Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:58:58 -0800 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 14 #19 - 10 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,100 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. gun stuff (Hapkidoman5@wmconnect.com) 2. RE: gun stuff (Rick Clark) 3. RE: gun stuff (michael tomlinson) 4. GUNS V/S KMA (Gordon) 5. RE: GUNS V/S KMA (michael tomlinson) 6. RE: GUNS V/S KMA (Cayson, Clint) 7. WTF Holds 3rd Electronic Protector Demo (The_Dojang) 8. RE: GUNS V/S KMA (harold stabe) 9. RE: GUNS V/S KMA (michael tomlinson) 10. RE: GUNS V/S KMA (Jye nigma) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Hapkidoman5@wmconnect.com Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 07:14:59 EST To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] gun stuff Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I'm trying to work out the connection between shooting handguns and traditional KMA and I can't. I guess it's a US thing. Bob I see it this way, rock,stick, stone knife, stone spear,stone axe,Bow and arrow,bronze knife, bronze spear,bronze axe,bow and arrow,then all with steele, then some alchemist discovered black powder,cannons,hand held cannons,wheel locks ,match locks,flint locks,cap and ball,rifle,cartridge guns, its evolution in self protection. Kurtis --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:22:09 -0500 From: "Rick Clark" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] gun stuff To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi Bob, >I'm trying to work out the connection between shooting handguns and traditional KMA and I can't. I guess it's a US thing. > >Bob The shotgun pictured below is manufactured by Daewoo and is an example of the modern "Royal Court" weapons :-) This is as traditional as some KMA who is telling folks that nunchaku are "traditional" Korean weapons . . . . . Rick Clark www.ao-denkou-kai.org [demime 0.98e removed an attachment of type image/bmp which had a name of Outlook.bmp] --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] gun stuff Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:47:05 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have to agree here....just my opinion but IF you are training in self defense and your training doesn't actually involve some shooting and/or knowledge of firearms then you are like an animal that has their head stuck in the sand....if samurai were around during the times of very good firearms then I am sure they would all be carrying Glocks....or something like that....maybe it's a Hapkido practicality thing but Self Defense IMHO doesn't involve existing restricting historical protocal...if you are apt to be attacked by something then logic tells you to understand and train for that....am I crazy in my thinking????j Michael Tomlinson >From: Hapkidoman5@wmconnect.com >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >Subject: [The_Dojang] gun stuff >Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 07:14:59 EST > >I'm trying to work out the connection between shooting handguns and >traditional KMA and I can't. I guess it's a US thing. > >Bob >I see it this way, rock,stick, stone knife, stone spear,stone axe,Bow and >arrow,bronze knife, bronze spear,bronze axe,bow and arrow,then all with >steele, >then some alchemist discovered black powder,cannons,hand held cannons,wheel >locks ,match locks,flint locks,cap and ball,rifle,cartridge guns, >its evolution in self protection. >Kurtis >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _________________________________________________________________ >From photos to predictions, The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes has it all. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/?icid=nctagline1 --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Gordon" To: Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:05:49 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Michael Tomlinson said: Rick Clark said: In the same manor or thinking, shouldn't we all be training in every style and every weapon that may come our way? Where do you draw the line between tradition and modern practicality? Gordon Okerstrom --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:18:32 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Good question...I personally draw the line just past training with knives, firearms, and all the prior stuff in Hapkido...let's face it...you aren't gonna defend against a sword or nunchukau quite as much as some knucklehead trying to rob you with a small firearm or knife....there is nothing wrong with all the weapons training..so don't take this as disrespectful in any way...I just think you should train for the scenarios you will see the most....everyone has a bladed weapon and the majority of crimes around where I live involve firearms, knives, etc....so I pattern my training for that scenario... Michael Tomlinson >From: "Gordon" >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: >Subject: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA >Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:05:49 -0600 > >Michael Tomlinson said: > >defense and your training doesn't actually involve some shooting and/or >knowledge of firearms then you are like an animal that has their head stuck >in the sand....if samurai were around during the times of very good >firearms >then I am sure they would all be carrying Glocks....or something like >that....maybe it's a Hapkido practicality thing but Self Defense IMHO >doesn't involve existing restricting historical protocal...if you are apt >to >be attacked by something then logic tells you to understand and train for >that....am I crazy in my thinking????j > > Michael Tomlinson> > >Rick Clark said: > >"traditional" Korean weapons . . . . . > >Rick Clark> > >In the same manor or thinking, shouldn't we all be training in every style >and every weapon that may come our way? Where do you draw the line between >tradition and modern practicality? > >Gordon Okerstrom >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _________________________________________________________________ >From photos to predictions, The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes has it all. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/?icid=nctagline1 --__--__-- Message: 6 Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:10:42 -0500 From: "Cayson, Clint" To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I agree with you Michael. Weapons training aren't just for the higher learning or students that are adult enough to understand on how to use weapons (except for guns, of course). In real world, no one will rob you on empty hands... May it be a simple criminal that doesn't have training in martial arts; they even out or take more advantage to the person that they think they can seize. I come from martial arts that the mindset is all weapons training. So, there's nothing wrong with weapons, it is must for all martial artists - just my 2 cents. -------------------------------------- Clint V Cayson -----Original Message----- From: michael tomlinson [mailto:tomlinson_michael@hotmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 2:19 PM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA Good question...I personally draw the line just past training with knives, firearms, and all the prior stuff in Hapkido...let's face it...you aren't gonna defend against a sword or nunchukau quite as much as some knucklehead trying to rob you with a small firearm or knife....there is nothing wrong with all the weapons training..so don't take this as disrespectful in any way...I just think you should train for the scenarios you will see the most....everyone has a bladed weapon and the majority of crimes around where I live involve firearms, knives, etc....so I pattern my training for that scenario... Michael Tomlinson --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:44:19 -0800 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] WTF Holds 3rd Electronic Protector Demo Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net WTF Holds 3rd Electronic Protector Demonstration in Seoul 15 Jan 2007 The World Taekwondo Federation held a demonstration of electronic protector systems in Seoul on Jan. 12, 2007. The WTF-organized demonstration, the third of its kind, attracted two electronic protector manufacturers - Daedo International of Spain and adidas (ATM) of Germany. The two companies which attended the previous demonstration by the WTF on March 25, 2006, failed to pass the WTF-set basic requirements. The one-day demonstration, which took place at Kyung Hee University in Seoul, was conducted before WTF President Chungwon Choue and members of the ad-hoc WTF Electronic Protector Committee. The ad-hoc committee is led by Mr. Soo-nam Park, vice president of the WTF. The nine-member committee includes Mr. Eui-min Ko, chairman of the WTF Technical Committee; and Mr. Hong-ki Kim, chairman of the WTF Refereeing Committee. One day after the demonstration on Jan. 13, the ad-hoc committee held its meeting at the headquarters of the WTF to evaluate the demonstrators' performance. In line with the WTF Reform Report, the WTF set up the ad-hoc committee in July 2005. The report recommended the introduction of a highly effective and accurate electronic protector system as a valuable addition to the sport by helping make judgment more objective. On Sept. 11, 2006, the WTF signed a contract with Korea's LaJUST on the WTF's official electronic protector supplier. The WTF plans to hold a special electronic protector test event in early March in Korea with detailed information to be finalized soon. If the test event concludes successfully, then the electronic protector system will be highly likely to be used at the forthcoming World Taekwondo Championships in May 2007 in Beijing, China, and the 2008 Beijing Olympic Games in Beijing. --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "harold stabe" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:10:40 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net As my Kenpo teacher states "Train like you live and live like you train" We practice defenses against knives, guns, baseball bats,brooms mops,etc. >From: "Gordon" >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: >Subject: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA >Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:05:49 -0600 > >Michael Tomlinson said: > >defense and your training doesn't actually involve some shooting and/or >knowledge of firearms then you are like an animal that has their head stuck >in the sand....if samurai were around during the times of very good >firearms >then I am sure they would all be carrying Glocks....or something like >that....maybe it's a Hapkido practicality thing but Self Defense IMHO >doesn't involve existing restricting historical protocal...if you are apt >to >be attacked by something then logic tells you to understand and train for >that....am I crazy in my thinking????j > > Michael Tomlinson> > >Rick Clark said: > >"traditional" Korean weapons . . . . . > >Rick Clark> > >In the same manor or thinking, shouldn't we all be training in every style >and every weapon that may come our way? Where do you draw the line between >tradition and modern practicality? > >Gordon Okerstrom >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _________________________________________________________________ Get FREE Web site and company branded e-mail from Microsoft Office Live http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/ --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:13:46 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Exactly...because that is what people will attack you with these days....correct?? Michael Tomlinson >From: "harold stabe" >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA >Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:10:40 -0600 > >As my Kenpo teacher states "Train like you live and live like you train" We >practice defenses against knives, guns, baseball bats,brooms mops,etc. > > >>From: "Gordon" >>Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >>To: >>Subject: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA >>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:05:49 -0600 >> >>Michael Tomlinson said: >> >>>defense and your training doesn't actually involve some shooting and/or >>knowledge of firearms then you are like an animal that has their head >>stuck >>in the sand....if samurai were around during the times of very good >>firearms >>then I am sure they would all be carrying Glocks....or something like >>that....maybe it's a Hapkido practicality thing but Self Defense IMHO >>doesn't involve existing restricting historical protocal...if you are apt >>to >>be attacked by something then logic tells you to understand and train for >>that....am I crazy in my thinking????j >> >> Michael Tomlinson> >> >>Rick Clark said: >> >>>"traditional" Korean weapons . . . . . >> >>Rick Clark> >> >>In the same manor or thinking, shouldn't we all be training in every style >>and every weapon that may come our way? Where do you draw the line >>between >>tradition and modern practicality? >> >>Gordon Okerstrom >>_______________________________________________ >>The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >>The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >>Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >>Standard disclaimers apply >>http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get FREE Web site and company branded e-mail from Microsoft Office Live >http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/ >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _________________________________________________________________ Dave vs. Carl: The Insignificant Championship Series.  Who will win? http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwsp0070000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://davevscarl.spaces.live.com/?icid=T001MSN38C07001 --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:01:39 -0800 (PST) From: Jye nigma Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I agree with that point, but I would also train in the other weapons as well because you may be in a dark alley with a broken broom handle and you should be able to use it with the same ability as you have with a gun/knife, etc. Jye michael tomlinson wrote: Good question...I personally draw the line just past training with knives, firearms, and all the prior stuff in Hapkido...let's face it...you aren't gonna defend against a sword or nunchukau quite as much as some knucklehead trying to rob you with a small firearm or knife....there is nothing wrong with all the weapons training..so don't take this as disrespectful in any way...I just think you should train for the scenarios you will see the most....everyone has a bladed weapon and the majority of crimes around where I live involve firearms, knives, etc....so I pattern my training for that scenario... Michael Tomlinson >From: "Gordon" >Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net >To: >Subject: [The_Dojang] GUNS V/S KMA >Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:05:49 -0600 > >Michael Tomlinson said: > >>defense and your training doesn't actually involve some shooting and/or >knowledge of firearms then you are like an animal that has their head stuck >in the sand....if samurai were around during the times of very good >firearms >then I am sure they would all be carrying Glocks....or something like >that....maybe it's a Hapkido practicality thing but Self Defense IMHO >doesn't involve existing restricting historical protocal...if you are apt >to >be attacked by something then logic tells you to understand and train for >that....am I crazy in my thinking????j > > Michael Tomlinson> > >Rick Clark said: > >>"traditional" Korean weapons . . . . . > >Rick Clark> > >In the same manor or thinking, shouldn't we all be training in every style >and every weapon that may come our way? Where do you draw the line between >tradition and modern practicality? > >Gordon Okerstrom >_______________________________________________ >The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members >The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang _________________________________________________________________ >From photos to predictions, The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes has it all. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/?icid=nctagline1 _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,100 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang --------------------------------- Don't pick lemons. See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest