Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 02:48:21 +0200 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 14 #309 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,200 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Kidohwe (JR West) 2. Kido Hae (kwan jang) 3. Re: GM Hwang Kee (sidtkd@aol.com) 4. RE: Kidohwe (michael tomlinson) 5. korean culture question (freddie bishop) 6. Daehan KidoHwe (J R Hilland) 7. 2010 ETU chip to be in Azerbaijan (The_Dojang) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "JR West" To: Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:43:16 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Kidohwe Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Let me say a thing or two about this whole Kidohwe situation from my point of view....When all this first started to be discussed in Korea in 2000 with then Chairman Kim Jung Song, I made my point that I would do my best to make KDH certification very difficult to obtain, involving a visit to my school in MS or one of my senior student's schools around the country. We will want to see all dan certifications back to day one, and do our best to verify all we see, especially waht we see on the mat. In order to hold 4th dan or above, an applicant will have to attend a master's course, and to that end Dr. Kimm is currently translating the requirements to English so that I will have a firm grasp on exactly what is to be expected. As far as financial arrangements, I don't really care if I make any money from doing all this, I don't teach for the money (I haven't raised prices in my school for anything in almost 20 years), but mostly I am just tired of seeing no-talent pseudo-practitioners with high dan ranks. I want to be part of the solution and not part of the problem. As far as Hanmudo is concerned, that is Dr. Kimm's domain and he is free to promote whoever he sees fit, but my position is VP in charge of Hapkido, and if someone in Korea isn't happy with what I do, I'll be more than happy to go back to working within the USKMAF to accomplish these same goals on a smaller scale.........JRW --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "kwan jang" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 00:03:06 -0400 Subject: [The_Dojang] Kido Hae Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bruce writes: <> Hello Bruce: I most certainly did not "taut" any organization or person in my last post, and those who know me will also know that I rarely, if ever, "avoid" a good discussion. In fact, I do tend to be a bit of a pain when it comes to wading into whatever it is that I might help shed some light on. On the other hand, I DO tend to be a bit more subtle than you are lol. It is not that I am afraid to hurt someone's feelings, it is just that I rather allow people to save face if there is no need to rub someone's face in the dirt. In addition, I try to avoid "tunnel vision" because it is not popular to disagree with popular people. Whatever it is I say or suggest, I do from my heart without worrying about consequenses it may have on me or NKMAA (I think this is an old age thing Bruce lmao). As far as your observations are concerned, I am willing to bet that it is a bit more difficult to get rank in WKF than it might have been in the past. I see this as a result of GM Seo not quite trusting the bios of applicants. I have had the same problem with NKMAA, and it is indeed not an easy job to research an application. This can be a problem, especially if you are a person who believes good in people until proven otherwise. Sadly, I can attest that this trusting attitude has come back to bite me. Sad also when you can't take a person for his/her word. You have, for some years now, spoken out about some sort of standardization in Hap Ki Do, and that would help immensely when it comes to certification; however, this also brings about the problem of WHERE IS THE CUT OFF. What IS acceptable, what IS taken into account (such as age, fitness, gender, etc. etc., and who IS the person deciding? Don't ask to get a consensus, as you well know that will NEVER happen in Hap Ki Do. Heck, we can't even get along long enough to have a decent discussion most of the time. So how have I personally dealt with that in NKMAA??? Simple... I go with what I personally believe is right, I take into consideration a lot of things, and I try not to let politics get in the way of what I decide. How do others decide? I simply do not care, as there is NOTHING I can personally do about it. Do I judge them? Heck no... I have problems enough dealing with my own decisions to worry about the decisions others make. See, I believe that things will take care of themselves if given long enough time. If an organization continues to hand out undeserving certificates, it will surely become known. This fact will influence others into making a decision about the organization... good or bad. When enough bad goes around, the organization will surely die for lack of business. No one wants a certificate from an organization that has nothing but buffoons in their ranks. A few we may put up with and delegate to an error in judgement or lack of proper information. Too many, and the poop hits the fan. How do we decide who is acceptable or not? The reality is that we ALL get old, and we all may suffer problems of some sort that make us less agile than we once were. For many folks this means that you should hang up your belt. Some recognize that age and deminished performance due to physical problems does not mean there is nothing to learn from whomever it is that no longer fits the profile of a model martial artist. I for one am glad of that, and I dare say others will when THEY mature in age and fail to meet the standards they themselves might have once set. Like I said, we all get older, but how we LIVE with age is a personal choice. I decided to live my life to the fullest(including teaching martial arts), regardless of what some folks say about me or my skills. How does this fit in with the discussion? Well, age an personal abilities (or lack thereof) are just SOME of the things people will have to deal with when looking over applications. I can tell you from personal experience that making decisions on who passes and who fails is something I'd rather not do. Alas, someone HAS to step up to the plate and deal with the masses who never made a decision in their entire life (while sitting on the sidelines and throw stones at those who do). Last thing to ponder is money. If there is ONE MAN or woman here who would rather starve than charge a reasonable amount for services rendered I would not only be surprised... I would be floored. We ALL need to make a living, and organizations MUST cover expenses to survive. Those who think that martial arts is different and somehow more honorable are living in a dream. At NO time did anyone ever teach, certify, or render services full time without charging a fee of some sort. Even if you accept a handout designed to keep you alive long enough to have folks learn another lesson from you, it IS a fee. IMHO, only the most ignorant and selfish people will allow their instructor to live like that, and only those who have an income from other sources think that charging a fee for services rendered is somehow a degradation of martial arts. The alternative??? Easy... we ALL shed our belts and burn our certificates. All we really need is to "play" on the mat. Anyone want to start with this easy fix? Rudy --__--__-- Message: 3 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:20:00 -0400 From: sidtkd@aol.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: GM Hwang Kee Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I met Hwang Kee in 1963. At that time he only mentioned Moodukkwan TangSoo Do.? Don't know what was in the works,but that name stuck until about 1969 when his senior students moved over to TKD. About half stayed with Moodukkwan. Sid ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com --__--__-- Message: 4 From: michael tomlinson To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Kidohwe Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 16:13:34 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net There it is folks....plain and simple...I couldn't agree or respect GM West anymore then I already do.. IMHO...put the plan in the hands of the people that lead from the mat and when you open their closet you ain't knocked out cold by all the skeletons falling out on you....I personally think in the long run you can't ask for anything more.... Michael Tomlinson> From: hapkido@netdoor.com> To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:43:16 -0500> Subject: [The_Dojang] Kidohwe> > Let me say a thing or two about this whole Kidohwe situation from my > point of view....When all this first started to be discussed in Korea in > 2000 with then Chairman Kim Jung Song, I made my point that I would do my > best to make KDH certification very difficult to obtain, involving a visit > to my school in MS or one of my senior student's schools around the country. > We will want to see all dan certifications back to day one, and do our best > to verify all we see, especially waht we see on the mat. In order to hold > 4th dan or above, an applicant will have to attend a master's course, and to > that end Dr. Kimm is currently translating the requirements to English so > that I will have a firm grasp on exactly what is to be expected. As far as > financial arrangements, I don't really care if I make any money from doing > all this, I don't teach for the money (I haven't raised prices in my school > for anything in almost 20 years), but mostly I am just tired of seeing > no-talent pseudo-practitioners with high dan ranks. I want to be part of > the solution and not part of the problem. As far as Hanmudo is concerned, > that is Dr. Kimm's domain and he is free to promote whoever he sees fit, but > my position is VP in charge of Hapkido, and if someone in Korea isn't happy > with what I do, I'll be more than happy to go back to working within the > USKMAF to accomplish these same goals on a smaller scale.........JRW > _______________________________________________> The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members> The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net> Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource> Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net _________________________________________________________________ Peek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You! http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 14:16:54 -0700 (PDT) From: freddie bishop To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] korean culture question Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear Anyone Is there ever a time when a Korean man would change his name? A master I once new is now going by a different name. Fred __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 15:55:22 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Daehan KidoHwe Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net New organization? On September 2, 1963, the Korean government granted a Charter to the Daehan KidoHwe (Korea Kido Association). The first chairman of the Daehan KidoHwe was the founder of hapkido, Choi Young Sul. Note: the Daehan KidoHwe has no current relationship with the private group in California known as the World Kido Federation. Jere R. Hilland, Fargo, ND www.HapkidoSelfDefense.com <<>> --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 14:43:37 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] 2010 ETU chip to be in Azerbaijan Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net 25.10.2007 European Taekwondo Championship -2010 to be Held in Baku Trend News Agency Azerbaijan, Baku / Trend corr. B.Mammadov / European Taekwondo Championship -2010 will be held in Azerbaijan. The decision was made during the meeting of the European Taekwondo Union (ETU) meeting on 25 October. Azerbaijan nominated its candidature during the General Assembly held in Baku. Afanasios Pragalos was re-elected the president of the organization during the General Assembly. Pragalos has been taken the position since 1999. Earlier Pragalos was the Generally Secretary of ETU. Fizuli Musayev, the current president of the Azerbaijani Taekwondo Federation, may to be re-elected to the position. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest