Date: Sun, 04 Nov 2007 01:42:00 +0100 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 14 #317 - 11 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,200 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Korean martial arts Sensei ? (Don Kirsch) 2. Re: Korean martial arts Sensei ? (Ronnielynchburg@aol.com) 3. Re: Korean martial arts Sensei ? (Jye nigma) 4. Re: Korean martial arts Sensei ? (Ray) 5. Re: Korean martial arts Sensei ? (Ray) 6. Re: Korean martial arts Sensei ? (Jye nigma) 7. KIDOHAE Redux (Bruce Sims) 8. RE: Korean martial arts Sensei ? (michael tomlinson) 9. Re: KIDOHAE Redux (Ray) 10. U.S. National Taekwondo Poomsae Team (The_Dojang) 11. Re: video clip:circle of death (J F) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Don Kirsch" To: "the_dojang" Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 22:02:44 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Blankenship I've seen you post a couple of times now referring to your "sensei" and signing your post as sensei. Just curious how the term "sensei" and Korean martial arts are related? Regards, Don Kirsch --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Ronnielynchburg@aol.com Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 00:17:47 EDT Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The history of every modern Korean martial art starts after the Japanese occupation (1910–1945), and was heavily influenced by Japanese martial arts. These Japanese arts were introduced to Korea during the occupation or brought to _Korea_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korea) by Koreans who had studied in Japan. (Korean martial arts were banned.) After the occupation, Korean masters claimed linkage to traditional Korean martial arts like subak and denied any connection with Japanese martial arts, mostly because of the bitterness Koreans felt for the Japanese, especially in the first few decades after the _occupation_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korea_under_Japanese_rule) . Much of Korea's martial heritage was lost during the 1910–1945 _Japanese occupation of Korea_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_occupation_of_Korea) . During the late Joseon period, traditional Korean martial arts were not popular because neo-Confucian doctrine advocated academics rather than martial practice. After the Japanese occupation, new Korean martial arts like hapkido and taekwondo blossomed, and interest in Korea's own ancient martial traditions grew. Although the influence of Japanese martial arts is undeniable and still existent, many modern Korean martial arts have diverged from their Japanese counterparts. Ancient books like the Mu Ye Do Bo Tong Ji became popular study material for Korean martial artists, and influenced the development of many modern Korean martial arts. For example, Koreans who had studied Japanese kendo during the colonization period studied the Mu Ye Do Bo Tong Ji to rediscover their own cultural heritage and recreated the traditional Korean martial arts. Historically, a number of Japanese martial arts came from or were influenced by Korea, thus many Japanese martial arts could be viewed as having roots in Korea. Korean nationalists would argue that just as the Japanese turned the martial techniques of older ages into something distinctively Japanese, so the Koreans took the Japanese arts and turn them into something that suited their needs. Although martial arts like _taekwondo_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taekwondo) (태권도) and _tangsudo_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tangsudo) ( 당수도) have their roots in _karate_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karate) , they have taken their own route of development and transformed into unique Korean martial arts. In a similar manner, hapkido (합기도) developed from Daito Ryu ( 大東流), but also with influences from traditional Korean and Chinese martial arts, into a distinctively Korean martial art. I guess you prefere the term Sabumnim (사범님 / 師範님): teacher. You see at our dojo(sorry Dojang), we use Sensei, We teach traditional martial arts with history and theory just like most others, but if you teach history of martial arts, then I feel that you must teach all history of martial arts as far back as possible. I hope this help everyone understand, thank you for your question Sir, I welcome comments and other questions, Yours in the Arts, Sensei Blankenship Red Dragon School of Korean Martial Arts Tong Moo Kwon / Hapkido ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:54:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I wondered the same thing. Jye Don Kirsch wrote: Mr. Blankenship I've seen you post a couple of times now referring to your "sensei" and signing your post as sensei. Just curious how the term "sensei" and Korean martial arts are related? Regards, Don Kirsch _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 08:20:57 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > You see at our dojo(sorry Dojang), we use Sensei, We teach traditional > martial arts with history and theory just like most others, but if you teach > history of martial arts, then I feel that you must teach all history of > martial arts as far back as possible. > I hope this help everyone understand, thank you for your question Sir, I > welcome comments and other questions, No, sorry, it is still unclear. History, sure, no problem. Everyone here is aware of the history. Actually if you like history then maybe you should be using the term Sifo or perhaps Guru. Using purely Japanese terms in the KMAs insults those in the Korean arts and is a poor example to your students. It is just that simple. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net (The_Dojang) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 08:52:43 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > if you like history then maybe you should be using the term Sifo or perhaps > Guru. Sorry, typo. Sifu. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 09:53:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net In my opinion, sensei still is not the correct term for Korean arts, just like sifu isn't the proper term for japanese arts. So basically if you teach KMA and use japanese titles do you also speak japanese in class? Jye Ronnielynchburg@aol.com wrote: The history of every modern Korean martial art starts after the Japanese occupation (1910–1945), and was heavily influenced by Japanese martial arts. These Japanese arts were introduced to Korea during the occupation or brought to _Korea_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korea) by Koreans who had studied in Japan. (Korean martial arts were banned.) After the occupation, Korean masters claimed linkage to traditional Korean martial arts like subak and denied any connection with Japanese martial arts, mostly because of the bitterness Koreans felt for the Japanese, especially in the first few decades after the _occupation_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korea_under_Japanese_rule) . Much of Korea's martial heritage was lost during the 1910–1945 _Japanese occupation of Korea_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_occupation_of_Korea) . During the late Joseon period, traditional Korean martial arts were not popular because neo-Confucian doctrine advocated academics rather than martial practice. After the Japanese occupation, new Korean martial arts like hapkido and taekwondo blossomed, and interest in Korea's own ancient martial traditions grew. Although the influence of Japanese martial arts is undeniable and still existent, many modern Korean martial arts have diverged from their Japanese counterparts. Ancient books like the Mu Ye Do Bo Tong Ji became popular study material for Korean martial artists, and influenced the development of many modern Korean martial arts. For example, Koreans who had studied Japanese kendo during the colonization period studied the Mu Ye Do Bo Tong Ji to rediscover their own cultural heritage and recreated the traditional Korean martial arts. Historically, a number of Japanese martial arts came from or were influenced by Korea, thus many Japanese martial arts could be viewed as having roots in Korea. Korean nationalists would argue that just as the Japanese turned the martial techniques of older ages into something distinctively Japanese, so the Koreans took the Japanese arts and turn them into something that suited their needs. Although martial arts like _taekwondo_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taekwondo) (태권도) and _tangsudo_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tangsudo) ( 당수도) have their roots in _karate_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karate) , they have taken their own route of development and transformed into unique Korean martial arts. In a similar manner, hapkido (합기도) developed from Daito Ryu ( 大東流), but also with influences from traditional Korean and Chinese martial arts, into a distinctively Korean martial art. I guess you prefere the term Sabumnim (사범님 / 師範님): teacher. You see at our dojo(sorry Dojang), we use Sensei, We teach traditional martial arts with history and theory just like most others, but if you teach history of martial arts, then I feel that you must teach all history of martial arts as far back as possible. I hope this help everyone understand, thank you for your question Sir, I welcome comments and other questions, Yours in the Arts, Sensei Blankenship Red Dragon School of Korean Martial Arts Tong Moo Kwon / Hapkido ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:39:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Bruce Sims To: Ray Terry Subject: [The_Dojang] KIDOHAE Redux Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Dear JR: I think in an effort to be as diplomatic as utterly possible my question might have gone over people heads, so I will try this one more time and try not to be quite so obscure. Congratulations on the efforts of you and Dr. Kimm to bring the KIDOHAE to the US. I understand that the KIDOHAE for we Americans will not be identical to that promoted in Korea, and thats just fine. When I asked what services the KIDOHAE will be providing I was hoping you would share exactly that. Absent that response, I will ask very clearly whether or not the KIDOHAE will effectively be a simple front organization for Dr. Kimms HAN MU DO, the way the WHRDA is a front organization for LEE Joo Bangs UM-YANG material, or the way that SEO In Suns WKA is essentially a front organization for his HANMINJEOK Hapkido? Its not that I have an issue with this if it is so. Rather, I think it would be nice if a.) People come right up front and say so and b.) The Hapkido community is informed how candidates will be assessed if they do not desire to practice HANMUDO and c.) What becomes of people who are accepted to the KIDOHAE but elect NOT to train in HAN MU DO? Thoughts? Best Wishes, Bruce --__--__-- Message: 8 From: michael tomlinson To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ? Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 17:50:01 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Blankenship writes:The history of every modern Korean martial art starts after the Japaneseoccupation (1910–1945), and was heavily influenced by Japanese martialarts.These Japanese arts were introduced to Korea during the occupation or broughtto_Korea>>Well, if you go further back into history you will realize that the Hwarang existed at least 700 years before the Samurai, and Korea was actually instrumental in bringing Martial Arts and Buddhism to Japan....Buddhism traveled from China to Manchuria, to Korea and then to Japan...it is a natural migration..Korea had goodwill ambassadors and buddhist monks in Japan way way way before the timeline you stated...so in essence if I take your premise that you study proper history then maybe the Japanese should call themselves Sabum instead of Sensei in the end IMHO once you start going back in time you can't stop where it matches your beliefs to buttress your stanceyou have to study the entire chain and call it what it is...this is the land of the free and the home of the whoever you want to be...soooo call it what you wantbut I agree with Ray that if you are teaching KMA's then you owe your students to atleast not confuse them....my two cents anywho...call me whatever...but never call melate for dinner!!!! Michael Tomlinson> Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Korean martial arts Sensei ?> To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net> Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 08:52:43 -0700> From: rterry@idiom.com> > > if you like history then maybe you should be using the term Sifo or perhaps> > Guru.> > Sorry, typo. Sifu.> > Ray Terry> rterry@idiom.com> _______________________________________________> The_Dojang mailing list, 2,200 members> The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net> Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource> Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook together at last. Get it now. --__--__-- Message: 9 Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] KIDOHAE Redux To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:53:17 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > I think in an effort to be as diplomatic as utterly possible my question > might have gone over people heads, so I will try this one more time and > try not to be quite so obscure. Check Master West's comments of Oct 24 in issue #309. Does that not answer at least most of your questions? Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 11:19:36 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] U.S. National Taekwondo Poomsae Team Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net U.S. National Taekwondo Poomsae Team Arrives in Korea November 2, 2007 SEOUL, SOUTH KOREAThe U.S. National Taekwondo Poomsae Team arrived in Incheon, South Korea, on Thursday, November 1st to compete at the 2nd WTF World Taekwondo Poomsae Championships. Led by Grandmaster Chan-Yong Kim (Head of Team), Team Manager Randy Chambliss, and Coaches Bob Maves and Dr. Misha Thackrey, the U.S. Team is readying for the competition which runs from November 4 6 in the Incheon Samsan World Gym. Representing the U.S.A. in individual, pair, and team divisions are Jeff Anderson, Natalie Baker, Apri Bondurant, Robert Bradford, Christi Burke-Maves, Barbara Brand, Randy Chambliss, Dure Chang, Matthew Dunlap, Jason Hwang, Young-A Kim, Anthony Nguyen, Johnny Nguyen, Thac Nguyen, Jim Null, Lauren Overs, Akiko Reyes, Noreen Thackrey, Reggie Ubiadas, and Thomas Vo. The U.S. Team is also receiving special on-site support and assistance from USAT Martial Art Commissioners Joon P. Choi, Hong Kong Kim, Jhoon Rhee, Kyu Il Cho, Sang Ho Cho, Il Joo Kim, Myung Kwan Kim, Han Joo Kim, Jay Sok Lee, Young Sook Kim, Jae Hak Lee, Beom Jhoo Lee, Won Yang Park, Ho Chul Kwak, Seung Woong Kim, Kyu Seok Lee, Seung Kuk Lee, Kyu Hyung Lee, Kyoung Myoung Lee, and from USAT CEO David Askinas. --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 16:06:23 -0700 (PDT) From: J F Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] video clip:circle of death To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I watched the video of the guy that was asthmatic. I just recieved my 1st Dan in WTF TKD after almost three years of hard work. My challenge is that I had my colon removed in 2003 after a 2 year "battle" with ulcerative colitis (closely related to Crohn's disease). As a result of that, I have to wear an "appliance" (as I choose to think of it) for the rest of my life. (I remember asking my surgeon about any activity after recovering from surgery. He said with a grin,..."well, I probably wouldn't take up boxing!" I emailed him a picture with my brand new Black Belt recently and he said that not everyone's post-surgical life has such a successful story.) Before I started training, I explained this to my Master and asked that I not be treated any differently than any other student. Before Black Belt testing in September, I reminded the Master that I may need to make a couple of trips to the restroom during the five-plus hours of testing. He had forgotten about my situation and commended me on my dedication and hard work. I commend Sensei Blankenship for his service to his students and the grace he gives to those in need. That may not be a tenet of our beloved art of Tae Kwon Do, but I certainly consider it in the spirit of the art. My point? Reality has a different perspective for each one of us. If the guy needs a breath after 30 seconds,...so be it. Sorry for the ramble. Tae Kwon Do saved my life. My only regret is that I didn't start training earlier in life. At 42, I'll go as long as this body will let me. Tae Kwon, Jeff Finley Easley, SC __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest