Date: Tue, 01 Jul 2008 02:48:22 +0200 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 15 #172 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. TKD tech (Ray) 2. From another group....Why the MMA is not an Olympic sport (Jye nigma) 3. Re: Forms are Fun!!! (Jye nigma) 4. RE: new poomsae (Jye nigma) 5. KSW video clip (Jye nigma) 6. Mali's Olympic Dream (The_Dojang) 7. testing (The_Dojang) 8. Hapkido (aburrese@aol.com) 9. List slow or down (Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Ray To: The_Dojang Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2008 16:37:37 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] TKD tech Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Taekwondo: Martial art takes technological turn Hayden Meikle 30 Jun 2008 New Zealand Taekwondo has embraced the electronic age to make its sport simpler. The Korean martial art has long entrusted judging to the human eye. Two fighters roam the ring and four judges are positioned around the edges to note when clean hits are made. But now, taekwondo is going high-tech. Competitors and spectators at the South Island WTF championships in Dunedin on Saturday got their first look at electronic chest pads which may revolutionise the sport. "We're pretty excited about it. It's the future of the sport, basically," Green Island Taekwondo Club instructor Grant Beel said. "It takes the human element right out of the scoring side of things. You have to hit the pad with significant force. "That creates an electronic pulse, which goes back to the computer and scores the point." Beel said human judges often missed clean hits. In a system similar to boxing, three of the four judges have to register a hit by either fighter for a point to be awarded. The electronic pads can be set according the ability of the fighter, so a flyweight will not have to hit them as hard as a heavyweight in order to score a point. The pads will likely be used at the next Oceania championships, expected to be held in Auckland at the end of the year. Saturday's tournament was held under the WTF and Olympic rules, involving full-contact sparring over three 2min rounds. The upset of the day was in the senior women's flyweight, where rising star Hayley Schofield (Wellington) beat New Zealand representative Aroha Miller (Christchurch). Tneal Wilson (Blenheim) chalked up three straight wins in the junior women's lightweight and beat Tylah Bruce (Dunedin) in the final, while Oceania champion Dafydd Sanders (Auckland) easily won the men's heavyweight crown. The best Dunedin fighter was Cody Jeffery (Green Island), who claimed the junior black belt middleweight title, with a third-round knockout against Dallas Carr (New Brighton). Taekwondo New Zealand secretary-general Matt Ransom was delighted with the city's response to hosting the South Island tournament. --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2008 17:34:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] From another group....Why the MMA is not an Olympic sport Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I saw this in another group and thought what he said was interesting. I have not clue if he's correct or not, still an interesting read:   Michael, You make a very respectable point.  You're obviously a proponent for MMA in the Olympics.  I think you will see it in the Olympics, just not anytime soon... and it has nothing to do with the reasons you mentioned below with "savagery".  People write a lot of stuff on the internet and don't really know what they're talking about.  When it comes to the Olympics, they assume that the IOC is to blame. Here is the reason why MMA is not an Olympic sport.  In order for a sport to be in the Olympics, there needs to be a unified association for the sport.  MMA is still in it's infancy with this, but is coming along.  The reason why I say it won't be anytime soon is because other countries need to have this, not just the US.  In fact, 75 other countries must demonstrate that MMA has a unified association. Do remember, MMA is the most popular in the USA.  Head to our southern neighbors in Mexico and South America, who I might add are combat enthusiasts, are still very much into boxing, not MMA. Another example is football.  Football is bigger than MMA worldwide, but still cannot get into the Olympics because of the lack of unification in other countries. So... don't take it personal:).  The day will come, it's just a matter of when. Respectfully, Duncan Richardson Chief Master Instructor www.SucceedinMartialArts.com --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2008 18:07:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Forms are Fun!!! To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net There was a time when I thought forms where pointless...most likely because of my TKD forms, very robotic very stiff. But later on I learned that learning the meaning of movements peeked my interest and dissecting the form to extract new meanings is fun too.   Jye --- On Sat, 6/28/08, Ed and Mikes wrote: From: Ed and Mikes Subject: [The_Dojang] Forms are Fun!!! To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Saturday, June 28, 2008, 9:04 PM I practice the Taguk forms and am now learning palguay ( I think I spelled it correctly) But the point I want to make is that these forms have practical application, and why are forms fun??? Well, you can do them by count for focus, you can do them very slow adjusting every stance and hand movement for a strength exercise, you can do them on your own with intensity of each movement as though you are fighting or breaking boards with every move. You can do them all without stoping for endurance, and close your eyes for precision, you can do them outside, in a parking lot, an un even parking lot with sneekers, with work boots, or in a field or on a beach in sand... the forms fun list is endless! and.... as a 3rd degree, and 50, I just do them once with intensity, well over 300 moves.I prefer doing each three different ways when I pratice. My body likes forms! Oh, and there is that constant drive towards perfection. Forms never grow old. Forms are FUN! sandy _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2008 18:04:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] new poomsae To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net In my opinion the importance of forms are seen more so in the older systems. The reason I say that is because the forms had meanings for the movements. Sometimes the movements were "hidden" meaning not so clearly noticeable. For instance, everyone in any KMA has the forward stance (where the front leg is bent and the rear leg is straight) in their forms. Very common stance in KMA and most MAs. But if you take a poll in your class and even amongst your most advanced students how many will say that stance can be used to attack your opponent's lower body- knees,shins, etc? The answer I'm willing to bet is few to none.   That stance that we've all seen used etc, can be used to attack your opponent's lower body. Can be used to lock up your opponent's movement, attacking the shin, breaking the knee etc. This type of info is what is transmitted through forms...providing you have a teacher who has learned the meaning(s) and continues to pass them on to others. Now if we put it into perspective, think of a form and the interpretation of the form being exchanged from person to person like the old word game where you take a word and try to make as many words from that word as you possibly can. Ok well in that word game, you can only 'see' so many words, and the next guy can only 'see' so many and then the next guy and so on and so forth. Well if you exchange papers you'll be like "Oh, I didn't see that one!" This is the same thing that has happened with forms being passed on throughout the years. The creator of the system only 'saw' these applications for the movements, but the next master saw those plus some of their own, etc  So the point is for the new forms alot of that is missing.    Jye  --- On Sat, 6/28/08, Rick Clark wrote: I think one of the key questions in this is why is the new form being created? I think you are exactly right on this point, and I would like to add what is the skill level/understanding of forms that the person has when they "create" new forms. But at the base of this point for me is - what is the purpose of forms that were created 100 or more years ago - not the modern ones. Is it for competition, to play to the strengths of the martial artist performing? In this case would your call them forms or a routine? For me forms have a specific meaning and purpose - if you create something specific for competition then I would argue there is a difference between the two. Is it an exercise for a student as part of a black belt test? (I have never heard of anyone doing this, but when I reach the rank where I feel comfortably starting my own school, I will probably do this.) I have heard of people having their students make up a form for black belt and early on I thought this might be a good idea - but as I had more experience in the martial arts and developed a different understanding of forms I discarded this idea. Is this the attempt by a teacher to blend things learned from various sources? Perhaps - or in the case of the Korean arts an attempt to distance their developing art from the Japanese and Okinawan roots and to build up a myth of the "ancient" history of Tae Kwon Do. I think forms are crucial to martial arts. Whether the forms are the Pyong Ahn/Heian, the Chang Hon, or a kung fu set, they can have as much or as little impact on a student as the teacher desires. Or as much or little impact on the students as the knowledge of their instructor has on forms. In terms of writing a form, I like to liken it to writing a story, with a beginning/middle/end. I really don't understand this point - could you expand on what you mean by this? Even for Open Forms/Musical Forms I incorporate moves and combinations, which have actual martial arts applications. But then again, That's my personal favorite part. Is this really a form or more of a acrobatic or gymnastic routine utilizing movements based on the martial arts? If a form is written to entertain, or showcase talent, as part of competition, it is more or less an athletic demonstration. I would agree with this but from my perspective on forms would rather have a different word used than "form". For me forms are very specific and serve a defined purpose. Forms were designed in an era where literacy was low, availability of books were limited, and of course there were no DVD's, movies, and the instructor had limited numbers of students. Unlike today when instructors may have taught literally thousands of students. For me forms were and are a method of transmitting the essential techniques of a particular style of martial art's defensive techniques. To me forms are the heart and soul of a martial art - it's absolutely essential that a person understand and master (or attempt to master) the forms. Rick Clark Erik -----Original Message----- From: Jye nigma [mailto:kingjye@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 8:56 PM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] new poomsae One thing I noticed about some made up forms is the lack of meanings in the movements. I think some people who have created forms desired to have flow like in kung fu, and what they developed was meaningless movements that are truly flowery moves. Jye --------Original Message----------------------------------------------------- HYung's ,Tuls,poomsae,or kata.What was wrong with doing the pinian forms after all didnt most korean Martial artist just copy and change these forms?I practice the chang han forms(thats what my school taught) but I am not so blind as to realize that general choi and nae ham tae just took what Won Kuk Lee taught and mixed them up and " created all new forms". _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2008 18:23:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] KSW video clip Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net This was nicely done! I'll tell you KSW is on my list for systems with terrible forms (sorry guys) but I have to admit, the way this video was shot and edited it made the little snippets looking very good. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUNv5FhtRL0&feature=related   I remember seeing a video of a KSW woman weilding butterfly swords and a KSW man wielding a spear or staff, and they were doing a 2 man set, I wanted to cry because the way she was using those butterfly swords wasn't on point. My prefered weapon happens to be butterfly swords and the form I used to train for butterfly swords stemmed from choy lay fut; which really put those monsters to use, so to see how they were being used in that demo or form was sad to me. it's like watching a lamborghini being used to drive only 5 miles per hour.   Jye. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 09:29:41 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Mali's Olympic Dream Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Keita Looks to Kick-start Mali's Olympic Dream 30 Jun 2008 http://www.olympic.org Series on Olympic Scholarship Holders Beijing 2008: today Daba Modibo Keita. In the early 1960s, Taekwondo Master Kim Young Tae travelled to Ivory Coast to bring the Korean martial art to Western Africa; at the end of the 1960s, one of his students took it upon himself to spread the word in neighbouring Mali. Forty years later, taekwondo is the most popular sport in that country, and Daba Modibo Keita has a realistic chance of winning Mali's first-ever Olympic medal in Beijing this summer. Hopes of a nation With over 150 clubs and 500 black belts among 15,000 exponents, taekwondo's popularity has taken on phenomenal proportions in a country that is Africa's seventh largest but one of the world's poorest. Keita knows he carries the hopes of a nation into the Olympic arena, but breaking new ground for his country should hold few fears for him as last year, despite a torn back muscle, he became Mali's first ever world champion. "Almost unthinkable" "Winning the world title was almost unthinkable for an African, or someone from a developing nation," said Keita, who was born in Ivory Coast but moved with his family to Mali in 2000. He is one of three brothers who practise taekwondo - for good measure two of his five sisters are blue belts. "I know the whole of Mali is hoping and praying Modibo brings back the first Olympic gold medal in its history," he says. Olympic Solidarity support After spending two years in France, Keita now trains in Virginia, USA. "I've received Olympic Solidarity support since 2005 and it's thanks to this scholarship that I'm world champion and have qualified for the Olympic Games," he says. "It's helped me enormously, and it helps all African athletes. Given the same conditions, there are many others who could compete with those from more developed regions." "Africa needs this medal" For the time being the spotlight is firmly on Keita, and he has no intention of letting the moment pass him by. "For any athlete the Olympic Games is a dream," he said. "It's the highest summit in sport. I've already won something just by going to the Games, first to represent my country, then the whole of Africa. Because Africa really needs this medal." (Story from the official Web site of the IOC on May 29, 2008) --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 14:06:04 -0700 From: The_Dojang To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] testing Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The WTF conducts out-of-competition testing From: World Taekwondo Federation Newsletter - June 2008 The WTF has been conducting out-of-competition testing since the beginning of June this year on national teams that have gone for overseas training. This is the first time that the WTF has initiated an out-of-competition testing program, and it reaffirms WTF's clear and strong stance on anti-doping to make sure that no taekwondo athlete is involved in doping practices. The federation has already adopted the 2009 edition of the World Anti-Doping Code in early May this year, making the WTF the second international federation who adopted the Code, and revised its anti-doping rules based on WADA's new code. --__--__-- Message: 8 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 18:59:09 -0400 From: aburrese@aol.com Subject: [The_Dojang] Hapkido Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net A little something I wrote about Hapkido that some might find interesting: http://martialminute.blogspot.com/ Alain www.burrese.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray To: The_Dojang Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 16:13:39 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] List slow or down Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The list will be slow or down until next week. Headed off to Hawaii to look for Sin Moo Dojangs. Have a safe & fun 4th (esp to those in the US). Ray Terry thedojang@sbcglobal.net --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest