Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 12:56:03 -0700 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 14 #188 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: kma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on plus11.host4u.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,200 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: stripes on a belt (ChunjiDo@aol.com) 2. (no subject) (Gladewater SooBahkDo) 3. RE: (no subject) (Rick Clark) 4. Japanese vs Korean language (aburrese@aol.com) 5. RE: (no subject) (Joseph Cheavens) 6. RE: Turnverein (Burdick, Dakin Robert) 7. Tang Soo Do and Belts. (Curt McCauley) 8. Karate (Ray) 9. Re: belt stripes (J R Hilland) 10. why we wear stripes on our belts (Dugy) 11. Re: why we wear stripes on our belts (Tom) 12. battlecage (Luther Veuleman) 13. Re: Re: myth or truth? no sex while in training (Jeremy Anderson) 14. Re: Re: myth or truth? no sex while in training (Jeremy Anderson) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:36:33 EDT To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: stripes on a belt Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net we use embroidered dan bars/stripes for those coming to our school with dan ranking in a different style. its to show respect for where they've been and their prior commitment to another art. take care, mel Melinda Kidder, Owner Chajonshim Martial Arts & Supply Supply: _www.cjmas.com_ (http://www.cjmas.com/) 1.877.847.4072 School: _www.cjmaa.com_ (http://www.cjmaa.com/) 1.573.445.6636 ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 09:40:56 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The use of the term Kara-Te. First lets look at the meaning of the word. Prior to 1936 in Okinawa the word or term "Kara" ment China and "Te" ment hand or China hand as a referrance that Okinawan martial arts had come from China. In 1936 Funikoshi chnaged the meaning of the term Kara to mean empty so that Karate meant Empty hand. Later after the Japanese occupation of Korea The original 5 Kwans sprang up. Hwang Kee originally called his style Hwa Soo Do but later adopted the name Tang Soo which when written is EXACTLY the same as KARATE Tang means China and Soo is Hand I understand some not wanting to use the term Karate, however those same people often use the term Tang Soo. The way I see it is that the term Karate means empty hand so as long as you are not useing weapons then the term applies. Its just spoken in a Japanese term. People just need to realize the term Karate is generic. Not specific like Soo Bahk Do, Tae Kwon Do, Hapkido, Jui-Jitsu, Aikido, IsinRyu JC _________________________________________________________________ Make every IM count. Download Messenger and join the i’m Initiative now. It’s free. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGHM_June07 --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 11:42:01 -0400 From: "Rick Clark" Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] (no subject) To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi JC, From: Gladewater SooBahkDo [mailto:gladewatersoobahkdo@msn.com] The way I see it is that the term Karate means empty hand so as long as you are not useing weapons then the term applies. Its just spoken in a Japanese term. People just need to realize the term Karate is generic. Not specific like Soo Bahk Do, Tae Kwon Do, Hapkido, Jui-Jitsu, Aikido, IsinRyu JC [ ] Perhaps I am wrong - but to me Tae Kwon Do is a generic term as is Aikido, Ju-jitsu, and I suspect Hapkido. For example I practice Tae Kwon Do Chung Do Kwan, others practice Tae Kwon Do O Do Kwan. In the same way that some practice Shotokan Karate, or Isshin Ryu Karate. Same for Ju-Jitsu and even Aikido, they make a distinction between Hombu style Aikido and Yoshinkan. As to Karate being only a style that does not use weapons, many styles of Karate use techniques from Kobudo. Rick Clark --__--__-- Message: 4 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 12:24:19 -0400 From: aburrese@aol.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Japanese vs Korean language Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Ray posted: They are not the same, I agree, but when you want to get people in the door you do what you must. ********************** This is so true.? Even if you look at The Trial of Billy Jack, the second movie in the series and the one where GM Han had a speaking roll, they called Hapkido Karate.? When Billy walked up and saw Jean training with GM Han, he asks "Karate?"? She corrects him and calls it Hapkido, in which he replied that he knew that but questioned her learning it.? Then both Billy and GM Han demonstrate cane techniques. I have an old Billy Jack screenplay at home too that has pictures from the movie and it calls Hapkido Korean Karate as well.? In general, Karate was known as an Asian martial art, so it was used for anything just so people would know what it was.? Chuck Norris was teaching "karate" after he came back from Korea with his Tang Soo Do black belt. Unfortunately, it is still done today for marketing reasons.? My new Hapkido Cane dvd set has "from the dojo to the street" in the title.? When I talked to Paladin about this and how Hapkido is Korean?and the correct term?would be?dojang rather than dojo, they said that for marketing, more people know the term dojo, and that is why they wanted it in the title rather than dojang.? I guess one good thing is that in the dvd I mention that dojang is Korean and dojo is Japanese, so I do know the difference.? :-)? I mention it when I almost call a Canemasters Dojo Cane a Dojang Cane because I am used to saying the Korean Dojang, and then I mention they mean the same.? Notice how Canemasters also used the more familiar Dojo for their training canes. So I agree Ray, they are not the same, but sometimes you have to do what you must if it is how you are trying to make a living. Yours in Training, Alain www.burrese.com ________________________________________________________________________ AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Joseph Cheavens" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 11:46:05 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Also, some of the original five kwan used the term Kong Soo Do - "kong" being the Korean pronunciation for the Chinese character for "empty." So, some used the "Way of the China Hand" and some used the "Way of the Empty Hand" pronunciation for Karate-do. I would guess that the choice of which one was used may have depended on when the particular kwan founder started studying Karate and under whom. Joe Cheavens -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gladewater SooBahkDo" Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] (no subject) Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 09:40:56 -0500 The use of the term Kara-Te. First lets look at the meaning of the word. Prior to 1936 in Okinawa the word or term "Kara" ment China and "Te" ment hand or China hand as a referrance that Okinawan martial arts had come from China. In 1936 Funikoshi chnaged the meaning of the term Kara to mean empty so that Karate meant Empty hand. Later after the Japanese occupation of Korea The original 5 Kwans sprang up. Hwang Kee originally called his style Hwa Soo Do but later adopted the name Tang Soo which when written is EXACTLY the same as KARATE Tang means China and Soo is Hand I understand some not wanting to use the term Karate, however those same people often use the term Tang Soo. The way I see it is that the term Karate means empty hand so as long as you are not useing weapons then the term applies. Its just spoken in a Japanese term. People just need to realize the term Karate is generic. Not specific like Soo Bahk Do, Tae Kwon Do, Hapkido, Jui-Jitsu, Aikido, IsinRyu JC _________________________________________________________________ Make every IM count. Download Messenger and join the i’m Initiative now. It’s free. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGHM_June07 _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Who's that on the Red Carpet? Play & win glamorous prizes. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 12:53:15 -0400 From: "Burdick, Dakin Robert" To: Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Turnverein Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi Folks, Glad to see Rick bringing up the influence of the Turnverein. I did some research on them for my dissertation and actually was at the first Turner fest since 1917 at Indianapolis in the early 1990s. IUPUI has large holdings on the turnverein, whose Normal School for Gymnastics was the origin of Indiana University's Physical Education program. Back in the 1940s, they still had a beer hall and bowling alley downstairs at the Phys Ed program at IUPUI. Now that's an education I could enjoy! :) Von Baelz and his influence on Kano is also discussed in my dissertation, which of course you can purchase through Dissertation Abstracts (hint hint). I guess I ought to get it out in book form sometime soon, huh? Take care, Dakin dakinburdick@yahoo.com [demime 0.98e removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Curt McCauley" To: Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 09:58:46 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Tang Soo Do and Belts. Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net yes, well, i got a good laugh the other night. was watching a show with my better half. it was a drama. the main female character was dating a "karate" teacher. he was a "sensei" who taught in a "dojo", taught the style of "tang soo do" and wore the traditional wrap jacket and gave japanese commands. :) mel In the early days of Karate. It was Kara Te Do. Kara = Tang Dynasty Character Te = Hand Do = The Way ( of course) Funikoshi Changed the first character from the "Tang" to the one that means "Empty" Both are pronounced the same. (Kara ) Seems that during this time in history a Japanese much less an Okinawan could loose his/her head by using terminology that would be pro Chinese. Funakoshi was a smart man. At the end of WW 2, when the 5 Jangs opened up under the different names some wrote the "old" way Tang Soo Do, to let prospective customers know that it was a Martial Arts school. If you mention the phrase Tang Soo Do to an older Korean they will strike one hand against the other and repeat "Tang Soo Do". Also During the 30+ years that Korea was under Japanese rule, only the Japanese language was allowed to be spoken in public. So at least one generation if not two grew up with Japanese terminology. Hence the use of words like Dojo and Sensei in some of the Korean arts, including some Tae Kwon Do schools. Many people could only write in the common japanese hand, and not what is called Han Ja in Korean and Kan Ji (I think) in japanese. These would be the "borrowed" Characters from the Chinese writing. Respectfully Submitted, Curt McCauley Chief Instructor Channel Town Soo Bahk Do --__--__-- Message: 8 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:06:37 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Subject: [The_Dojang] Karate Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net This is one that Webster clearly got right... karate One entry found for karate. Function: noun Etymology: Japanese, from kara empty + te hand : a Japanese art of self-defense employing hand strikes and kicks to disable or subdue an opponent Some will and do use it since it is such a well known word in the western world, but clearly it is not really a generic term. Karate is Japanese. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 12:43:33 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: belt stripes Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net According to my brother, an aikido teacher in Houston. They have only white belts before BB. No colored belts and no striping. It is a common in most traditional aikido dojo. In hapkido, at our dojang, we do not use striping either. Jere R. Hilland, Fargo, ND www.HapkidoSelfDefense.com <<>> --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Dugy" To: Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 14:34:49 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] why we wear stripes on our belts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hello J. Thomas Howard", Organization: Nebraska Hapkido Association To answer questions as to why we wear stripes on our belts in combat hapkido is as you have yourself answered as a possibility.We wear them as we learn a "different sections of the curriciulum learned, etc. " The stripes are just bands of colored electrical tape, usually the same color as the next belt you are working on.. you get one as you learn a different section of the curriculum for the belt you are working on. Also, on the other side, there are more stripes, these stripes denote that you have passed the exam for the previous belts. So say one has just earned his red belt. To have done this, he needs to get all his previous belts stripes (so he is re-tested in every belt prior to his achieved belt (red)), and as he passes, he is given a stripe with the color of that stripe the same color as the belt he passed untl he gets to his present belt,in this example, he would go as far as the brown belt. Then and only after he has passed his previous belts, can he test for his next belt. Meanwhile the re-testing is going on, we are given other sections of learning, such as rolling, kicking, grappling, boxing, etc.... by the end of the time period, 3-6 months, you must have your act together, that is, know your belt level and test. DougM Combat Hapkido --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 15:26:09 -0400 From: Tom To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] why we wear stripes on our belts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dugy, is this unique to your school? Do you know of other Combat Hapkido schools that use stripes? The Combat Hapkido school I attend does not use stripes on the belt except for Black Belts. Dugy wrote: > Hello J. Thomas Howard", > Organization: Nebraska Hapkido Association > > To answer questions as to why we wear stripes on our belts in combat hapkido > is as you have yourself answered as a possibility.We wear them as we learn a > "different sections of the curriciulum > learned, etc. " The stripes are just bands of colored electrical tape, > usually the same color as the next belt you are working on.. you get one as > you learn a different section of the curriculum for the belt you are working > on. Also, on the other side, there are more stripes, these stripes denote that > you have passed the exam for the previous belts. So say one has just earned > his red belt. To have done this, he needs to get all his previous belts > stripes (so he is re-tested in every belt prior to his achieved belt (red)), > and as he passes, he is given a stripe with the color of that stripe the same > color as the belt he passed untl he gets to his present belt,in this example, > he would go as far as the brown belt. Then and only after he has passed his > previous belts, can he test for his next belt. Meanwhile the re-testing is > going on, we are given other sections of learning, such as rolling, kicking, > grappling, boxing, etc.... by the end of the time period, 3-6 months, you must > have your act together, that is, know your belt level and test. > > DougM > Combat Hapkido > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:34:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Luther Veuleman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] battlecage Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net JC, I think I will try to make it to this upcoming event. Is there anything I can do for you guys over this way? If ya'll come up the night before, let me know. Do you have any idea if they are going to sell tickets early at a discounted price? Because my wife will want to go, it always costs me double. Charlie --__--__-- Message: 13 Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:34:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeremy Anderson Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: myth or truth? no sex while in training To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To my knowledge there've been no scientific studies done on the relationship between sex and athletic performance. Common sense would tell me that there's really no relationship, that it's all "myth." However, if you're sexually active the night before and that cuts into your sleep, then, obviously, your athletic performance is going to suffer. --- ChunjiDo@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/23/2007 9:55:59 AM Central Daylight Time, > the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > > Ok I have a serious question. I'm sure everyone has heard it if you've > participated in competitions before: No sex before a fight or while in > training. > Is this a real thing or just a myth? Does it really make you weak and > if so > why? is there factual evidence? > > Jye > > i've heard this, too, jye. its based on nietzsche philosophy, jung and > freudian psychology. its the idea of libido. jung sees it as a psychic > energy and > desire. there is a theory that one only has so much of this psychic > energy to > devote to any one activity. we commonly associate libido with sexual > activity. however, if one uses all this energy on one activity, he will > not have any > energy left for other activities which require a great deal of energy. > so...if you go screwing around the night before a fight, youre going to > spend all > your libido/energy on that and be too drained to fight well. > > take care, > melinda :) > > > Melinda Kidder, Owner > Chajonshim Martial Arts & Supply > Supply: _www.cjmas.com_ (http://www.cjmas.com/) 1.877.847.4072 > School: _www.cjmaa.com_ (http://www.cjmaa.com/) 1.573.445.6636 > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:36:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeremy Anderson Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: myth or truth? no sex while in training To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The idea of sex draining vital energy pre-dates Freud, Jung, and Nietzsche. During the European Rennaisance, the climax of the sex act was often refered to as the "Little Death" as it was thought that you lost some of your vital energy each time, bringing you closer to death. Both Hindu and Buddhist ascetic practices make a big deal out of the relationship between sex and vital energy. One common ascerity practiced to gain more spiritual power was sexual abstinence. Though some -- notably left-handed tantric -- paths, taught the opposite: that sex was a good way to gain spiritual power if done in the correct way. Jeremy Anderson. --- ChunjiDo@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/23/2007 9:55:59 AM Central Daylight Time, > the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > > Ok I have a serious question. I'm sure everyone has heard it if you've > participated in competitions before: No sex before a fight or while in > training. > Is this a real thing or just a myth? Does it really make you weak and > if so > why? is there factual evidence? > > Jye > > i've heard this, too, jye. its based on nietzsche philosophy, jung and > freudian psychology. its the idea of libido. jung sees it as a psychic > energy and > desire. there is a theory that one only has so much of this psychic > energy to > devote to any one activity. we commonly associate libido with sexual > activity. however, if one uses all this energy on one activity, he will > not have any > energy left for other activities which require a great deal of energy. > so...if you go screwing around the night before a fight, youre going to > spend all > your libido/energy on that and be too drained to fight well. > > take care, > melinda :) > > > Melinda Kidder, Owner > Chajonshim Martial Arts & Supply > Supply: _www.cjmas.com_ (http://www.cjmas.com/) 1.877.847.4072 > School: _www.cjmaa.com_ (http://www.cjmaa.com/) 1.573.445.6636 > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net > ____________________________________________________________________________________ 8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest