parnell, who operates the Lotus Blossom Martial Arts School in Orem. "Gumdo does so much for an individual in terms of confidence and self-image. I think it's the 'I can do it' attitude that helps them develop character and overcome obstacles." As an honors student with a 3.9 GPA at Orem High School, Elena Boucher worked at a Harmon's supermarket and mowed neighbors' lawns to fund her excursion to the Gumdo Championships, where she took home a bronze medal. "The best part of the trip was training with Korean masters in these arena settings," said the 17-year-old, who recently returned from a Gumdo demonstration on the UC Berkeley college campus. "I haven't personally had any friends join a Gumdo class, but I think they have fun coming out to watch me in the competitions." Other Gumdo competitors from this year's group include 12-year-old black belt Eric Wilson from Oak Canyon Middle School in Lindon. Wilson says it's the "running around and cutting things" he enjoys most about Gumdo. In addition to the younger kids from the Lotus Blossom group, older students like Leana Fierrara, an exchange student from British Columbia, won in a national division, but did not advance to the international finals. Also, Parnell's younger brother Ken, a 23-year-old student from BYU, took silver at the national level. And serving as an elder statesman in the bunch, 32-year-old Felipe Quintana reflects on the challenges of traveling to a foreign country. "I've been to South Korea twice since taking up Gumdo and it's always kind of strange and almost like a culture shock from the moment you step off the plane," said Quintana, who took gold on the national level. "Nobody really knows how hard it is when you don't speak the native language. You can pick up of hints what people are saying and understand gestures, but overall, it's a whole different experience." Gumdo Classes Besides the main facility in Orem, Gumdo classes are also taught in Centerville, Midvale and Salt Lake City, at various martial arts academies. --__--__-- Message: 11 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 18:12:55 -0500 From: aburrese@aol.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Pavel Tsatsouline Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Craig, Thank you for the information and reviews of Pavel's works! Bruce, Thank you for your insights regarding the seminar as well! Alain www.burrese.com For Your Safety - For Your Success ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 16:27:57 -0700 (PDT) From: steven riggs Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thank you for the assistance. His middle name is Esteban. He is closer to 70. I appreciate your suggestions and will try them out. Steven John Chambers wrote: Steven: There are 69 Francisco Conde listed in the U.S. Was his middle initial "T"? If so, he lives in Lawrence, MA. Go to internet (White Pages) and type in his name at Baltimore, MA. They will ALL pop up. One has to be him. Would he be about 57 years of age? If so, that is the one in Lawrence, MA. Hope this helps. John Chambers ----- Original Message ----- From: "steven riggs" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 10:38 PM Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 >I would like to ask if anyone knows the location of an old instructor of >mine. Grandmaster Francisco Conde taught me in the Lancaster PA area in the >1970's and I moved out of state and lost contact. At one time he was in the >Baltimore area but I was told he had moved. While some consider him a >controversial figure he was my teacher and I learned a great deal from him. >Steven > > Ray wrote: > I never wrote before, but I seen a sort > of family air around, I'm From >> Venezuela, My master's school name is Moo Duk Kwan, it was a legacy from >> his >> master Mr. Lee Chon Koo, (8 dan) who actually lives in New York If any of >> you know something about him (Mr. Lee Chon Koo) or the history of the >> school >> (Moo Duk Kwan), please let me know, I want know about the roots and >> history >> of it. > > For MDK info see Chapter 1, Section 3 of: > > http://martialartsresource.com/anonftp/pub/the_dojang/digests/history.html > > Also search the document at that URL for other references to Hwang Kee. > Excellent info. > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang > > > > Sensei Steven Riggs > Senior Instructor > American Defensive Arts > stevencriggs@yahoo.com > www.americandefensivearts.org > 828-322-6904 > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Sensei Steven Riggs Senior Instructor American Defensive Arts stevencriggs@yahoo.com www.americandefensivearts.org 828-322-6904 --------------------------------- Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Yahoo! Small Business. --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 16:45:43 -0700 (PDT) From: steven riggs Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Past MDK practitioners To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I believe earlier in his martial arts career he was issued dan ranking by Kwang Jan Nim Kee. Just loose talk around the dojang back in the early 70's. As I recall the rank or ranks would have been 1st thru 4th as in the later 60's some people teaching Moo Duk Kwan Tang Soo Do started pulling away from Korean run organizations. I know those events were highly controversial but I was there and they did happen. I know his 8th & 9th dan ranks were issued by Master Ed Parker from CA. Those certificates I personally saw hanging on the wall in the office. Master Parker and grandmaster Conde had developed a friendship from years past. Some facts I am very unclear on such as but I had the impression that that friendship may have started back in Hawaii where master Parker is from. My teacher was a very private man so many of these pieces of information are unclear to me. Thank you to those who have offered assistance. Another one of my instructors studied under Jae Chul Shin for some period of time and then for a reason I don't know, left him and went to Conde. Many unanswered questions that as I look back at 35 years in the arts I keep getting students asking questions about those days that I don't have all the answers for. Thanks to everyone once again. Steven Gladewater SooBahkDo wrote: Mr. Riggs The man you are looking for Master Conde. Do you know if he was ever issued a Dan Bon By Hwang Kee KJN. I may be able to track him if he has a dan number, or who was his instructor. JCGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Sensei Steven Riggs Senior Instructor American Defensive Arts stevencriggs@yahoo.com www.americandefensivearts.org 828-322-6904 --------------------------------- Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2006 16:49:59 -0700 (PDT) From: steven riggs Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Moo Duk Kwan-1964 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I began studying Moo Duk Kwan Tang Soo Do in Sept of 1973 from Roger Bradley but the promotion certificates were signed by Francisco Conde. I studied under 3 different instructors in those years for reasons not relevent here. I joined Millersville Township Police Dept in 1978 and taught local officers basic self defense and impact weapons. In Feb of 1979 I moved to Hickory, NC to join the police force here. Steven (There were 3 colleges in Lancaster at that time. I graduated from Lancaster Bible College in 1977) Joseph Cheavens wrote: Steven, when did you move out of Lancaster? I had a friend in college in the '80s, Chris Doane, who was a MDK black belt from Lancaster. Joe Cheavens _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Sensei Steven Riggs Senior Instructor American Defensive Arts stevencriggs@yahoo.com www.americandefensivearts.org 828-322-6904 --------------------------------- All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest